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Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

  • Yes

    Votes: 68 54.4%

  • No

    Votes: 57 45.6%
  • Total voters
    125
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Clearly? Show me where it says that. Show me where it even implies that. Show me where the word 'god' is used by only Christians and Jews. (In fact Jews don't ever say the word "God" directly prefering G-d or YHWH.)
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Well he cant do that.

There is no meaning of God specified so it has nothing to do with the meaning of anybody's God.
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Bingo so there should be no argument.
 
Also how come no one has answered why in the last 50 yrs when god has been removed from our schools that teen pregnancy, sex before marriage, drug use, domestic crimes, and school shootings have gone up extensively? Hmmm.. no answer? Or I suppose the excuse for this one will be that this has nothing to do with god.

O really? Well then tell me how come that when the very first people who came to america(pilgrims) implemented god in the school system and for over almost 400yrs we havent had these problems we now have today in the last 50yrs? Explain that astounding thing to me?
 
SKILMATIC said:
Also how come no one has answered why in the last 50 yrs when god has been removed from our schools that teen pregnancy, sex before marriage, drug use, domestic crimes, and school shootings have gone up extensively? Hmmm.. no answer? Or I suppose the excuse for this one will be that this has nothing to do with god.

O really? Well then tell me how come that when the very first people who came to america(pilgrims) implemented god in the school system and for over almost 400yrs we havent had these problems we now have today in the last 50yrs? Explain that astounding thing to me?
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:roll: Really, you have direct correlations to any of those things? One could also say since we've removed god from our schools that we've been able to defeat Russia, land on the moon, create the internet, and have a republican president.
 
SKILMATIC said:
Also how come no one has answered why in the last 50 yrs when god has been removed from our schools that teen pregnancy, sex before marriage, drug use, domestic crimes, and school shootings have gone up extensively? Hmmm.. no answer? Or I suppose the excuse for this one will be that this has nothing to do with god.

O really? Well then tell me how come that when the very first people who came to america(pilgrims) implemented god in the school system and for over almost 400yrs we havent had these problems we now have today in the last 50yrs? Explain that astounding thing to me?
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Societies change? Sorry yo, I'm a big fan of sex before marriage. There's no way you're convincing me that it's wrong.

And I blame TV. Makes just as much sense as a lack of god. Please tell me that you don't believe that everything that's wrong with our society is a lack of god. Makes about as much sense when some libs claim everything is Bush's fault.
 
Societies change? Sorry yo, I'm a big fan of sex before marriage. There's no way you're convincing me that it's wrong.
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Im not claiming that its morally wrong. I am just claiming that it also has alot to do with poverty and to denounce that fact is retarded which goes back to the reason why people are complaining about katrina. And I am a big supporter of sex too(especially after the first date, hehe), remember what happened in the cab? HEHE

Please tell me that you don't believe that everything that's wrong with our society is a lack of god.
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No but I beleive its a huge reson why.

Makes about as much sense when some libs claim everything is Bush's fault.
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And you people do this and you just said yourself that its rediculous. So why then continue to do something you know in the back of your mind that its rediculous? Did someone say Hypocrisy?
 
Really, you have direct correlations to any of those things?
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If almost 400yrs of not having these problems and all the sudden when we remove god out of schools is when we have these problems and you have the adacity to ask me is there any sort of correlation? I REALLY DONT KNOW HOW TO DEFINE CORRELATION ANY BETTER TO YOU PEOPLE. Theres no correlation? Really? 400yrs isnt correlation? Thats a funny remark
 
AlbqOwl said:
Clearly? Show me where it says that. Show me where it even implies that. Show me where the word 'god' is used by only Christians and Jews. (In fact Jews don't ever say the word "God" directly prefering G-d or YHWH.)

Further there is nothing in the Constitution that prohibits religion. It is definitely in the Consitution that religion may not be prohibited. What religion or requirement is being established by the phrase 'under God'? Do you suppose your understanding of God mirrors mine? I would doubt that a great deal.
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"...nothing in the Constitution that prohibits religion"? Read our First Amendment. You obviously are not very well informed.

"Congress shall pass no law respecting the establishment of religion"

In your face.
 
"...nothing in the Constitution that prohibits religion"? Read our First Amendment. You obviously are not very well informed.

"Congress shall pass no law respecting the establishment of religion"

In your face.
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All that says is the establishment of a religion not that it was the foundation or that it was separated from all form of gov. You need to be alittle more informed not albowl.
 
SKILMATIC said:
If almost 400yrs of not having these problems and all the sudden when we remove god out of schools is when we have these problems and you have the adacity to ask me is there any sort of correlation? I REALLY DONT KNOW HOW TO DEFINE CORRELATION ANY BETTER TO YOU PEOPLE. Theres no correlation? Really? 400yrs isnt correlation? Thats a funny remark
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Let's see, you claim:
teen pregnancy, sex before marriage, drug use, domestic crimes, and school shootings
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are all results of a lack of god in school.

Teen pregnancy? Actually the further you got back in time, the younger people got married and got pregnant. A lot of parents of my age group started their families directly out of high school, as teens.

Sex before marriage? Sure. Lots of it.

Drug use? Depends on how you define "drug use". Cocaine used to be the main component of Coca-Cola, thus the name. Alcohol was considered a drug as well and some still considered it to be a drug.

Domestic crimes? Crime has always been prevalent in society. You'll need to find statistics that over the past 400 years that crime is on the rise and also combine that in relation to what the crimes committed were, taking into consideration that what used to be a crime isn't anymore and vice versa.

Since there weren't a lot of school shootings 400 years ago, it's hard to say, but that's mostly because kids could run faster than you could load a musket.


Of course, these are your claims, and with extraordinary claims, they require extraordinary proof.
 
Again let me spell it out for you. Congress shall pass no law in the establishment of religion. Meaning they cant tell you to not hold religios gatherings or build a church or make any prohibits of any sort on a religion. Is that logical enough? Where in that does it say no god or religion in state or federal affairs? I beleive nowhere in the constitution it says any of those words.
 
SKILMATIC said:
Also how come no one has answered why in the last 50 yrs when god has been removed from our schools that teen pregnancy, sex before marriage, drug use, domestic crimes, and school shootings have gone up extensively? Hmmm.. no answer? Or I suppose the excuse for this one will be that this has nothing to do with god.

O really? Well then tell me how come that when the very first people who came to america(pilgrims) implemented god in the school system and for over almost 400yrs we havent had these problems we now have today in the last 50yrs? Explain that astounding thing to me?
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Prove any of this.

If you are going to blame the striking down of mandatory school prayer for all that has gone wrong in this country without any basis, then you have to also blame it for all that has gone right.
 
then you have to also blame it for all that has gone right.
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Well what do you mean what has gone right? Please give specifics as I have.

Prove any of this.
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I already have, its in the timeline. You shoudl know your history. You mean to say its just coincidence? :lol:

I suppose you beleive the big bang too? Yeah coincidences is all you base life on. Very smart.
 
SKILMATIC said:
All that says is the establishment of a religion not that it was the foundation or that it was separated from all form of gov. You need to be alittle more informed not albowl.
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How did "under god" get into our pledge? Congress passed a law that inserted it there.

"Congress shall pass no law respecting the establishment of religion"

Could that be any clearer? Seems like you need to be more informed. You have yet to back up any of your claims. They are just empty posts.

I have to rest my hand now.... why?

From the ass-whipping I've been giving you!
 
gee Alex. I had not meant to upset you. I do not feel like a higher class citizen at all. But schools do not even allow prayer anymore. Yeah, there is that monent of silence, but its not the same. its harder now to profess ones faith because of worrying about bothering an athiest. i understand your point, but i hadnt meant to take it to the extreme. just questioning.
 
and with extraordinary claims, they require extraordinary proof.
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:lol:

Its not extra claims they are common sense claims. When you have god and godly morals in your schools and life then the chances of these negative things happeing immensely decline, and vice versa. Its simple as that. I cant beleive this is so hard for you to understand. So I guess in the last almost 400yrs when we have had godly morals in our school and all the sudden we took them out we have had a increase of all that which I have mentioned isnt proof or isnt evidentiary suppor tin itself? Well if its not then I really dont know how anything else can be?
 
SKILMATIC said:
Well what do you mean what has gone right? Please give specifics as I have.



I already have, its in the timeline. You shoudl know your history. You mean to say its just coincidence? :lol:

I suppose you beleive the big bang too? Yeah coincidences is all you base life on. Very smart.
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And apparently you base yours on faith. Where is there any intelligence in that? Nowhere. Faith is a lazy persons belief. They are too mentally lazy to obtain the scientific truth.
 
SKILMATIC said:
Again let me spell it out for you. Congress shall pass no law in the establishment of religion. Meaning they cant tell you to not hold religios gatherings or build a church or make any prohibits of any sort on a religion. Is that logical enough? Where in that does it say no god or religion in state or federal affairs? I beleive nowhere in the constitution it says any of those words.
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Here is another section of the Constitution that prohibits religion from government:

Article VI

"but no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States."

My hand is really starting to hurt.
 
And apparently you base yours on faith. Where is there any intelligence in that? Nowhere. Faith is a lazy persons belief. They are too mentally lazy to obtain the scientific truth.
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Actually the facts go both ways. So you mean to say jesus never walked the earth too huh? Yeah that sounds genious too, lol. So I suppose you stick a bunch a ateel in a toronado it will build a sky scraper? The fact is this will never happen therefreo the big bang never happened either. It is easier and more logical to beleive in faith than a impossibility. Your right keep working harder to try to obtain facts casue I alreayd have all the facts I need . :rofl
 
t125eagle said:
gee Alex. I had not meant to upset you. I do not feel like a higher class citizen at all. But schools do not even allow prayer anymore. Yeah, there is that monent of silence, but its not the same. its harder now to profess ones faith because of worrying about bothering an athiest. i understand your point, but i hadnt meant to take it to the extreme. just questioning.
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You did not upset me. I love debating this topic and I guess I got a little caught up in it. If I made you feel I was upset, that was not my intention. The apology is from me to you. :2wave:

Now I have to correct you on something. The Supreme Court ruling that you are referring to did not outlaw school prayer. Students are free to pray as they wish. The ruling struck down a law that required mandatory teacher-led recitation of prayer in schools. There is no such law that prohibits students from praying in schools.

Source:
http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=US&friend=oyez&friend=oyez&vol=370&invol=421
 
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Here is another section of the Constitution that prohibits religion from government:

Article VI

"but no religious Test shall ever be required as a Qualification to any Office or public Trust under the United States."

My hand is really starting to hurt.
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Well if you stop wacking off then your hand will feel better, :lol: .

But your right again that has nothing to do with the founding of this country and its contengencies to religion in any form of its gov. All that states is no matter your affiliation it souldnt even be a factor to hold office. Meaning if you are christian or protestant or taoist then it shouldnt matter casue this is a country of religious freedom thats it. Thats why all this fuss about john roberts is unconstitutional. They are haggling him for his religious beleifs which is unconstitutional.
 
Now I have to correct you on something. The Supreme Court ruling that you are referring to did not outlaw school prayer. Students are free to pray as they wish. The ruling struck down a law that required mandatory teacher-led recitation of prayer in schools. There is no such law that prohibits students from praying in schools.
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I will have to agree with you on that one casue thats a fact. I was able to pray in school. Do you remember cya at the poll? Well that was a huge national day that all kids around the us would pray around their school flagpole. So prayer wasnt totally outlawed
 
SKILMATIC said:
World champs, you are a typical bigotting lib. When someone debacles your argument you result to racist, bigotry, andprejuceness comments.
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Thanks for the name calling, does it make you feel better? Maybe next time you'll actually respond to the point that I was making in my post? Give it a try, it's really not that tough.

You wrote:
Originally Posted by SKILMATIC
The fact is the reason why the number is going up between 1990-2000 is becasue the more illegals we get the more non church goers becasue they dont have very many spanish speaking churches to harvest this large quatity of illegals which we do notice as population in america.
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Read those words a couple of times? I read those words to mean that because of illegal immigrants who do not attend church because they speak Spanish and churches do not that the number of people in the USA claiming to not be church-goers is incorrect. That is how I interpret those words.

If you don't like my interpretation of those words then rebut them. I think those words are wrong, really, really wrong. I think that to believe those words to be true is stupid. I have not called you anything, my comments are about the words in that post and my opinion of those words.

I call them as I read them, and those words to me are ugly generalizations about a group of people. I find those words to be untrue. If you think those are intelligent words that is your opinion and you're welcome to it.

I think those words translate to prejudice, and that is my opinion. Sorry if you disagree. Maybe you took my words personally because they struck a chord? Who knows?
 
alex said:
"...nothing in the Constitution that prohibits religion"? Read our First Amendment. You obviously are not very well informed.

"Congress shall pass no law respecting the establishment of religion"

In your face.
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The First Amendment says "Congress shall pass no law respecting the establishment of religion or prohibiting the free exercise thereof or abridging the freedom of speech,. . . .etc. etc. "

You can twist this any way it can be twisted, and there is no way you can show that the recitation of a non-specific reference to God in the Pledge of Allegiance, which no child is required to recite, is an establishment of religion.

Surely you can see that a law against the government requiring or mandating a religious belief or favoring any one religion over any other is not the same thing as prohibiting religion.

However, a law that says I may not say "under God' in the Pledge of Allegiance could well be interpreted as a law against my free exercise of religion.

Personally I have no problem with the phrase being there or not being there. I have a huge problem with those who attempt to force their own prejudices re religion or anything else on everybody else.
 
Allright if you watch the Daily Show I'm sure you already know that the phrase 'under god,' wasn't even in the pledge of allegiance to begin with (if you noticed I posted this info before the show was even on, I freaking hate when the T.V. says stuff after I've already written it or thought of it, anyways I digress) it was added in the late 40's to use as soft power against the Athiest gov't of the Soviet Union, but by the same token, while it was added ex post facto, is it still not true that one of the greatest attributes of the U.S. is that everyone can practice which ever religion they wish, with out the fear of persecution?
 
SKILMATIC said:
When you have god and godly morals in your schools and life then the chances of these negative things happeing immensely decline, and vice versa. ?
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I find it insulting that someone writes that without god people do not have morals. This is the essence of what turns so many people off about religion.

People who do not believe in god are equally moral to those that do, period.

To suggest otherwise to me is ignorant and prejudicial. If you disagree with me that's fine, but I would definitely disagree with you.
 
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