View Poll Results: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

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  • Yes

    133 56.36%
  • No

    103 43.64%
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Thread: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

  1. #241
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hoot
    I think it's a shame that the courts' time has to be wasted on such an unimportant matter. It's also a shame that someone felt they had to bring a lawsuit. Where do these people come from?

    If you don't like your children saying "under God," then don't say it.
    Take the religious reference out and then if you don't like saying the pledge then don't say it.

  2. #242
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Driving along the highway this morning, I noticed a traffic informational sign that denoted (by arrow and name) the location of a house of worship. I suppose those small tokens will be the next victim of 'religious cleansing'.



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  3. #243
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl
    The phrase takes nothing away from you or anybody else, it has failed to corrupt or harm anybody in its 50+ years of existence, and it is important to a large majority of Americans. Get over it…….Until you can make a reasoned argument that the undescribed and undefined phrase 'under God' is an establishment of religion, person preferences or personal interpretations count for naught. If you think it is religious, the next person may think it is historical, the next cultural, the next symbolic, the next respecting of heritage. What the phrase means to me is no doubt entirely different than imagery the phrase conjures up in you……..It isn't illegal because YOU say it is illegal. It is illegal only if the law says it is illegal, and in my opinion, any law that says it is illegal is in itself unconstitutional because it violates the First Amendment………If we want 'under God' in the Pledge, it hurts no one, it does not violate the Constitution, and it should stand. At such time as a majority does not want the phrase, then it should go. Again it would hurt no one and would not violate the Constitution.
    It hurts no one?
    My wife and I have been home schooling our daughter since March ‘03. I just couldn’t subject her to daily humiliation of pledging to a thing, let alone the repeating, hand on heart, that this thing is “under God”, or the lie that there is “liberty and justice for all”.
    “She has the right to remain seated and not say anything”, you may say. Tell that to the rest of the kids, the ones who taunted her to the point of tears. Please note the utter callousness of “it hurts no one”. He didn’t see her crying, and I doubt he has empathy for anyone but “people of faith” as he calls them.
    Don’t let this person fool you. He knows darn well that nobody wants to stop him from leading his family in the Pledge, or prayer, or what words to say. Doesn’t anyone wonder why he insists that the First Amendment mandates state expression of faith of the majority? I doubt he will tell us the real motivation. You see, It’s not about his rights or his family or his faith, since he has every right, independently pledge, pray, worship, as he pleases. It’s your kids soul he’s after.
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  4. #244
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride
    The 9th circuit court is a radical court filled with activist jusdges whose decisions are constantly overturned by the SCOTUS and that is what will happen in this case.
    Prove it, please? I am very interested in seeing what rulings if any have been overturned by the Supremes? Wait a minute, that's not enough! You wrote that their decisions are "constantly overturned by the SCOTUS" and I would love to see you prove this blustery and what I believe to be completely untrue statement.

    Let's see if you're able to back up your statement meant to attack people without proof just like many Republicans like to do. Where's the beef Mr. Pride.

    You wrote that the decision re "Under God" will not stand the Supreme test (if it even ever gets tested IMHO) so now let's see if Navy Pride can pass the truth in post test? I think you need to post a detailed list of rulings made by the 9th Circuit Court that have been overturned by the Supremes. Not one, not two, but lots because you wrote it is happening "constantly."

    The ball is in your court Mr. Pride. Are you going to score or dribble it off your foot?

  5. #245
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl
    If we want 'under God' in the Pledge, it hurts no one, it does not violate the Constitution, and it should stand.
    Simply an untrue statement, sorry. It is ILLEGAL and has been ruled so. Until it is challenged and changed it is now officially unconstitutional and against the law. Whether you think its right or not does not matter, you're not a judge.
    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl
    At such time as a majority does not want the phrase, then it should go. Again it would hurt no one and would not violate the Constitution.
    Fortunately our founding fathers were way smarter than this statement. They recognized that majority rule is not the be all end all in deciding constitutionality so people who argue that line of thinking don't have a leg to stand on in the eyes of the law.

    You're free to believe what you like and you're most definitely free to say "Under God" whenever you recite the pledge, no one will stop you. What you cannot do is make it an official part of the Pledge and no amount of whining or denying will change this oh so simple fact.

    How would you feel if it said instead "Under Jesus"? The majority of Americans would want that too? Talk about a can of worms!

    I'm Jewish and I would be excluded if it said "Under Jesus." That is wrong and illegal. The exact same logic applies to "Under God" because it excludes millions and millions of Americans who are not OK with God being in their government nor in their tax dollars nor anywhere else that government hangs out.

    Now if you said change it to "Under Yankees" you might persuade me to allow that....

  6. #246
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by marchare
    It hurts no one?
    My wife and I have been home schooling our daughter since March ‘03. I just couldn’t subject her to daily humiliation of pledging to a thing, let alone the repeating, hand on heart, that this thing is “under God”, or the lie that there is “liberty and justice for all”.
    “She has the right to remain seated and not say anything”, you may say. Tell that to the rest of the kids, the ones who taunted her to the point of tears. Please note the utter callousness of “it hurts no one”. He didn’t see her crying, and I doubt he has empathy for anyone but “people of faith” as he calls them.
    Don’t let this person fool you. He knows darn well that nobody wants to stop him from leading his family in the Pledge, or prayer, or what words to say. Doesn’t anyone wonder why he insists that the First Amendment mandates state expression of faith of the majority? I doubt he will tell us the real motivation. You see, It’s not about his rights or his family or his faith, since he has every right, independently pledge, pray, worship, as he pleases. It’s your kids soul he’s after.
    \

    And I would homeschool a child rather than have him/her exposed to a school system in which his/her belief in God was unacceptable or where people got their shorts in a wad over two words in a Pledge of Allegiance or even in a Pledge of Allegiance without those two words.

    The difference between you and yours and me and mine at this time is that I am in the majority. The next time, the situations may be reversed and I won't be able to force the majority to bow to my preference either.

    So if the school is unacceptable to you, then sure, home school. Meanwhile, neither her rights nor anybody else's rights are being violated. When no individual rights are involved, nobody gets to dicate how society shall be at the expense of the majority preference. Or at least they should not get to dictate how society shall be at the expense of the majority preference.

    Any teacher that would not put an instant stop to taunting in the classroom should be fired. But so long as the activity is legal and sanctioned, the others should not have to give up something important to them because one child doesn't enjoy it.
    Last edited by AlbqOwl; 09-18-05 at 03:09 PM.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

  7. #247
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Alex to you
    Quote:
    Where in our Constitution are "godly principles"?

    Quote Originally Posted by SKILMATIC
    You cant just look at one piece of literature and conclude anything you must look at the whole picture. The fact is up and down the billl of rights and the ammendments were all provinged by Gods devine human rights.
    Really?

    What "godly principle" is the three branches of government based on?
    What "godly principle" is our Republican form of government based on?
    What "godly principle" is freedom of speech based on?
    What "godly principle" is freedom of religion based on (I really want to hear that explaination)?
    What "godly principle" is the right to keep and bear arms based on?
    What "godly principle" is the writ of habeous corpus based on?
    What "godly principle" is property rights based on?
    What "godly principle" is the right to trial by jury based on?

    Those are founding principles of our country, what are the "godly principles"?

    Please tell us which specific parts of the Consitution and Bill of Rights are found in the Bible.

  8. #248
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl
    The difference between you and yours and me and mine at this time is that I am in the majority. The next time, the situations may be reversed and I won't be able to force the majority to bow to my preference either.
    You TRULY are utterly ignorant of the US Constitution. It's purpose is majorly to protect the minorities from the "tyrrany of the majority." Your very comment here shows how truly ignorant you are of these matters.
    So if the school is unacceptable to you, then sure, home school. Meanwhile, neither her rights nor anybody else's rights are being violated.
    Per the US Constitution, yes they are. And this has been explained to you and you simply reject it. hence you are now outright lying. This is disappointing as I had not taken you for an outright liar.
    When no individual rights are involved, nobody gets to dicate how society shall be at the expense of the majority preference.
    But the individual right of not having religion forced on them IS being violated here. So your clkaim is false.
    Or at least they should not get to dictate how society shall be at the expense of the majority preference.
    So you spit on on the US Constitution. Yes, I am not surprised.
    Any teacher that would not put an instant stop to taunting in the classroom should be fired.
    Uhum, that wors so well, have a teacher walk with that kid every monent they are in school to prevent bullying. Your remarks are now getting downright stupid.
    But so long as the activity is legal and sanctioned, the others should not have to give up something important to them because one child doesn't enjoy it.
    Yes, they should have to, as long as the one's rights are protected by the US Constitution, in this case the Esstablishment Clause.

  9. #249
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Stinger
    Alex to you
    Quote:
    Where in our Constitution are "godly principles"?



    Really?

    What "godly principle" is the three branches of government based on?
    What "godly principle" is our Republican form of government based on?
    What "godly principle" is freedom of speech based on?
    What "godly principle" is freedom of religion based on (I really want to hear that explaination)?
    What "godly principle" is the right to keep and bear arms based on?
    What "godly principle" is the writ of habeous corpus based on?
    What "godly principle" is property rights based on?
    What "godly principle" is the right to trial by jury based on?

    Those are founding principles of our country, what are the "godly principles"?

    Please tell us which specific parts of the Consitution and Bill of Rights are found in the Bible.
    As far as I understand, a lot of this came from the Iroquois Confederacy, right? Nothing biblical about that.

  10. #250
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    Re: Do you believe that the phrase "Under God" should be in the Pledge of Allegiance?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl
    The difference between you and yours and me and mine at this time is that I am in the majority. The next time, the situations may be reversed and I won't be able to force the majority to bow to my preference either.
    I think you have been taking long pulls on the bubbling bong of bigotry.
    Peace: the preemptive veteran’s benefit.
    Trade liberty for security and obtain neither of either.
    Whatever is begun in anger ends in shame.

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