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So-called Liberals...

Democratic Primary Choice?

  • Total voters
    57
Shadowless

Shadowless

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More like Reagan than FDR: I?m a millennial and I?ll never vote for Hillary Clinton - Salon.com

I enjoyed this article as it details how conservative Hillary Clinton actually is. I, as is the author, am a millennial voter who will NEVER vote for Clinton. As someone on the economic left, she is the antithesis to what we should be trying to accomplish. Those of you who say she is a better choice than a Republican, why are you satisfied with Republican lite? I will never understand those of you who use this flimsy argument. We have a real choice, his name is Bernie Sanders. He is the FDR of our time. He is not a radical inconsistent with American history, far from it. I understand Republicans and conservatives who dislike him, but those who call yourselves Democrats? Shame.

So....who will you be voting for if you've made up your mind?

:peace
 
Well... Hey! If the Left's going to let the latent silliness of the "No True Socialist" fallacy get in the way of it's electoral chances, I'm sure as Hell not going to complain. lol
 
Gathomas88 said:
Well... Hey! If the Left's going to let the latent silliness of the "No True Socialist" fallacy get in the way of it's electoral chances, I'm sure as Hell not going to complain. lol
Click to expand...

What do you think the right is doing right now? "No True Fascist" seems pretty accurate.
 
Shadowless said:
More like Reagan than FDR: I?m a millennial and I?ll never vote for Hillary Clinton - Salon.com

I enjoyed this article as it details how conservative Hillary Clinton actually is. I, as is the author, am a millennial voter who will NEVER vote for Clinton. As someone on the economic left, she is the antithesis to what we should be trying to accomplish. Those of you who say she is a better choice than a Republican, why are you satisfied with Republican lite? I will never understand those of you who use this flimsy argument. We have a real choice, his name is Bernie Sanders. He is the FDR of our time. He is not a radical inconsistent with American history, far from it. I understand Republicans and conservatives who dislike him, but those who call yourselves Democrats? Shame.

So....who will you be voting for if you've made up your mind?

:peace
Click to expand...

I'm a Sanders fan too, but say Clinton wins the nomination (likely) and is up against Cruz in the election. Still not gonna vote Clinton out of some notion of pure ideology?

Representative democracy is about compromise. That's the unfortunate truth. Not everyone thinks like you do, nobody is obliged to think or vote like you do, and that's part of being in a free democracy. Pragmatism is a valuable tool.
 
Shadowless said:
More like Reagan than FDR: I?m a millennial and I?ll never vote for Hillary Clinton - Salon.com

I enjoyed this article as it details how conservative Hillary Clinton actually is. I, as is the author, am a millennial voter who will NEVER vote for Clinton. As someone on the economic left, she is the antithesis to what we should be trying to accomplish. Those of you who say she is a better choice than a Republican, why are you satisfied with Republican lite? I will never understand those of you who use this flimsy argument. We have a real choice, his name is Bernie Sanders. He is the FDR of our time. He is not a radical inconsistent with American history, far from it. I understand Republicans and conservatives who dislike him, but those who call yourselves Democrats? Shame.

So....who will you be voting for if you've made up your mind?

:peace
Click to expand...

You are laboring under the false assumption that liberal is a singular, monolithic thing. It is not. Being a liberal is a kinda general thing, and there are many types of liberal. Please do us a favor and do not try and emulate republicans and their "RINO" concept.
 
Nilly said:
I'm a Sanders fan too, but say Clinton wins the nomination (likely) and is up against Cruz in the election. Still not gonna vote Clinton out of some notion of pure ideology?

Representative democracy is about compromise. That's the unfortunate truth. Not everyone thinks like you do, nobody is obliged to think or vote like you do, and that's part of being in a free democracy. Pragmatism is a valuable tool.
Click to expand...

Actually pragmatism is more often than not a cancer. For most situations there is more to lose either in the short term and or in the long term by pragmatism.
 
Henrin said:
Actually pragmatism is more often than not a cancer. For most situations there is more to lose either in the short term and or in the long term by pragmatism.
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It can be a cancer but in almost all cases it is better than just apathy, which is what happens when you simply refuse to act because none of the options perfectly line up with your ideology
 
Shadowless said:
More like Reagan than FDR: I?m a millennial and I?ll never vote for Hillary Clinton - Salon.com

I enjoyed this article as it details how conservative Hillary Clinton actually is. I, as is the author, am a millennial voter who will NEVER vote for Clinton. As someone on the economic left, she is the antithesis to what we should be trying to accomplish. Those of you who say she is a better choice than a Republican, why are you satisfied with Republican lite? I will never understand those of you who use this flimsy argument. We have a real choice, his name is Bernie Sanders. He is the FDR of our time. He is not a radical inconsistent with American history, far from it. I understand Republicans and conservatives who dislike him, but those who call yourselves Democrats? Shame.

So....who will you be voting for if you've made up your mind?

:peace
Click to expand...

Are you talking about the caucus/primaries or the general election?
 
Henrin said:
Actually pragmatism is more often than not a cancer. For most situations there is more to lose either in the short term and or in the long term by pragmatism.
Click to expand...

for a long time, pubs have "settled" for the pragmatic choice

and we keep moving farther and farther left

i hope we have learned from those past mistakes

damn...i hope so
 
Nilly said:
I'm a Sanders fan too, but say Clinton wins the nomination (likely) and is up against Cruz in the election. Still not gonna vote Clinton out of some notion of pure ideology?

Representative democracy is about compromise. That's the unfortunate truth. Not everyone thinks like you do, nobody is obliged to think or vote like you do, and that's part of being in a free democracy. Pragmatism is a valuable tool.
Click to expand...

If we had a free and fair election system, sure. I am sure you're aware of the control the Democratic party has on these matters. I will not vote for Hillary, she does not represent my views. Others are entitled to vote for her, but I choose not to. I will vote Third party as I did in 2008.
 
gdgyva said:
for a long time, pubs have "settled" for the pragmatic choice

and we keep moving farther and farther left

i hope we have learned from those past mistakes

damn...i hope so
Click to expand...

Social issues have moved left thankfully, but economic issues have been hard right for a long time, under both R's and D's.
 
Redress said:
You are laboring under the false assumption that liberal is a singular, monolithic thing. It is not. Being a liberal is a kinda general thing, and there are many types of liberal. Please do us a favor and do not try and emulate republicans and their "RINO" concept.
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A liberal does not allow wealthy institutions like wall street, banks and corporations to control the economic outcomes of the nation. That's where I draw the line.
 
Shadowless said:
Both the primary and general.
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Okay, thanks. I would not vote for Clinton in the primary, but if she gets the nomination I probably will in the general. I do support third party candidates in local elections, even state elections, but it gets a bit dicey at that level, for me anyway.
 
Alyssa T. said:
Okay, thanks. I would not vote for Clinton in the primary, but if she gets the nomination I probably will in the general. I do support third party candidates in local elections, even state elections, but it gets a bit dicey at that level, for me anyway.
Click to expand...

I understand that. The thing I would like to figure out is how economic liberals can take hold of the Democratic party once again. FDR is rated our 3rd best president ever. The Clintons reversed that at the height of the conservative movement. Big, big mistake. Now it will be hard to take the party back. The only way I can think of is a boycott of these candidates that think like Clinton, Third Way people, etc.
 
Shadowless said:
A liberal does not allow wealthy institutions like wall street, banks and corporations to control the economic outcomes of the nation. That's where I draw the line.
Click to expand...

Sorry, should have combined this with the other post. Just wanted to say I agreed with you on the line you are drawing here.
 
Redress said:
You are laboring under the false assumption that liberal is a singular, monolithic thing. It is not. Being a liberal is a kinda general thing, and there are many types of liberal. Please do us a favor and do not try and emulate republicans and their "RINO" concept.
Click to expand...

the vast majority of Republicans are liberal as well... Conservatism falls under the heading of Liberalism

ya know who arent' liberals?... Democratic Socialists.

of the 2 Democratic party candidates in question, Hillary is the only liberal.
 
Thrilla said:
the vast majority of Republicans are liberal as well... Conservatism falls under the heading of Liberalism

ya know who arent' liberals?... Democratic Socialists.

of the 2 Democratic party candidates in question, Hillary is the only liberal.
Click to expand...

if you use the UK/European political lexicon then yes, that's true. In America we have different names for political leanings.
 
Shadowless said:
I understand that. The thing I would like to figure out is how economic liberals can take hold of the Democratic party once again. FDR is rated our 3rd best president ever. The Clintons reversed that at the height of the conservative movement. Big, big mistake. Now it will be hard to take the party back. The only way I can think of is a boycott of these candidates that think like Clinton, Third Way people, etc.
Click to expand...

The party really needs a good kick. It will be very difficult to change at that high level, though.
 
Alyssa T. said:
The party really needs a good kick. It will be very difficult to change at that high level, though.
Click to expand...

As soon as the tea party hit the scene, I called for a left wing equivalent. The conservatives have active fascists running for office, we need to build up the communist/socialist parties again. This is how we can put those like Elizabeth Warren and Bernie in the "moderate" light. Many in the media consider them to be leftists, far from the truth.
 
Shadowless said:
As soon as the tea party hit the scene, I called for a left wing equivalent. The conservatives have active fascists running for office, we need to build up the communist/socialist parties again. This is how we can put those like Elizabeth Warren and Bernie in the "moderate" light. Many in the media consider them to be leftists, far from the truth.
Click to expand...

That is true. I really like Elizabeth Warren.
 
Alyssa T. said:
That is true. I really like Elizabeth Warren.
Click to expand...

I do as well. I also think the larger problem is the two party system we have. There are variants of many ideologies across both parties, it does everyone a disservice to contain these into 2 large tents.
 
Shadowless said:
A liberal does not allow wealthy institutions like wall street, banks and corporations to control the economic outcomes of the nation. That's where I draw the line.
Click to expand...

a liberal most certainly can allow those institutions to control outcomes of the economy, provided distributive justice is still a priority ,attained , and geared toward helping the less well off..

Socialists, on the hand, cannot allow those institution to control anything and will force preconceived economic outcomes to become reality, regardless of priorities.


this is one of the big differences between Liberalism and Socialism.
 
There is no democrat primary. The nomination is sewn up and has been for a long time. The only way Hillary doesnt win is if she somehow ends up in a box. If it goes to the polls...Hillary is already the democrat candidate for president before the first ballot is cast.
Clinton Has 45-To-1 'Superdelegate' Advantage Over Sanders : NPR
 
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