View Poll Results: Would we as a country be better of if there had been no slavery here?

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    16 88.89%
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Thread: Would we all be better off if we had never had slaves?

  1. #61
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    Re: Would we all be better off if we had never had slaves?

    Quote Originally Posted by tech30528 View Post
    Neither do I. For all the complaining, the government checks seem to be enough to make up for it.
    And maybe, just maybe even the descendants of slaves enjoy being free and having opportunity. Moreover, most of them have never been to Africa and have no idea what part of that large continent their ancestors came from.

    Most welfare recipients are not the descendants of slaves, BTW.
    Can't we just turn Congress off and then turn it back on again?



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    Re: Would we all be better off if we had never had slaves?

    The country wouldn't be nearly as wealthy. Probably would have severely postponed our industrial revolution. Possibly even inhibited our ability to be effective help for WWI.
    "Half full or half empty doesn't matter. What matters is, you've only got half a glass...so what are you going to do about it?" - Me
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  3. #63
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    Re: Would we all be better off if we had never had slaves?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    And maybe, just maybe even the descendants of slaves enjoy being free and having opportunity. Moreover, most of them have never been to Africa and have no idea what part of that large continent their ancestors came from.

    Most welfare recipients are not the descendants of slaves, BTW.
    No, of course not. We have our share of welfare takers here in a county that is less than 2% black. I would venture to say many are multi generational as well. But for as good as they have it, there sure does seem to be a lot of complaining of it not being enough, and that lack of perspective of what life would be like over there doesn't help.

  4. #64
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    Re: Would we all be better off if we had never had slaves?

    Change any major event in history, such as the slave trade, the Civil War, or WWII and most of us posting on this board would not exist.

  5. #65
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    Re: Would we all be better off if we had never had slaves?

    Quote Originally Posted by BrewerBob View Post
    Change any major event in history, such as the slave trade, the Civil War, or WWII and most of us posting on this board would not exist.
    Nothing personal, and it's hardly just you in this thread who's engaged in this, but this kind of pedantic thinking is frustrating in that it blocks all dialogue on whether we, as a nation (or hell, even as a global community), would be better off had some atrocity not taken place. So would I have existed had the Holocaust not happened? I would go so far as to guarantee that I would not. Should the Holocaust have happened? Absolutely ****ing not. I refuse to participate in first person exceptionalism by endorsing the Holocaust simply by virtue of that fact that it led to my existence.

    And I believe that regardless of who would or would not have been born as a result of taking your DeLorean to the colonization of the Americas and stopping slavery dead in its tracks, the country as a whole would be objectively better off. The racial and cultural division in this country can be traced back to slavery, and it has paralyzed us and prevented us from moving forward in numerous ways.

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    Re: Would we all be better off if we had never had slaves?

    Quote Originally Posted by SocialDemocrat View Post
    The existence of slavery in the United States was immoral, and the country would be better off if slavery had not been practiced here just because of that. Slavery brought with it many societal ills however, such as the racism that continued to exist after abolition. The Civil War would probably not have happened, and the North-South cultural divide probably would be far less emphasized.
    Morality is widely variable and should not be dictated by government. I believe abortion is immoral. I handle this by not getting one, but I am not willing to legislate it away. And the Civil War could very well have happened since slavery was not the only issue. It began over commerce issues between the north and south.

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    Re: Would we all be better off if we had never had slaves?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Well, no, unfortunately it's not the end of the story at all. That's part of why slavery was so horrible: its repercussions are felt to this day.
    I suspect it may happen here again actually. Given that the fauxrage is leading us to erase a part of our history, it is entirely possible that a couple of hundred years of revisionism will leave future generations with no idea that we ever had it or how it was resolve. Hell, many people in this thread think the war started over slavery. So it has already begun.

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    Re: Would we all be better off if we had never had slaves?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Nothing personal, and it's hardly just you in this thread who's engaged in this, but this kind of pedantic thinking is frustrating in that it blocks all dialogue on whether we, as a nation (or hell, even as a global community), would be better off had some atrocity not taken place. So would I have existed had the Holocaust not happened? I would go so far as to guarantee that I would not. Should the Holocaust have happened? Absolutely ****ing not. I refuse to participate in first person exceptionalism by endorsing the Holocaust simply by virtue of that fact that it led to my existence.

    And I believe that regardless of who would or would not have been born as a result of taking your DeLorean to the colonization of the Americas and stopping slavery dead in its tracks, the country as a whole would be objectively better off. The racial and cultural division in this country can be traced back to slavery, and it has paralyzed us and prevented us from moving forward in numerous ways.
    You know what? You are right. It annoys me when people do that as well and I went and did the same thing. Apologies.

  9. #69
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    Re: Would we all be better off if we had never had slaves?

    Some of Obamas relatives were slave owners according to an article I read.

  10. #70
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    Re: Would we all be better off if we had never had slaves?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Nothing personal, and it's hardly just you in this thread who's engaged in this, but this kind of pedantic thinking is frustrating in that it blocks all dialogue on whether we, as a nation (or hell, even as a global community), would be better off had some atrocity not taken place. So would I have existed had the Holocaust not happened? I would go so far as to guarantee that I would not. Should the Holocaust have happened? Absolutely ****ing not. I refuse to participate in first person exceptionalism by endorsing the Holocaust simply by virtue of that fact that it led to my existence.
    Whether or not an event in history should have happened and whether or not we would be better off if that event never happened are two separate things. Everyone can agree that certain events in history should have never happened. But whether or not we as a whole would be better off had those events in history never happened is a completely different story. Because those negative events in history have shaped the world in general.

    And I believe that regardless of who would or would not have been born as a result of taking your DeLorean to the colonization of the Americas and stopping slavery dead in its tracks, the country as a whole would be objectively better off. The racial and cultural division in this country can be traced back to slavery, and it has paralyzed us and prevented us from moving forward in numerous ways.
    There is no way of knowing that.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

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