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Should children be required to vaccinate in order to attend School?

Should children be required to vaccinate in order to attend School?

  • Total voters
    60
Roses are red, violets are blue...vaccinations work. If it against your beliefs, you can home school!
 
I think much of the controversy with vaccines is due to lack of education. Some people believe that pharmaceutical companies create these vaccines. They believe these vaccines make people sick to keep the pharmaceutical business growing.
Most of us don't have that perception. But that seems like the worst of the worst reasons to dislike vaccines. I think if we could find a way to calm these peoples fears, we would have calmed the majority of peoples fears.
 
Un-Vaccinated kids come from a variety of sources.

1) Their parents cant get their **** together to keep them vaccinated, mostly because they are poor or just bad parents. This is by far the largest group. We lose sight of this in the entire antivax controversy. We should basically force these kids to get vaccinated, and make it much, much easier and cheaper to get vaccines.

2) Religious exemptions. Very small group. Seems reasonable to OK it, but I would require onerous paperwork to discourage people in group #1 to claim they are Christian Scientists or something.

3) Medical exemptions. These kids are fine if everyone else is vaccinated. Small group. Let them attend school.

4) Anti vaxxers who are just plain stupid, or like to watch Dr. Oz and Jenny McCarthy and read Joseph Mercola. Vaccine or homeschool. And a mandatory visit from DCFS to check if they are sane enough to raise children.
 
Threegoofs said:
Un-Vaccinated kids come from a variety of sources.

1) Their parents cant get their **** together to keep them vaccinated, mostly because they are poor or just bad parents. This is by far the largest group. We lose sight of this in the entire antivax controversy. We should basically force these kids to get vaccinated, and make it much, much easier and cheaper to get vaccines.

2) Religious exemptions. Very small group. Seems reasonable to OK it, but I would require onerous paperwork to discourage people in group #1 to claim they are Christian Scientists or something.

3) Medical exemptions. These kids are fine if everyone else is vaccinated. Small group. Let them attend school.

4) Anti vaxxers who are just plain stupid, or like to watch Dr. Oz and Jenny McCarthy and read Joseph Mercola. Vaccine or homeschool. And a mandatory visit from DCFS to check if they are sane enough to raise children.
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Group #1, indeed all of this, is easy enough to handle, any kid who shows up the first day of school without a vaccination record or a medical exemption gets a needle in their arm. No exceptions.
 
Cephus said:
Group #1, indeed all of this, is easy enough to handle, any kid who shows up the first day of school without a vaccination record or a medical exemption gets a needle in their arm. No exceptions.
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Who should I sue first?
 
Depends on which vaccines. The government shouldn't have the ability to force all vaccines across the board, just specific ones... like the old school ones.

Though, I think there is some muddiness to be found in the matter of the government forcing medical procedures. That most people agree with the law doesn't change the fact.
 
Threegoofs said:
Un-Vaccinated kids come from a variety of sources.

1) Their parents cant get their **** together to keep them vaccinated, mostly because they are poor or just bad parents. This is by far the largest group. We lose sight of this in the entire antivax controversy. We should basically force these kids to get vaccinated, and make it much, much easier and cheaper to get vaccines.

2) Religious exemptions. Very small group. Seems reasonable to OK it, but I would require onerous paperwork to discourage people in group #1 to claim they are Christian Scientists or something.

3) Medical exemptions. These kids are fine if everyone else is vaccinated. Small group. Let them attend school.

4) Anti vaxxers who are just plain stupid, or like to watch Dr. Oz and Jenny McCarthy and read Joseph Mercola. Vaccine or homeschool. And a mandatory visit from DCFS to check if they are sane enough to raise children.
Click to expand...
Nice list. I think that about covers it.


Cephus said:
Yourself for being stupid.
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Ok, I seriously belly laughed at this.
 
Cephus said:
Group #1, indeed all of this, is easy enough to handle, any kid who shows up the first day of school without a vaccination record or a medical exemption gets a needle in their arm. No exceptions.
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Yep. But the Conservatives whine about the cost, so that's out.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
There are no cancer patients in public school? There are no immune compromised kids in public school? I remember one of my classmates being treated for leukemia when I was in 7th grade. He depended upon everyone being vaccinated around him and thus there being herd immunity. Not a problem back then because we did not have a bunch anti-vax idiots getting their medical advice from celebrities, arguments from ignorance, and thoroughly discredited studies.

Frankly the school requirement is simply the stick used to bring up vaccination rates to the levels needed to safe guard public health. We adopted two girls from China, they could not come to the United States until they were current on their vaccinations. There is a reason for that. In my opinion these idiots that want the freedom not to vaccinate should pack it up and move to a country with a public health system more conducive to their personal views like DR Congo or Haiti.
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I think the government has done a horrible job at making the case for why. Until reading your posts my understanding of the motive was Mom and Dad aren't good enough parents in our, the liberal politicians' view, so we're going to force them to make the parental choices we would make because we know what's better for their children than they do. Thanks
 
Threegoofs said:
Yep. But the Conservatives whine about the cost, so that's out.
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I wonder what the cost of the 1918 Spanish Flu epidemic was? Anyone want to complain about that?
 
Northern Light said:
Depends on which vaccines. The government shouldn't have the ability to force all vaccines across the board, just specific ones... like the old school ones.
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I think the CDC should be able to add different required vaccines to the basics, based on the current situation. You never know what's out there this year.

Though, I think there is some muddiness to be found in the matter of the government forcing medical procedures. That most people agree with the law doesn't change the fact.
Click to expand...

It's insane not to force this kind of thing. Back when ebola was a big deal, if someone who had the disease said they refused medical treatment, they were going to go walking around in public spreading it to unsuspecting people, they'd have been thrown in the back of a truck and put in quarantine whether they liked it or not. Welcome to reality. The public's health is more important than the individual's rights.
 
Cephus said:
I think the CDC should be able to add different required vaccines to the basics, based on the current situation. You never know what's out there this year.
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I think they should be able to form strongly recommended lists of yearly vaccines, that are not enforceable. I know we all like to think that vaccines are just about public welfare but there are major politicoeconomic forces at work when it comes to these medicines.

Cephus said:
It's insane not to force this kind of thing. Back when ebola was a big deal, if someone who had the disease said they refused medical treatment, they were going to go walking around in public spreading it to unsuspecting people, they'd have been thrown in the back of a truck and put in quarantine whether they liked it or not. Welcome to reality. The public's health is more important than the individual's rights.
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I won't be drawn into a hypothetical scenario about ebola, because it never happened. It's a half-baked bait and switch argument and it's intellectually dishonest.

Some vaccines have a higher failure rate because they are based on lab born strains and not wild strains. There are many documented cases of children getting the MMR and still contracting mumps from other children who got sick from the wild strains. Diseases are constantly mutating. A friend of the family got the mumps vaccine as a child and at 19 years old he contracted mumps. There are no guarantees. Then there is also the issue of potential auto-immune disease, and autism. I read a really interesting book recently called "Gut and Psychology Syndrome" by Dr Natasha Campbell-McBride which addresses this issue. Her focus is mainly on diet as a means of correcting childhood disorders but her treatise on vaccines is really fascinating from a scientific perspective.

Anyway, regardless if you think the counter-science is bunk or not, I completely disagree with the State forcing medical procedures on people, especially with the backing of multi-billion dollar transnational drug companies. There is too much conflict of interest. We should all have a choice. I'd be willing to home school my children rather than let the State dictate what goes into their bodies. That kind of non-sense happened a lot in the eugenics era and we had an entire generation of children being silently experimented on with drugs and procedures that had questionable safety standards. I don't trust drug companies, not one iota. If you want to be spoon fed their spiel about how great their drugs are, then that's your choice for you and your family, and none of my business.

I also don't appreciate your whole "welcome to reality, nah nah nah boo boo" jab. Last time I checked we live in a democratic republic. Discussion and if necessary correction of public policy is part of the polity.
 
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Yes.

Overall public good supersedes everything else.
 
Vaccinated for what? You can't make such a general question. Depends on what diseases and multiple vaccinations should NOT be given at once - and not close together.
 
Northern Light said:
Depends on which vaccines. The government shouldn't have the ability to force all vaccines across the board, just specific ones... like the old school ones.

Though, I think there is some muddiness to be found in the matter of the government forcing medical procedures. That most people agree with the law doesn't change the fact.
Click to expand...

That's what I was thinking. Certain ones can be mandated but not all. I mean who wants to be the guinea pig for an ebola vaccine? Certainly not me. I would prefer to wait a decade or so and check out any sort of side effects. Remember the swine flu vaccine that everyone rushed to get because it was "going to get us all?" It was pulled after killing and maiming people and they had to pay. I don't want to see that sort of thing again.

Hundreds of Children Brain Damaged by the Swine Flu Vaccine to Receive $90 Million in Financial Compensation from UK Government | Global Research - Centre for Research on Globalization
 
maquignon said:
Vaccinated for what? You can't make such a general question. Depends on what diseases and multiple vaccinations should NOT be given at once - and not close together.
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Experts say otherwise.
 
Carjosse said:
In this case public health interests override ridiculous religious or personal beliefs. I never said anything about getting rid of medical exemptions, obviously you cannot give someone who is allergic a vaccine. In order for your youngest cousin to be safe, the maximum number of people possible have to have the vaccine.
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I agree. I'm not anti vaccine by any means, I just realize that they can be dangerous for some. I was vaccinated for everything they vaccinated against. Didn't vaccinate against chicken pox in the 80's, I got them same everyone else. I just hope my almost 3 year old cousin grows out of all his allergies, some kids do. My eye doctor's niece did.
 
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