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Can a company decide whether employees are allowed to pray during unpaid breaks?

Can a company decide whether employees are allowed to pray during unpaid breaks?

  • Yes

    Votes: 7 19.4%

  • No

    Votes: 19 52.8%

  • Depends

    Votes: 5 13.9%

  • Don't care

    Votes: 5 13.9%
  • Total voters
    36
in general i think they can decide what happens on their property, but whether it violates anti discrimination laws to fire them depends on if they were fired because they were muslim, or because they were distracting others' work and customers. Since there was a separate space cordoned off, i'm thinking it's the former.

The other consideration is why they could not just go elsewhere during their break to do this, and i'm thinking that after having this room taken away, they became suspicious it was because (possibly new) management or customers disliked muslims. I can't imagine why else they'd risk their jobs instead of just go elsewhere, like smokers have to
 
mike2810 said:
Can the company set rules on when it is the employees "private time"?
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well in my state, NO amount of break is required by law and i predict if this kind of incident became more common, more companies would simply not allow any break. I'd like to see these muslims argue they were discriminated against then

although on the bright side, they'd get to leave 30 minutes earlier so they can pray sooner
 
X Factor said:
Well, unless they're bakers that don't want to bake a cake.
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or a racist who refuses to serve blacks or muslim landlord who won't rent to non muslims...

you put it as if the civil rights act hasn't existed for decades before this baker ever opened shop. Anti discrimination laws are nothing new

those laws are in place for a separate set of reasons than employees' use of the building, and the libertarians are actually incorrect about property rights in general. Hell the government can even take your land to build a shopping mall, or because they got a tip you're making medical weed, and there's little you can do

some principles like "a man's home is his castle" sound like a good idea, but then you start thinking of the paranoid schizo who builds booby traps in the driveway (i had a neighbor like this) or keeps hostages in the basement or owns the only grocery store in 30 miles and won't sell milk to minorities and suddenly it doesn't sound so great
 
chromium said:
well in my state, NO amount of break is required by law and i predict if this kind of incident became more common, more companies would simply not allow any break. I'd like to see these muslims argue they were discriminated against then

although on the bright side, they'd get to leave 30 minutes earlier so they can pray sooner
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What some are not giving the company credit for is they tried to accommodate but limited to no more than three(?) to take a break at one time. Any more would hamper the production of the plant. That was not good enough for those who walked off. Seems some are now out of a job.

From what I have seen the company is more than correct and handled the situation well.
 
mike2810 said:
What some are not giving the company credit for is they tried to accommodate but limited to no more than three(?) to take a break at one time. Any more would hamper the production of the plant. That was not good enough for those who walked off. Seems some are now out of a job.

From what I have seen the company is more than correct and handled the situation well.
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staggered breaks are common in factories. Not sure what they're thinking, they gotta pray with 10 others with em? It's not supposed to be church!

As far as production revolving around worker needs, there's a legal standard called "reasonable accommodations," which usually applies to disabilities. If what the company claims is true, that's not a reasonable demand of the workers

Reminds me of the muslim cab drivers who went on strike because the company expected them to transport *others* (customers) who drank alcohol. I'm as pro-workers' rights as anyone, but subjecting others to their own beliefs and ruining business in the process is just not something that can be tolerated
 
Like the super vast majority of things it simply "depends"
are they allowing every other prayer time but one?
are thye singling out a religion or individual?
are they making any reasonable or attempts to allow it?
In what situation is it not allowed?

I would simply need more information.

If im on my 15min break and I am sitting in my car praying and somebody comes to see what I am doing, sees me praying and says I cant or fires me they are wrong and that cant be done.

If I chose to take my 15 min break in a disruptive fashion (or hazardous/dangerous fashion) and just start praying out loud in the hallway or in somebody elses office/cub then yes they can decide.

Its circumstantial
 
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Natan said:
Exactly what claim/demand are you referring to?
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read the post above, for them to all get to take a break and go pray together at the same time, production be damned

of course, that is the company's line and i remain skeptical
 
chromium said:
read the post above, for them to all get to take a break and go pray together at the same time, production be damned of course, that is the company's line and i remain skeptical
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I didn't get that in the original article nor in the follow up story of ocean515. What did seem to have happened, is that some 190 idiots decided it was a good idea to go AWOL in protest.
 
Natan said:
From the way it is described in the article, this seems to be what happened. Now while I don't like religion, much less muslims and even less Somali muslims, it seems to me that it is not up to the company to decide what employees do on their break (much less unpaid ones) as long as it does not harm the company. Unless if there is more to this story than being reported.
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I suspect there is more to the story, not being reported. I can imagine several things, but will wait to see if it is noted by another as fact.
 
Moderate Right said:
If you're Christian then you're not allowed to pray during unpaid breaks because it might offend someone. I guess everyone else is allowed to though.
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It sure seems that way.

Maybe someone made a point of such things, requiring equal time.
 
mike2810 said:
From the OP article.
" He explained that officials with the company said it was over a 'no call, no show, walk out.'"

imo, The fired workers walked off the job to begin with. They failed to return to work.

If they were union, there is no mention the union supported the strike.
Seems the workers would have been smart to keep working and negotiate back the prayer item.

As others have stated I do not see this as a "freedom of religion issue" The person is free to practice whatever religion at home or place of religion.

For years it was ok for us to have Christmas decorations at work to celebrate Christmas. Towards the end of my career we no longer could put up Christmas decorations or Christian related themes at work. I see little difference with the employees at the plant and there wished to pray during the day.
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They were reportedly in a union however the article says CAIR, instead of the union, was attempting to do the negotiating.
 
Natan said:
From the way it is described in the article, this seems to be what happened. Now while I don't like religion, much less muslims and even less Somali muslims, it seems to me that it is not up to the company to decide what employees do on their break (much less unpaid ones) as long as it does not harm the company. Unless if there is more to this story than being reported.
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Per the article the company was providing a prayer room. Employees were splitting up breaks (paid) and lunches (unpaid) into 5-10 minute periods to go pray. So instead of two 15 min breaks, and a 30 or 60 min lunch, not sure which they have, which is pretty standard for most companies they were taking perhaps five or six 5-10 min breaks to go pray. Now from my experience most companies do not allow you to split up your break time like that. mostly because it lowers productivity.
So if they were doing it on company grounds, sometimes on company time ( paid break is still company time ) and doing this in a way which was non standard and obviously not in their union contract ( if it was the union would have intervened ), then the company has every right to take the position it did.
 
mike2810 said:
We have a winner.

Then the employees who walked off the job really have nothing to complain about other than their own bad decisions. :mrgreen:
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If the company gave them an opportunity and they walked off it is all their fault... agreed.
 
SocialD said:
They were reportedly in a union however the article says CAIR, instead of the union, was attempting to do the negotiating.
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Then they're idiots. That makes 0 sense and I hope they lose any court cases just because of how stupid of a decision that is...
 
reinoe said:
Then they're idiots. That makes 0 sense and I hope they lose any court cases just because of how stupid of a decision that is...
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could have been out of necessity
can't imagine a Local abdicating its right to represent employees, thereby allowing another organization to do so. sets terrible precedent
but being a representative of muslims seeking the ability to pray to Allah while on the job is also likely not something the blue collar rank-in-file wants to support via 'its' union
 
justabubba said:
could have been out of necessity
can't imagine a Local abdicating its right to represent employees, thereby allowing another organization to do so. sets terrible precedent
but being a representative of muslims seeking the ability to pray to Allah while on the job is also likely not something the blue collar rank-in-file wants to support via 'its' union
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The local union has more detailed knowledge about the actual contract. CAIR's concerns are not about labor, it's about seeking "justice" for Muslims. CAIR had better present a good argument about the actual contract and what's in it without trying to rely on 1st amendment yadda yadda yadda because that's not gonna fly.
 
reinoe said:
The local union has more detailed knowledge about the actual contract. CAIR's concerns are not about labor, it's about seeking "justice" for Muslims. CAIR had better present a good argument about the actual contract and what's in it without trying to rely on 1st amendment yadda yadda yadda because that's not gonna fly.
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and significantly, cair is without the authority to call a strike
it was the walk off that earned 190 their walking papers
 
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