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VOTER ID LAW, would you support this one as written? (Multiple Choice)

VOTER ID LAW, would you support this one as written?

  • Total voters
    53
If it free and you can obtain it at the voting site then I have no problem with it. I'm still not convinced it is necessary but under your system I wouldn't put up a fight over it.
 
Cardinal said:
The entire suite of voting restrictions, including voting ids, reducing polling stations, limiting the ability of college students from voting and shortening early voting periods happen in red states. And this entire suite of voting restrictions "coincidentally" only target demographics known to vote Democrats.

I say ban military absentee voting.
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Is the highlighted above remark tongue in cheek or a slam against our military who tend to vote republican? If its the latter I would have to say your remarks are rather hypocritical.
 
antiquity said:
Is the highlighted above remark tongue in cheek or a slam against our military who tend to vote republican? If its the latter I would have to say your remarks are rather hypocritical.
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The hypocrisy of red states in not banning military absentee voting should be glaringly obvious.
 
BrewerBob said:
If it free and you can obtain it at the voting site then I have no problem with it. I'm still not convinced it is necessary but under your system I wouldn't put up a fight over it.
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If you're so much as negotiating the terms of a voting id then you're falling into their trap. An example of the tactic can be demonstrated like this:

Politician: I propose that all children should be thrown into a volcano to appease an angry god.
Public: No way, that's horrible!
Politician: Okay, then I propose that all children after the second child should be thrown into a volcano.
Public: Oh, well that's much more reasonable.

The proper reaction to the politician is of course, "Bite me, psycho."

A voter id under any condition doesn't hurt Republicans, only Democrats, and they know that perfectly well because they did the studies beforehand to know that it would primarily affect poor and black people, and then subsequently passed that law.
 
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Cardinal said:
If you're so much as negotiating the terms of a voting id then you're falling into their trap. An example of the tactic can be demonstrated like this:

Politician: I propose that all children should be thrown into a volcano to appease angry god.
Public: No way, that's horrible!
Politician: Okay, then I propose that all children after the second child should be thrown into a volcano.
Public: Oh, well that's much more reasonable.

The proper reaction to the politician is of course, "Bite me, psycho."

A voter id under any condition doesn't hurt Republicans, only Democrats, and they know that perfectly well because they did the studies beforehand to know that it would primarily affect poor and black people, and then subsequently passed that law.
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If it is issued to you free of charge when you show up to vote then there is no disenfranchisement. Hell, it is an incentive to vote because it allows people to knock out two birds with one stone.
 
BrewerBob said:
If it is issued to you free of charge when you show up to vote then there is no disenfranchisement. Hell, it is an incentive to vote because it allows people to knock out two birds with one stone.
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It adds an additional layer of complexity, however minimal. That has an impact on one demographic alone and Republicans know this. You're demonstrating the "public" side in my example.

Unless you think it's a wild coincidence that not one voting regulation passed by a right-leaning state has added layers of complexity for demographics exclusively known to vote Republican.
 
Cardinal said:
Try reading my post more slowly.
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He was responding directly to the nonsense you were uttering. You would have to believe that there are unfair obstacles to obtaining a voter ID that only apply to minorities and women, just the Democrat ones mind you, across all races.

If these IDs are made free and are made available in very convenient locales to everyone who merits one, you would still be opposed...why?

Now, while reading your post "more slowly" might reduce the velocity slightly of the dumbing down process, not reading it at all would do away with your addition to that problem entirely.

I will try the latter, as since The Great Loss, depression seems to have rushed in, taken its toll. I had seen very little of substance or logic before, sometimes a witty line or two... but now it seems to have evaporated entirely.
 
AGENT J said:
So I did a similar poll around 3 years ago and I wanted to do another one to see if anything has changed, I'll post a link to that in a minute.
I'm going to base my law off of the things PA already does and add some stuff, you let me know what you think.

1.) To vote one must be registered within 30 days of voting, when you register you are assigned a voting poll. Registration is cross verified and you CAN NOT be registered multiple times or in multiple voting districts, when you move etc the registration is redone and the old one removed. When voting at your polling place your registration is verified and only then can you vote. (this is already done in PA)
2.)When voting you must provide ID. If a state is choosing to have a voter ID card that card must be free and readily obtainable. It's shall be able to be obtained where all other IDs can be obtained DMV, SS office, Passport, courthouse for weapons permits etc and at the polling places at certain times including the day of voting. ALSO the voter ID shall NOT be the only acceptable form of ID. ALL and ANY government acceptable picture IDs will also suffice. DL, State ID, Passport, Military ID, CWL etc.

So VOTER ID LAW, would you support this one as written?

Yes
No
Other
I Love Pumpkin Pie!


View attachment 67210848
Yes I know I used to add mashed potatoes to my polls but its Christmas time so I picked pumpkin Pie :)
and yes I also know this technically pumpkin cheesecake pie, but that's one of MY favorites so too bad!!!:2razz:
Click to expand...

Throw in automatic voter registration and voting by mail, and we'll talk.
 
Phys251 said:
Throw in automatic voter registration and voting by mail, and we'll talk.
Click to expand...

Ooh, I've got another proposal:

Everybody who owns a gun must bring a certification that they passed a background test before voting.
 
Cardinal said:
It adds an additional layer of complexity, however minimal. That has an impact on one demographic alone and Republicans know this. You're demonstrating the "public" side in my example.

Unless you think it's a wild coincidence that not one voting regulation passed by a right-leaning state has added layers of complexity for demographics exclusively known to vote Republican.
Click to expand...

I am completely with you on reduced polling hours and reducing the number of polling stations. Yes, the Republicans do this to disenfranchise voters. I don't have a problem with voter ID laws in principle, it is the disenfranchisement I have a problem with. The OP's proposal causes no disenfranchisement so I don't have a problem with it. It is of course also why the Republicans would never institute the OP's plan.
 
Cardinal said:
Ooh, I've got another proposal:

Everybody who owns a gun must bring a certification that they passed a background test before voting.
Click to expand...

A better analogy would be that when you go to buy a gun at the gun store there is a court clerk at a table there who will simultaneously issue you a CCW permit free of charge.
 
BrewerBob said:
A better analogy would be that when you go to buy a gun at the gun store there is a court clerk at a table there who will simultaneously issue you a CCW permit free of charge.
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Who cares? I'm just making up annoying rules that specifically target one voting demographic. I'll rationalize it somehow after the fact.
 
I had to vote no for a couple of reasons, but the main one is that I do not believe there is significant (or even minimal) evidence of a need for us taxpayers to pay for the implementation of these types of laws. I believe the government needs to show the need for any restrictions it imposes on the population prior to imposing them.

Majority support means nothing in my analysis. It's generally easy to get a majority to agree to something like this because they think it will not impact them personally.
 
AGENT J said:
So I did a similar poll around 3 years ago and I wanted to do another one to see if anything has changed, I'll post a link to that in a minute.
I'm going to base my law off of the things PA already does and add some stuff, you let me know what you think.

1.) To vote one must be registered within 30 days of voting, when you register you are assigned a voting poll. Registration is cross verified and you CAN NOT be registered multiple times or in multiple voting districts, when you move etc the registration is redone and the old one removed. When voting at your polling place your registration is verified and only then can you vote. (this is already done in PA)
2.)When voting you must provide ID. If a state is choosing to have a voter ID card that card must be free and readily obtainable. It's shall be able to be obtained where all other IDs can be obtained DMV, SS office, Passport, courthouse for weapons permits etc and at the polling places at certain times including the day of voting. ALSO the voter ID shall NOT be the only acceptable form of ID. ALL and ANY government acceptable picture IDs will also suffice. DL, State ID, Passport, Military ID, CWL etc.

So VOTER ID LAW, would you support this one as written?

Yes
No
Other
I Love Pumpkin Pie!
Click to expand...

When people talk about voter fraud they always talk about provable fraud. The problem with that is that it only covers that which is provable. Currently there is nothing in place to check if a voter is a US citizen. The only group in this country that is allowed to vote. Obama even admitted this just before the election this year. They check to see if more than one vote is cast from individuals. But they do not check if a single person voting is legally allowed to due to being a citizen or not. As such it cannot be proven one way or the other. Those against voter ID laws KNOW this, but ignore it or twist it or say "so what they deserve to have their say also since they live here". Lots of people realize this is true however and I have no doubt that many use this fact and do vote when they are not US citizens.

I voted "no" in the poll because there's nothing in the OP's post which indicates that the person registering to vote must prove that they are US citizens.
 
I cannot support any change in the law which would prevent a citizen from voting on election day should they decide on that day to be exercise their rights as a citizen to vote.
 
haymarket said:
I cannot support any change in the law which would prevent a citizen from voting on election day should they decide on that day to be exercise their rights as a citizen to vote.
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Strange... just how well thought out is this? You would support a change in the law that would open it up to all citizens to vote, would you, even if they decided to on the day of the election? And non citizens? Some, none, all?
 
BrewerBob said:
I am completely with you on reduced polling hours and reducing the number of polling stations. Yes, the Republicans do this to disenfranchise voters. I don't have a problem with voter ID laws in principle, it is the disenfranchisement I have a problem with. The OP's proposal causes no disenfranchisement so I don't have a problem with it. It is of course also why the Republicans would never institute the OP's plan.
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In my state we do not have any polling stations, none ...do you have a problem with that?
 
Phys251 said:
Throw in automatic voter registration and voting by mail, and we'll talk.
Click to expand...

I like those IDs and this is exactly why I started this conversation. to learn. In PA you can automatically get your voting registration various ways, Ive been asked everytime I renew my licenses, i was asked when I got my CWL, Ive been asked when filling out medical paperwork and I was asked for jobs also. Theres also locations that offer assistance in such. Would that suffice? or do you want more or have something else in mind?

Has for voting by mail, in PA you can vote by mail with an absentee ballot. Not sure what they do in other states.
 
AGENT J said:
I like those IDs and this is exactly why I started this conversation. to learn. In PA you can automatically get your voting registration various ways, Ive been asked everytime I renew my licenses, i was asked when I got my CWL, Ive been asked when filling out medical paperwork and I was asked for jobs also. Theres also locations that offer assistance in such. Would that suffice? or do you want more or have something else in mind?
Click to expand...

That should do the trick, I think.

Has for voting by mail, in PA you can vote by mail with an absentee ballot. Not sure what they do in other states.
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Not bad. Some places such as Oregon take it a step further: Voting is almost exclusively by mail. So no traveling to the polls and waiting in line.

BTW, I forgot to mention. That pie in the OP? I would like some. Nom nom.
 
Kal'Stang said:
1.)When people talk about voter fraud they always talk about provable fraud. The problem with that is that it only covers that which is provable. Currently there is nothing in place to check if a voter is a US citizen. The only group in this country that is allowed to vote. Obama even admitted this just before the election this year. They check to see if more than one vote is cast from individuals. But they do not check if a single person voting is legally allowed to due to being a citizen or not. As such it cannot be proven one way or the other. Those against voter ID laws KNOW this, but ignore it or twist it or say "so what they deserve to have their say also since they live here". Lots of people realize this is true however and I have no doubt that many use this fact and do vote when they are not US citizens.

I voted "no" in the poll because there's nothing in the OP's post which indicates that the person registering to vote must prove that they are US citizens.
Click to expand...

well a lot of that is true but not all of it. i am against many voter ID laws (not mine of course) that I read but i will NEVER support the claim of ""so what they deserve to have their say also since they live here". I actually find that repulsive, not your claim but that people have that idea, and yes I agree there are people that do..

as for your concern of proving citizenship I guess I took that for granted, again going my PA and my own experience. I needed to provide my SS number, that had to match me and my address etc. Not sure what ways there would be to fool that system and check and balance. Im sure there might be some way but I was going off the premise that the current system in PA works in that regard.
 
Phys251 said:
That should do the trick, I think.



Not bad. Some places such as Oregon take it a step further: Voting is almost exclusively by mail. So no traveling to the polls and waiting in line.

BTW, I forgot to mention. That pie in the OP? I would like some. Nom nom.
Click to expand...

Thats nice in oregon . . . and the pie is delicious. Thats not an actual pic but its very similar to my favorite that is my grams recipe, NOM NOM NOM doesn't begin to describe it!
 
antiquity said:
And I was point out you said republicans try to limit voting rights and I pointed out you are full of it.
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Do you know who Mike Turzai is?

Do you know who Todd Allbaugh is?
 
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AGENT J said:
So I did a similar poll around 3 years ago and I wanted to do another one to see if anything has changed, I'll post a link to that in a minute.
I'm going to base my law off of the things PA already does and add some stuff, you let me know what you think.

1.) To vote one must be registered within 30 days of voting, when you register you are assigned a voting poll. Registration is cross verified and you CAN NOT be registered multiple times or in multiple voting districts, when you move etc the registration is redone and the old one removed. When voting at your polling place your registration is verified and only then can you vote. (this is already done in PA)
2.)When voting you must provide ID. If a state is choosing to have a voter ID card that card must be free and readily obtainable. It's shall be able to be obtained where all other IDs can be obtained DMV, SS office, Passport, courthouse for weapons permits etc and at the polling places at certain times including the day of voting. ALSO the voter ID shall NOT be the only acceptable form of ID. ALL and ANY government acceptable picture IDs will also suffice. DL, State ID, Passport, Military ID, CWL etc.

So VOTER ID LAW, would you support this one as written?

Yes
No
Other
I Love Pumpkin Pie!


View attachment 67210848
Yes I know I used to add mashed potatoes to my polls but its Christmas time so I picked pumpkin Pie :)
and yes I also know this technically pumpkin cheesecake pie, but that's one of MY favorites so too bad!!!:2razz:
Click to expand...
Other/love pie

I have over the last year or so formed an opinion that we should automatically register all citizens as independent voters.
If they want to participate in closed primaries, they have to change their registration to specific parties, of course.
And if they are so inclined, they can fill out paperwork to be unregistered (religious reasons, perhaps?)

A month before the voting period (which I think should cover multiple days) we mail each registered voter a single-use voter photo ID card for the election (and another if they are registered in a party in closed primary states so they can vote in said primaries).

They show up, present card for verification, insert it into the voting machine, and vote.
Could probably use it for absentee voting.

Potential problems include confirming that absentee votes are the person the card belongs to. Photo of person holding card? Could be coerced, but who would go to that much trouble for one vote?

The key part IMO is automatic registration upon birth or citizenship with effort required to de-register.
 
The Mark said:
Other/love pie

I have over the last year or so formed an opinion that we should automatically register all citizens as independent voters.
If they want to participate in closed primaries, they have to change their registration to specific parties, of course.
And if they are so inclined, they can fill out paperwork to be unregistered (religious reasons, perhaps?)

A month before the voting period (which I think should cover multiple days) we mail each registered voter a single-use voter photo ID card for the election (and another if they are registered in a party in closed primary states so they can vote in said primaries).

They show up, present card for verification, insert it into the voting machine, and vote.
Could probably use it for absentee voting.

Potential problems include confirming that absentee votes are the person the card belongs to. Photo of person holding card? Could be coerced, but who would go to that much trouble for one vote?

The key part IMO is automatic registration upon birth or citizenship with effort required to de-register.
Click to expand...

Unless you're forcing people to vote there's no reason to de-register. Just simply don't vote.
 
AGENT J said:
well a lot of that is true but not all of it. i am against many voter ID laws (not mine of course) that I read but i will NEVER support the claim of ""so what they deserve to have their say also since they live here". I actually find that repulsive, not your claim but that people have that idea, and yes I agree there are people that do..

as for your concern of proving citizenship I guess I took that for granted, again going my PA and my own experience. I needed to provide my SS number, that had to match me and my address etc. Not sure what ways there would be to fool that system and check and balance. Im sure there might be some way but I was going off the premise that the current system in PA works in that regard.
Click to expand...

Don't know the laws in PA so only had to go by what you stated.
 
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