Do the Democrats want to win the war in Iraq? - Page 8

chevydriver1123 · 09-13-07, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 26 X World Champs

More bull****...or are you just lying or are you just so ignorant that you believe what you write?

It's grotesque to me that you are so evil that you write crap using words like "surrender" or "Hussein Obama" etc.! It seems that every single thing you write is mimicking either Michael Savage or Rush Limbaugh....who are traitors in my book so that must make you....

Your should be surprised this is the type of mind set klosted klansman like Navy, ToT and others have.

26 X World Champs · 09-13-07, 04:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Navy Pride

I think if we succeed in Iraq the dems who want to surrender there will be toast and the Republicans will take back the congress and keep the presidency.....

Since every political prediction you've ever made since you've been on this board has been wrong your prediction bodes quite well for the majority party...that the Dems....

26 X World Champs · 09-13-07, 04:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Navy Pride

They want to win as do the troops there and that is beginning to happen much to the sorrow of the democrats..........

You're lying again Navy Pride! You're slandering people and no one believes one damn word of what you write.

I will repeat what is so obvious....those Americans who accuse other Americans of being traitors because they oppose the war are themselves the traitors because those of you who do this (i.e. Navy Pride) are crapping all over free speech, our Constitution and the right of Americans to disagree with each other.

It takes a NAZI mentality to walk lockstep with one's government and to be called traitors if you do not.

mpg · 09-13-07, 04:38 PM

Has anyone ever seen the movie "Patton"? When Rommel was informed that Patton took Palermo, Rommel said "damn!". Then they show Montgomery receiving the same news and he said "damn!". Wake up people. This is how the world works. I'm not saying that the Democrats are any worse than the Republicans. The Republicans would do the same thing if the shoe was on the other foot. If things go well in Iraq between now and the 2008 elections, that will obviously hurt the Democrats' odds in those elections. If you think that they want that, I have a beautiful bridge in Brooklyn that I can sell you at a great price.

mpg · 09-13-07, 04:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 26 X World Champs

You're lying again Navy Pride! You're slandering people and no one believes one damn word of what you write.

I will repeat what is so obvious....those Americans who accuse other Americans of being traitors because they oppose the war are themselves the traitors because those of you who do this (i.e. Navy Pride) are crapping all over free speech, our Constitution and the right of Americans to disagree with each other.

It takes a NAZI mentality to walk lockstep with one's government and to be called traitors if you do not.

How do you feel about Petraeus being called "Betrayus"?

Iriemon · 09-13-07, 04:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iriemon
We have difficult work to do in Iraq. We're bringing order to parts of that country that remain dangerous. We're pursuing and finding leaders of the old regime, who will be held to account for their crimes. We've begun the search for hidden chemical and biological weapons and already know of hundreds of sites that will be investigated. We're helping to rebuild Iraq, where the dictator built palaces for himself, instead of hospitals and schools. And we will stand with the new leaders of Iraq as they establish a government of, by, and for the Iraqi people. The transition from dictatorship to democracy will take time, but it is worth every effort. Our coalition will stay until our work is done. Then we will leave, and we will leave behind a free Iraq.

and:

The goals of our coalition are clear and limited. We will end a brutal regime, whose aggression and weapons of mass destruction make it a unique threat to the world. Coalition forces will help maintain law and order, so that Iraqis can live in security. We will respect your great religious traditions, whose principles of equality and compassion are essential to Iraq’s future. We will help you build a peaceful and representative government that protects the rights of all citizens. And then our military forces will leave. Iraq will go forward as a unified, independent and sovereign nation that has regained a respected place in the world.

President George W. Bush, message to the Iraqi people, April 10, 2003

Quote:

Originally Posted by Navy Pride

I saw nothing about him saying we are leaving in 4 years.......

I agree. However, he did say we would leave when:

The goals of our coalition are clear and limited. We will end a brutal regime

Are you claiming that has not been accomplished?

We will help you build a peaceful and representative government that protects the rights of all citizens

Are you claiming the Iraqi government is not peaceful or representative that protects the rights of all citizens?

we will stand with the new leaders of Iraq as they establish a government of, by, and for the Iraqi people.

Are you claiming the government of Iraq is not by and for the the people?

Iriemon · 09-13-07, 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpg

Has anyone ever seen the movie "Patton"? When Rommel was informed that Patton took Palermo, Rommel said "damn!". Then they show Montgomery receiving the same news and he said "damn!". Wake up people. This is how the world works. I'm not saying that the Democrats are any worse than the Republicans. The Republicans would do the same thing if the shoe was on the other foot. If things go well in Iraq between now and the 2008 elections, that will obviously hurt the Democrats' odds in those elections. If you think that they want that, I have a beautiful bridge in Brooklyn that I can sell you at a great price.

I don't if it is that easy of a question.

Yes if the war is going well it will improve the Republican chances. But then again, there has been enough mistakes and error in the war to provide ammunition even if things made a drastic turnaround.

The flip side is the difference between being a new president and have an Iraq war that is winding down versus one that is in chaos.

Given the choice, I'm not sure I'd prefer the latter.

Iriemon · 09-13-07, 04:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mpg

How do you feel about Patreus being called "Betrayus"?

Personally I thought it was juvenile and rude, and only served as a tool for the Republicans to divert attention away from the real issues.

But let's not get carried away. How many times are Dems called traitors and treasonous because they have challenged the Administration's actions?

mpg · 09-13-07, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iriemon

Personally I thought it was juvenile and rude, and only served as a tool for the Republicans to divert attention away from the real issues.

But let's not get carried away. How many times are Dems called traitors and treasonous because they have challenged the Administration's actions?

I don't know. Why do you ask?

Iriemon · 09-13-07, 04:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bhkad

The fact of the matter is that you have a point. OBL is from Saudi Arabia. But Jihad is a tenet of Islam. Jihad is generally regarded as a requirement of all Muslims. There is defensive jihad to defend Islam. There is Jihad as a struggle to become a better Muslim. And there is offensive Jihad to spread the religion to the entire globe and attain leadership of all mankind.

In the personal struggle aspect of Jihad there are at least 5 different methods.

Jihad - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And in performing Jihad to spread the religion some Muslims would only dream of doing non-violent things like coming to an online forum and anonymously defending Islam or criticizing the USA. At the other end of that spectrum there are those who are willing to kill and die to help achieve the goal of a totally Islamic world.

This campaign of Jihad with the goal of global conquest has existed from the time of the Prophet, (when there were NO OTHER MUSLIMS AND NO MUSLIM TERRITORY) but lost momentum with the Westernization movement at the turn of the Century (19th/20th) and the fall of the Ottoman Empire. But the Jihadist movement was breathed to life in the mid-1960's with the publication of Sayyed Qutb's "Milestones." It caused a sensation and electrified the Muslim world and has gone on to become a legendary text and a must have for every true Muslim.

It calls for the creation of an ideologically pure vanguard of Muslims who will abandon and ignore all other pursuits and interests in things that are not approved by the Koran and by a strict literal interpretation of the Koran. And these men, starting with just a handful but growing in numbers over time, will have to use violence that is called for and justified in the Koran to wrest power away from the wicked pagan Americans.

In 1979 a young earnest Saudi college student read Milestones and was mentored by Qutb's brother and that college student was radicalized and became a violent Jihadist. His name was Osama bin Laden. But he would not be alone. Eventually he was joined by millions of others around the world in every country, not just in Saudi Arabia. And bin Laden's training camps (and his are not the only ones) have produced more than 20,000 graduates who act to plant the seeds of radicalism and harness the efforts of locals around the world who are loyal to the cause.

This ideology has spread throughout the world and all Muslims are familiar with it and no one knows from day to day what pious but otherwise moderate Muslim might wake up and decide that he needs to abandon his wicked lifestyle of Western pleasure and luxury and earn points toward securing a preferred place in Heaven by seriously pursuing offensive Jihad.

And he might start out by simply writing online and conducting meetings of the local faithful. He might become a member of the Brotherhood. He might be called upon to donate time or resources to help Hamas or Hezbollah. He might become a thorn in the side of America's law enforcement and legal system by intentionally praying in an airport waiting room or refusing to comply with some other law enforcement request.

Or he could go to a current hot spot and take up arms against the Great Satan.

The jihadist state of Iran wants to conquer or otherwise control Iraq and if they do they will gain a great deal in terms of men, materials and money which they will continue to re-invest in their efforts to create a totally Islamic world.

If we leave before the Iraqis can stand on their own we will in effect give up Iraq to an enemy which is already the leading exporter of terrorism and which has as it's goal the death of America.

The Death of America.

We are going to give them the resources they will use toward defeating freedom and liberty in the world if we leave prematurely.

We may not be able to defeat the ideology but we can deny them the territory and the resources to use to grow their campaign.

We are in a war to determine which will prevail on Earth.

Islam or Liberty.

This is the war that you should recognize and fight as though your way of life depends on it.

Because it does.

Not only all that, but Cambodia, Laos, Thialand, Signapore, Indonesia and all the rest of SE Asia will become communist too! And then the commies will take over India and the Phillipines and Japan, and it will be just one step away from the communists taking over America!

Ooooops. Wrong war. Sorry 'bout that.