View Poll Results: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

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  • Yes

    133 56.36%
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    103 43.64%
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Thread: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by tryreading
    The continuing problem is that many, when confronted with the fact that it isn't legal to place their religious items on public property, maintain that some want all sign and mention of religion banned from government. But all we want is to keep religious encroachment out of government. George Bush ends his speeches with 'God bless America.' That is God in the government, and it is perfectly legal. No problem."
    Except there is a problem. Christianity is under attack in our country and evidence of this is everywhere. George Bush is often put down for his religious beliefs. A member of the supreme court was stopped on the steps of his church while a reporter tried to bait him into an argument over his religious beliefs. Every year more stores and malls are sporting holiday trees vs Christmas trees. It's total BS. Christians had to protest Lowe's last year because for the first time their tree lot was selling holiday trees vs Christmas trees and it pissed people off. To say that there are not fanatics out there who want to see religion banned all together is wrong. The sick part is that the attack is generally specifically against Christianity or Judism. Anotherwards it's not altogether uncommon to see a liberal bashing christianity while completely supporting the muslim religion. There is something going on there. It's weird. Kind of like the liberals who sport "Save Tibet" bumper stickers but you have to wonder if they really would support us going to war to save Tibet when generally, where I live anyway, many of them are so anti-war that they are ready to serve Israel up on a platter. It makes no sense.

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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou
    Except there is a problem. Christianity is under attack in our country and evidence of this is everywhere. George Bush is often put down for his religious beliefs. A member of the supreme court was stopped on the steps of his church while a reporter tried to bait him into an argument over his religious beliefs. Every year more stores and malls are sporting holiday trees vs Christmas trees. It's total BS. Christians had to protest Lowe's last year because for the first time their tree lot was selling holiday trees vs Christmas trees and it pissed people off. To say that there are not fanatics out there who want to see religion banned all together is wrong. The sick part is that the attack is generally specifically against Christianity or Judism. Anotherwards it's not altogether uncommon to see a liberal bashing christianity while completely supporting the muslim religion. There is something going on there. It's weird. Kind of like the liberals who sport "Save Tibet" bumper stickers but you have to wonder if they really would support us going to war to save Tibet when generally, where I live anyway, many of them are ready to serve Israel up on a platter. It makes no sense.
    I wouldn't do any of the above things, but, guess what? They are all legal.
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    This holiday tree issue is crap! Liberals weren't boycotting to get the name changed to holiday. It was a decision made by the companies to try to be inclusive. It was driven by the motive of maximizing profits. Now I will admit that it probably backfired on them. I can't believe that is your example of how you are being persecuted. Unless you, yourself, are a tree, I don't see how you can tell somebody what to call a tree.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002
    I can't believe that is your example of how you are being persecuted. Unless you, yourself, are a tree, I don't see how you can tell somebody what to call a tree.
    I never claimed I was being persecuted. But there is a definite anti-christian tone in the country recently. You don't have to be a christian to notice it. There are definitely people who are seriously confused about the differences between freedom from religion and freedom of religion.

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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou
    I never claimed I was being persecuted. But there is a definite anti-christian tone in the country recently. You don't have to be a christian to notice it. There are definitely people who are seriously confused about the differences between freedom from religion and freedom of religion.
    I still haven't seen any examples of how christians aren't able to practice their religion in this country.
    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by independent_thinker2002
    I still haven't seen any examples of how christians aren't able to practice their religion in this country.
    No I don't believe they are unable to practice their religion. I do believe that in many cases political correctness has gone way too far....and this applies to many topics not just religion. But I will say that it does seem that Christians are being singled out and harrassed more than other groups lately.

    I myself am pretty conservative but I don't consider myself a christian and I don't go to church or belong to any organized religion. I raise my kids with an open mind and teach them about all different religions all the while telling them when it comes to God...mom honestly doesn't know for sure what all if anything there is to know.

    However I will say that when talking to liberals, I live in a radically liberal area, I am often accused of being a Right Wing Religious fundie or some other Christian bashing phrase. And generally this happens without any prior mention of God or religion. I can mention that I'm not sure about stem cell research and someone will just start christian bashing me....when my feelings about embryonic stems cells have nothing to do with religion. I also remember hearing over and over again during the last presidential election that only right wing christian fanatics are against stem cells. That's simply not true. But the christian bashing is everywhere lately and I know this because I am subjected to it and bashed when some ignoramous believes I'm a christian due to my opinions. On this website I have had people christian bash me. I have had people say they don't believe my claim that I am not religious!

    Clearly christians are being singled out and calling someone a christian is the liberal way of dismissing.....doesn't even seem to matter if the person being christian bashed is christian or not.

    But yeah christians can still practice....I don't see any evidence of them not being able to practice their religion. And yeah for what it's worth I think all the christian bashing is back-firing because basically many democrats and liberals are christians! Many christian bashers try to solve this problem by declaring they are only bashing the fundamentalists but I think many christians are still insulted which may be why democrats aren't winning as many elections.

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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou
    For many it's not even about the "under God" it's about the pledge in general. They don't want "their" children pledging anything. In my opinion it's really sad. But like I said why not go after the "In God We Trust" money first? Why are our schools the guinea pigs for liberal ideals? You want God completely removed from the government. Then fight for that first.....then go after the schools. Or is it easier to brainwash the youth vs the parents?
    How exactly is it brainwashing youth to NOT mandate an oath of allegiance? No one is saying that the Pledge of Allegiance should be banned and people should be punished for reciting it. You're free to say almost anything you want, anytime you want, anywhere in the country.

    And why do you keep bringing up "In God We Trust" on money in the form of a strawman? Many of us do think that should be removed as well. I'm not sure what your point is when you mention that. What's so important about the order in which these phrases are removed?

    For someone who claims to not be religious, you certainly do an excellent job parroting Pat Robertson's talking points...
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kandahar

    For someone who claims to not be religious, you certainly do an excellent job parroting Pat Robertson's talking points...
    See? Oooh I must be a christian. A christian in the closet and therefore you can dismiss me....right? I don't even know exactly who Pat Robertson is. If my talking points mimic his then maybe he knows what he is talking about. The "Pat" I like is Pat Buchanan.

    I point out the christian bashing because it's so obvious. And I'm not in to seeing anyone bashed because of their relgious beliefs. Also many of the attempts to remove religion from the public square are in my opinion ridiculous. I really see a difference between freedom of religion and freedom from religion. I'm not religious yet public religious displays don't bother me! Why should they? Unless the government is demanding that I recognize God or a certain God or their definition of God why should I care?

    Also the "under God" in the pledge is very undefined. God could mean anything in that pledge. There is nothing to suggests the term represents the Christian God? So what's the problem?

    And basically my biggest problem with liberals trying to change anything in the schools comes from the knowledge that liberals have already severely damaged our public school system. So yeah I'd like to see them try to change something else....you know like the money....and leave the kids in school alone for a bit so they can actually learn something. If they are really worried about kids why don't they try to change the fact that sooooo many kids can't pass a WASL exam in 11th grade when the test is written at an 8th grade level? See I worry about crap like that vs the undefined vague phrase "under God" in the pledge. But then again I'm one of those weirdos who doesn't mind my child hearing the phrase God or accidently picking up some patriotism for their counrty!

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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou
    Many of the attempts to remove religion from the public square are in my opinion ridiculous. I really see a difference between freedom of religion and freedom from religion. I'm not religious yet public religious displays don't bother me! Why should they? Unless the government is demanding that I recognize God or a certain God or their definition of God why should I care?
    We are already half-way to religious persecution. Congress has established the authority to advise you on religious matters. Now all it needs to do is establish the punishment for non-compliance.

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou
    Also the "under God" in the pledge is very undefined. God could mean anything in that pledge. There is nothing to suggests the term represents the Christian God? So what's the problem?
    It is an assumption of civil authority over Religion; it implies that we are all under the same God; it implies a need for uniformity of religious opinions; Christ never claimed authority over Pilate or Caesar; if God wants to be over our nation he will probably make it known to use just like he did with the nation of Israel with burning bushes, blood in the Nile, parting the Red Sea and the pillar of fire, etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by talloulou
    And basically my biggest problem with liberals trying to change anything in the schools comes from the knowledge that liberals have already severely damaged our public school system. So yeah I'd like to see them try to change something else....you know like the money....and leave the kids in school alone for a bit so they can actually learn something. If they are really worried about kids why don't they try to change the fact that sooooo many kids can't pass a WASL exam in 11th grade when the test is written at an 8th grade level? See I worry about crap like that vs the undefined vague phrase "under God" in the pledge. But then again I'm one of those weirdos who doesn't mind my child hearing the phrase God or accidently picking up some patriotism for their counrty!
    Your child may be learning that he or she should take religious advice from the government. He should be taught to ignore any government advice on religion and listen to his conscience.

    When you listen to government advice on religion you are rejecting the authority of Christ. If you are going to do that, you might as well just worship in the Temple of Satan.

    FVF

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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by FredFlash
    When you listen to government advice on religion you are rejecting the authority of Christ. If you are going to do that, you might as well just worship in the Temple of Satan.

    FVF

    Oooh geez....Well you know I never actually figured out what crimes Satan commits in the bible. God commits tons of acts of violence. God advocates genocide. Yet what does Satan do in the bible other than advising people they don't necessarily have to listen to God???? Hmmmm???? The snake tells Adam and Eve they won't die if they eat from the tree knowledge. God told them they would die. They didn't die! The serpant told them the truth. I always found that interesting.... Satan tries to tempt Jesus out of dying on the cross....what's so wrong with that???? Just playing Devil's advocate but honestly I find the old testament God to be way more horrifying than the "Satan" of the bible. And I had some very good deviled eggs this weekend.

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