View Poll Results: should civil marriage be aboloshed in favor of holy matrimony only?

Voters
35. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes, because it will stop gay marriage

    0 0%
  • Yes, because everybody in the US should be part of a religion

    0 0%
  • Yes, because most people in the US do not want there to be gay marriage

    0 0%
  • Yes, because there should never have been civil marriage in the first place

    6 17.14%
  • No, because gays can also get married in some churches

    8 22.86%
  • No, because people should be free to also have no religion and be able to marry

    26 74.29%
  • No, because most people support gay marriage

    9 25.71%
  • No, because it is right that there is something like civil marriage

    11 31.43%
  • I don't care, I am already married and I do not plan to re-marry

    0 0%
  • I am unmarried and will never marry, I hate being shackled to some man/woman

    0 0%
Multiple Choice Poll.
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Thread: Republican Steve King wants an abolish civil marriage in the United States

  1. #211
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    Re: Republican Steve King wants an abolish civil marriage in the United States

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    The kind of man who doesn't want to later take responsibility for her not getting/having relevant job skills and/or education, and/or job experience that would leave him paying alimony for choosing the woman he did. Alimony is not something that is paid lightly. It is rarely a part of divorce at all nowdays. When it is, it is for good cause. Generally it is because the decision was mutually made for one person to stay home while the other worked.

    There are alternatives to paying alimony, such as not leaving a spouse you know will get alimony. If you aren't going to leave because she/he won't get a job, then why would you leave later for other reasons and not expect to pay alimony? If it is something they did, then that should be taken into account when it comes to whether they get alimony and how much. But being the sole moneymaker in a relationship has advantages, advantages that can cause a big power differential in the relationship, and lead to abuse (not all abuse is physical).
    Your argument for how the state proves it was a mutual decision was completely asinine and if that is their standard then frankly it only helps my case against it even more.

  2. #212
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    Re: Republican Steve King wants an abolish civil marriage in the United States

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    what are these reasons?..
    I don't care about govt recognition... i'ts the policies that are relevant... recognizing marriage is useless symbolism.
    as it stands now, many are penalized by the tax code for being married, while many social program recipients are rewarded for being single.... sometimes they can't even get assistance if they are married.
    so ,yeah, i think we're beyond promoting marriage or family and well into promoting singlehood and breaking up families.... not in every case mind you, but far too many for the govt to be considered to be promoting families of any kind.
    our govt still sides with the mother when it comes to children, so it's not like they are interested in fathers as equals.. so it really can't be argued that our govt supports families anymore.... hell, they support public school more than parents when it comes to the children... so yeah... we might just be a lot better off without the kind of "support" they lend families of any kind.
    Some are penalized by the tax code for being married, others benefit from it. Overall, there is very little difference to what people pay in taxes for having a married or single option. However, there are things that would be much harder to calculate without that option, especially when married people own things together. There is also the advantages that this gives the government in deciding divorce, having a set procedure for this thing. There are many other things as well. It saves time and money in so many different areas of our lives, for both the couple and society, including various levels of government within society. Legal marriage also does discourage people from breaking up on a whim, without making it completely impossible to do so.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  3. #213
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    Re: Republican Steve King wants an abolish civil marriage in the United States

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    Your argument for how the state proves it was a mutual decision was completely asinine and if that is their standard then frankly it only helps my case against it even more.
    The state doesn't prove anything. The state isn't involved except to believe one side or the other or both. That is all. They are the arbitrator in divorce, not an actual party.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  4. #214
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    Re: Republican Steve King wants an abolish civil marriage in the United States

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    The state doesn't prove anything. The state isn't involved except to believe one side or the other or both. That is all. They are the arbitrator in divorce, not an actual party.
    Yes. So when the woman said he consented to her staying at home your argument made very clear the state would assume he consented if he never divorced her. Of course it's stupid to assume a man would divorce a woman for staying at home, but sure, lets just go with the idea that he consented if he stayed married.
    Last edited by Henrin; 07-04-15 at 09:41 AM.

  5. #215
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    Re: Republican Steve King wants an abolish civil marriage in the United States

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    well, as we've basically given up promoting nuclear families as benefiting society, the government might as well give up the whole marriage thing.
    Just because it is no longer man woman child? You want to give it up? I think the number of families benefiting society will go up big time. They can adopt children and form nuclear families of a bit different kind. The nucleus family has been destroyed by all them divorces anyway so more marriages is a good thing IMHO. It brings in extra money all around from wedding ceremonies, house buying, etc. etc. etc.
    If his own campaign does not trust him with a twitter account, how can anyone trust Donald Trump with the nuclear codes?

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    Re: Republican Steve King wants an abolish civil marriage in the United States

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    He's not calling for the end of marriage just of civil unions. This is a temper tantrum to stop gay marriage.

    As a married person I'm sure he didn't just start realizing the host of benefits conferred to married couples over people that co-habitats. If someone has a view that the government should have nothing to do with marriage at all I don't agree but it's a valid point. Pulling the benefits away solely because you don't like a Supreme Court decision is petty.
    Yes, there was a time when it made sense as public policy to reward marriage as marriage was the center of procreation and child raising. Now most children are born outside of marriage and many married couples have no desire for children. About 30% of income inequality is due to the fact that people marry people in their same economic potential. Government money spent (through tax breaks, etc.), for marriage is better spent on people with children and not on subsidizing the top 30% who are currently benefiting. (Ignoring the top 5% or so who are minimally affected by marriage benefits)

    The arguments that the LGBT community had against hetero-only marriages made sense. What doesn't make sense are special benefits that add to income inequality and are not given to those unable to get married.
    Last edited by Eric7216; 07-05-15 at 01:44 AM.

  7. #217
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    Re: Republican Steve King wants an abolish civil marriage in the United States

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    The government is involved in personal living arrangements because they are involved in recognition of legal kinship. Refer to birth certificates and adoptions. There is also the fact that people, in general, want the government involved in these personal relationships. The majority would not be happy with giving up marriage, especially not if they knew exactly what it meant to do this.
    OK, if you say so. I will continue to look at declining marriage rates and watch as the majority or adults become unmarried.

    Marriage seems like an archaic concept at this point with out of wedlock children and so many unmarried. I think that economics is at play as most can live fulfilling lives without a mate to split costs and provide support.

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    Re: Republican Steve King wants an abolish civil marriage in the United States

    Quote Originally Posted by Eric7216 View Post
    OK, if you say so. I will continue to look at declining marriage rates and watch as the majority or adults become unmarried.

    Marriage seems like an archaic concept at this point with out of wedlock children and so many unmarried. I think that economics is at play as most can live fulfilling lives without a mate to split costs and provide support.
    It is a changing concept. But at the moment, the majority of people think marriage is a good thing, even if fewer are entering into it. That doesn't necessarily mean that most of those want to not be married. I'm pretty sure that my cousin would love to get married one day. But with 3 children, two of which are adults, it makes it hard for her. It is likely that she may never marry, but it has nothing to do with not wanting to get married or thinking that marriage is outdated, only with her not finding a guy she wants to marry that also wants to marry her. Out of 15 grandchildren on my mom's side, 2 are married. Likely, I will see several more of my siblings and cousins get married within the next 10 years or so (one is actually already talking about it, but they need to work out some important issues). But even those that might not get married it is not because of lack of interest or desire to marry (not from what they have told me), but rather many other reasons.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  9. #219
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    Re: Republican Steve King wants an abolish civil marriage in the United States

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    "Waaaaahhhhhhh...since the gays can play I'm taking my toys and going home".

    Nobody cares what that geriatric **** thinks.
    This would apply if the toys belonged to the religious. It's clear that it doesn't. Now, they want to take the toys away from everyone else.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Republican Steve King wants an abolish civil marriage in the United States

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    This would apply if the toys belonged to the religious. It's clear that it doesn't. Now, they want to take the toys away from everyone else.
    Much like southern conservatives seemingly rediscovered small government principles through Barry Goldwater in order to not socialize with black folk, and Dick Armey found God in order to not boot Newt, conservatives have found libertarianism to mask their utterly irrational hatred of homosexuals.
    Last edited by Fiddytree; 07-05-15 at 03:52 AM.
    "We all of us know down here that politics is a tough game. And I don't think there's any point in being Irish if you don't know that the world is going to break your heart eventually."-Daniel Patrick Moynihan, December 5, 1963

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