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Is Voter Fraud a Problem?

Is Voter Fraud a Problem?

  • Total voters
    31
longview said:
I guess a good question would be what mechanisms do we have in place to know that voter fraud is not
occurring on a massive scale?
If a normal election turn out is only 50%, that implies that half of the registered voters are not voting.
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A very good question indeed. If asking for ID to prove voter fraud is forbidden, then how is proof to be collected? Imagine if detectives were not allowed to collect evidence. The left would be running around proclaiming no crimes happened because the detectives don't present proof.
 
Mithros said:
Really? Besides being an incredibly racist plan its' also a bit naive.

1). How do you get "bad hombres" registered?
2). How to you fix discrepancies between turnout and the census?
3). You'd need tens of thousands of "bad hombres" to swing an election. How do you clean your money trail.
4). Voter fraud is a serious crime, do you really thing "illegal scums" are going to risk jail time for 5$
5). How do you get them to the polls without arising suspicion? Polls are administered by your neighbors. Do you think they'd notice your "plan"?
6). There are records of everyone who voted, and lots of crazies convinced that there's fraud. Do you expect them not to find out?
7). What happens when the "bad hombres" realize they can extort far more money from you by threatening to go public with your plan?
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Wasting time. Voter or national ID card, like US passports, fixes everthing. And no on-line registrations.

Simple?
 
legalimmigrant said:
What a load of crap! How many times did you speed? How many times were you prosecuted for speeding?

Did you get it?

Or do I have to explain the difference between the rate of violations and the rate of convictions more simply?
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What you cited is irrelevant to what he posted.
 
foadi said:
Why is the Republican party pushing for absentee voting if they're so obsessed with Voter ID laws?
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My understanding at least in Virginia, is that even with absentee voting, at some point you have to prove who you are. They don't just send ballots to strangers in the mail.
 
justabubba said:
because it is an onerous expectation for an old person who does not drive
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That's bull****, because you need an ID for all kinds of things.....and no government has told those entities it isn't allowed.
 
Harshaw said:
Not voter SUPPRESSION, but voter FRAUD?

Yes, or no?
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Out of about one BILLION votes cast since the turn of the century, there have been THIRTY-ONE individual cases of voter fraud.

So no, voter fraud is NOT a problem. All it is, is an excuse for voter-suppression efforts. Or do you really think it was just a coincidence that in 2006 the GOP voted to reauthorize the Voting Rights Act almost in lockstep...but less than three years later, after we had elected our first black president, it had suddenly become right-wing dogma that the Voting Rights Act was suddenly something to be despised and discarded?
 
justabubba said:
a MASSIVE problem: 31 instances in 1000000000 votes cast
0.000000031
and that is accumulated over ten years
so add another zero to the right of the decimal to see the yearly rate of actual voter fraud
a MASSIVE problem. just do the math
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You didn't provide links to substantiate your numbers, so we are left to assume they are either made up, or could be true.

In either case, would you provide the same numbers for the actual number of people that didn't get to vote because of voter ID laws? I am having a little trouble seeing where voter ID has stopped legitimate voters in any significant numbers. You are saying that if something only happens a small percentage of the time it doesn't matter; right?
 
legalimmigrant said:
Wasting time. Voter or national ID card, like US passports, fixes everthing. And no on-line registrations.

Simple?
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Simplistic:
1). How can the federal government legally mandate that each state has to comply with a national voter ID card.
2). There are 218,000,000 people eligible to vote in the US. How will you get them voter IDs? And if your idea is to use the passport system.... well.. that's just insane.
3). To sign up that many people you'd need to build 10,000 voter ID centers, and even then it w ould take 2 years to get everyone an ID.
4). Assuming the cost was similar to a drivers license, it would cost a minimum of 10 billion dollars to fix your non-existent problem.
 
Glen Contrarian said:
Out of about one BILLION votes cast since the turn of the century, there have been THIRTY-ONE individual cases of voter fraud.

So no, voter fraud is NOT a problem. All it is, is an excuse for voter-suppression efforts. Or do you really think it was just a coincidence that in 2006 the GOP voted to reauthorize the Voting Rights Act almost in lockstep...but less than three years later, after we had elected our first black president, it had suddenly become right-wing dogma that the Voting Rights Act was suddenly something to be despised and discarded?
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You may want to read the linked article a little bit closer. It says some left wing professor did a study that found 31 incidents of fraud that voter ID could fix. In the same article, he describes all the other voter fraud that voter ID will not stop. That is a far cry from proclaiming that only 31 cases have occurred.
 
It doesn't happen often enough for it to be considered a problem, IMO.
 
natsb said:
You may want to read the linked article a little bit closer. It says some left wing professor did a study that found 31 incidents of fraud that voter ID could fix. In the same article, he describes all the other voter fraud that voter ID will not stop. That is a far cry from proclaiming that only 31 cases have occurred.
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You may want to read that article a little bit closer.

A. That he's 'left wing' or not it quite irrelevant. If you can't dispute his data or methodology, you're merely trying to discredit it in a rather transparent manner.
B. He was only addressing voter impersonation, so the other types of voter fraud are irrelevant to the veracity of his results.
 
natsb said:
You may want to read the linked article a little bit closer. It says some left wing professor did a study that found 31 incidents of fraud that voter ID could fix. In the same article, he describes all the other voter fraud that voter ID will not stop. That is a far cry from proclaiming that only 31 cases have occurred.
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Not to mention, that under the current system, we would not be able to detect many types of voter fraud if they did occur.
Consider how long it would take to identify someone who while registered to vote, has not voted in 20 years.
10 people with 10 different voter names each in 10 different precincts,
Each fraudster visits each of the 10 precincts and cast all 10 ballots, plus their own.
It could be done, and we would have no way to detect if it has already been done.
 
Glen Contrarian said:
Out of about one BILLION votes cast since the turn of the century, there have been THIRTY-ONE individual cases of voter fraud.

So no, voter fraud is NOT a problem. All it is, is an excuse for voter-suppression efforts. Or do you really think it was just a coincidence that in 2006 the GOP voted to reauthorize the Voting Rights Act almost in lockstep...but less than three years later, after we had elected our first black president, it had suddenly become right-wing dogma that the Voting Rights Act was suddenly something to be despised and discarded?
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Calm yourself.
 
Harshaw said:
Not voter SUPPRESSION, but voter FRAUD?

Yes, or no?
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Ill say the same thing here i said in the other thread
There should almost, not always but almost always be an "other" option.
My answer would other in this case but with your poll i have to vote no, thats why its flawed.
My vote would be other here cause unlike voter suppression we have not seen evidence of this having an at least known and visible impact to major elections/votes.

But again just like voter suppression even ONE fraudulent vote in the whole country IS a problem, its just not a large problem. Again It's like asking if bank robberies are a problem. Not really but of course every single one is.
 
Caine said:
How do you have YEARS to prepare for the next election, that occurs 1 year later?

You do realize that you have **** to vote for on a yearly basis right?
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I'm not sure I follow. Are you excluding non-Presidential years? What I meant was that from November 9th until November 3rd of 2020, you have years to fix glitches. But fine, let's just say that there was only one year to prepare for the upcoming election. Wasn't this one year enough?
 
justabubba said:
because it is an onerous expectation for an old person who does not drive
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Anyone can get a state ID for free. I have DL, state ID, US passport, naturalization document, and a firearm owner's ID card - all with my ugly face on them.

A total of 5 ID's. And I am just a dumb foreigner barely able to communicate in English.

So, I am not buying that liberal **** how hard it is to get a picture ID even if you are too lazy to get off your butt.

In some states, they will deliver one to you while you are on the john and give you a hug, too. All for free.

But the liberals still hate it because that devilish scheme does not fit their objectives.
 
Glen Contrarian said:
Out of about one BILLION votes cast since the turn of the century, there have been THIRTY-ONE individual cases of voter fraud.

So no, voter fraud is NOT a problem. All it is, is an excuse for voter-suppression efforts. Or do you really think it was just a coincidence that in 2006 the GOP voted to reauthorize the Voting Rights Act almost in lockstep...but less than three years later, after we had elected our first black president, it had suddenly become right-wing dogma that the Voting Rights Act was suddenly something to be despised and discarded?
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Hey, genius, why don't you try that line next time you will be returning to the US without any form of ID because immigration fraud is so rare.

My guess is that those humorless agents will just burst out laughing and promptly lock you up.

So much for that idiotic argument that if it's rare - which the voter fraud is not - no ID documents are needed.
 
Mithros said:
Simplistic:
1). How can the federal government legally mandate that each state has to comply with a national voter ID card.
2). There are 218,000,000 people eligible to vote in the US. How will you get them voter IDs? And if your idea is to use the passport system.... well.. that's just insane.
3). To sign up that many people you'd need to build 10,000 voter ID centers, and even then it w ould take 2 years to get everyone an ID.
4). Assuming the cost was similar to a drivers license, it would cost a minimum of 10 billion dollars to fix your non-existent problem.
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How can each state require a valid DL if you want to drive?

How can a state require an ID if you want to vote?

Easy. State ID's are free. Go and get it. If you are too stupid or lazy, you should not vote.
 
nota bene said:
I'm not sure I follow. Are you excluding non-Presidential years? What I meant was that from November 9th until November 3rd of 2020, you have years to fix glitches. But fine, let's just say that there was only one year to prepare for the upcoming election. Wasn't this one year enough?
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I am INCLUDING non presidential elections....

Because despite the fact that we pretend the only election that matters is that for the President, there are plenty of important elections that people ignore every year.
 
American said:
Every time I voter, I'm required to present my ID which is my drivers license. Why are leftwingers so wrapped around the axle about that requirement?
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Because then they couldn't bribe people with money,food, etc on election day to go vote for the Democrat candidate. Filling the bus with homeless, mentally ill, and criminals on election day and busing them to the polls to vote for the Democratic candidate is very common in inner city areas. Most don't have valid ID's so there goes many of the votes.
 
legalimmigrant said:
Hey, genius, why don't you try that line next time you will be returning to the US without any form of ID because immigration fraud is so rare.

My guess is that those humorless agents will just burst out laughing and promptly lock you up.

So much for that idiotic argument that if it's rare - which the voter fraud is not - no ID documents are needed.
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The idiotic argument, sir, is that hundreds of thousands - or even millions - of people would knowingly and willingly commit a felony (and put themselves at very real risk of jail time and financial ruin) to cast votes. And when it comes to illegal immigrants, such an argument is even sillier, because they would be putting themselves (and their families) at very real risk of deportation (and the concomitant financial ruin) just to cast votes.

On top of all that, in order for hundreds of thousands to cast fraudulent votes, this would REQUIRE organization and coordination - it would REQUIRE thousands and thousands of people "in the know" who would be coordinating this effort from precinct to precinct, from district to district...

...and so your theory would also REQUIRE that every single one of these coordinators would keep their mouths shut, that every single one of them would be able to resist the clarion call of riches and fame for exposing such a grand-scale conspiracy.

And THAT, sir, is the biggest hole in your theory: it is by definition a CONSPIRACY theory...and there's a really good reason why conspiracy theories are looked upon so dimly. Benjamin Franklin said it best: "Three men can keep a secret, if two of them are dead." But you, sir, are requiring that thousands and thousands are keeping the secret. Mr. Franklin had a point. You, sir, don't.
 
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