View Poll Results: Do you feel Christians are Discriminated against in America?

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  • Yes

    11 15.07%
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Thread: Do you feel Christians are Discriminated against in America?

  1. #181
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    Re: Do you feel Christians are Discriminated against in America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dittohead not! View Post
    And, I'd really like to hear the answer to that second question.
    I spoke clumsily there, since unless they actually admit to being paid shills then of course I can't claim to know it. So while I shouldn't have stated it as though it were factual, I do believe it based on the steadfast devotion of certain members' posting history on such a specific topic. They genuinely do treat it like it's their job.

    Take that as you will.

  2. #182
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    Re: Do you feel Christians are Discriminated against in America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    While I support the creation of a safe room for religious people, I do have a big, big problem with religious threads moved into the damn religion forum after the fact. That is absolutely not cool.
    Me too.

    And, I'd like to hear about those "paid shills" on the environment subforum. I've suspected as much myself, but haven't been able to find any proof.
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  3. #183
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    Re: Do you feel Christians are Discriminated against in America?

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    I disagree that they acted like "dicks". All they said was they wouldn't serve pizza at a hypothetical gay wedding. That isn't exactly a horrific comment. And in response they got death threats. If death threats are an expected response to people voicing their opinions, this country is in trouble.
    Which is a dickish position, no different than if they had said they wouldn't provide pizza at a hypothetical black wedding. Some views, no matter what your justification, are not acceptable in modern society. While I certainly don't think anyone, ever, ought to get death threats for anything, let's be honest, most serious death threats come from the religious. Even for those who aren't going to shoot you, they still think heretics deserve to burn forever in eternal hellfire. We also have to remember that this is the Internet and like it or not, there are trolls and anyone who takes trolls seriously, which I assume virtually all of the threats came from trolls, probably ought to log off permanently.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  4. #184
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    Re: Do you feel Christians are Discriminated against in America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    They are treated that way for the same reason the conspiracy theorists are treated that way and the other crazies, etc. It's because these people are making claims that they are completely and totally unable to support or defend or provide evidence for and they SHOULD BE TREATED THAT WAY! God is a fairy tale for adults who ought to know better. It's just pathetic that so many people don't. That you find critical thinking and rational evaluation somehow discriminatory is very telling.
    Except that I don't find critical thinking and rational evaluation discriminatory. I'm pretty sure that I've never said such a thing. Nor have I once endorsed organized religions beliefs on DP, or any other forum for that matter.

    What IS discriminatory is actively trying to drown them out of any discussion regarding their beliefs. Just as it was discriminatory for Christians to try and drown out the LGBT community when the LGBT community was asking for equal Rights.
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  5. #185
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    Re: Do you feel Christians are Discriminated against in America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    Which is a dickish position, no different than if they had said they wouldn't provide pizza at a hypothetical black wedding. Some views, no matter what your justification, are not acceptable in modern society. While I certainly don't think anyone, ever, ought to get death threats for anything, let's be honest, most serious death threats come from the religious. Even for those who aren't going to shoot you, they still think heretics deserve to burn forever in eternal hellfire. We also have to remember that this is the Internet and like it or not, there are trolls and anyone who takes trolls seriously, which I assume virtually all of the threats came from trolls, probably ought to log off permanently.
    I don't want to derail this thread, so I'll stop after I say this. I don't believe any business owner should be compelled to do business with someone if it isn't a good fit. I also wouldn't expect the black pizza parlor owners to have to deliver pizzas to a wedding of KKK members. There is a reasonable line in every situation and it's better to understand why people think as they do and attempt to reason with them rather than threaten.

    None of that deserves death threats. And I don't believe that the death threats they got were from other religious people.

    And I truly believe they will be discriminated against at some point because you have to be an idiot to believe there aren't a lot of people who detest religious people and religious beliefs.
    Last edited by tres borrachos; 06-28-15 at 06:44 PM.
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  6. #186
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    Re: Do you feel Christians are Discriminated against in America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    It's worth about as much as pointing to Google. It's a lazy response for someone who has no real sources but can't be honest about it. I trust you're not surprised.
    Funny, I was asked for proof and you just admitted here that doing anything that most normal people do to get that proof to you is "lazy" and "can't be honest". Guess that shows that you didn't even have any intention of taking any sort of link I provided as proof of discrimination as actual proof. You were ready and quite willing to dismiss it out of ignorance.
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    Re: Do you feel Christians are Discriminated against in America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Funny, I was asked for proof and you just admitted here that doing anything that most normal people do to get that proof to you is "lazy" and "can't be honest". Guess that shows that you didn't even have any intention of taking any sort of link I provided as proof of discrimination as actual proof. You were ready and quite willing to dismiss it out of ignorance.
    By "pointing to google" I'm pretty sure he meant linking to the home google search page. Obviously we would consider any links to relevant stories. It's a silly challenge in any case and I wouldn't have posited it myself: there are 300,000,000 people in the United States so obviously if you google hard enough you're going to find some instance of a business owner discriminating against Christian employees, or a restaurant turning away Christian people. Three hundred million people is a pretty large pool for finding awful humans. The point though is whether such discrimination is systematic in any way or, god forbid, actually condoned by the government.

    Going back to the other point about it being silly to throw out the challenge of "find just one case," interestingly enough nobody could actually come up with a single example of businesses discriminating against Christian customers. As a result, Conservatives were "forced" to manufacture outrageous troll videos depicting people going into Muslim bakeries asking for crap like "Muhammed sucks" or some such nonsense on their cakes.

    Point is, Christians don't suffer discrimination, and in fact I'm almost inclined to say that they've been so perfectly insulated by their majority status that a lot of them honestly don't even know what it is. So when they face a public backlash for their practice of discrimination or wanting people to live by Christian morals, they're so baffled by the challenge to their majority reach that they don't even have a word for it, so they grasp for the first one at hand and call it "discrimination."

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    Re: Do you feel Christians are Discriminated against in America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    What IS discriminatory is actively trying to drown them out of any discussion regarding their beliefs. Just as it was discriminatory for Christians to try and drown out the LGBT community when the LGBT community was asking for equal Rights.
    Except nobody is trying to drown them out, in fact, we're often begging them to actually support any of their views and produce evidence for any of their claims. They're just entirely incapable of doing so. Asking that they defend their assertions isn't discrimination, it's a fundamental cornerstone of debate! It's really pathetic that you, a moderator, are totally unaware of that on a debate forum.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Do you feel Christians are Discriminated against in America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kal'Stang View Post
    Funny, I was asked for proof and you just admitted here that doing anything that most normal people do to get that proof to you is "lazy" and "can't be honest". Guess that shows that you didn't even have any intention of taking any sort of link I provided as proof of discrimination as actual proof. You were ready and quite willing to dismiss it out of ignorance.
    You were asked for proof. You did not provide proof. You did not point to anything specific. You posted a general link and pretty much said "go look for it yourself". That is not proof. That is wimping out.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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    Re: Do you feel Christians are Discriminated against in America?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    By "pointing to google" I'm pretty sure he meant linking to the home google search page. Obviously we would consider any links to relevant stories. It's a silly challenge in any case and I wouldn't have posited it myself: there are 300,000,000 people in the United States so obviously if you google hard enough you're going to find some instance of a business owner discriminating against Christian employees, or a restaurant turning away Christian people. Three hundred million people is a pretty large pool for finding awful humans. The point though is whether such discrimination is systematic in any way or, god forbid, actually condoned by the government.
    You might be right about the google home page. But even then, its still a valid resource. Doing such is like saying "here! pick your choice, there's lots of choices to pick from!".

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Going back to the other point about it being silly to throw out the challenge of "find just one case," interestingly enough nobody could actually come up with a single example of businesses discriminating against Christian customers. As a result, Conservatives were "forced" to manufacture outrageous troll videos depicting people going into Muslim bakeries asking for crap like "Muhammed sucks" or some such nonsense on their cakes.
    Why exactly did they have to manufacture such video's in the first place? Is it because there's more focus on the negative aspects of Christians in this particular area than of Muslims? If so...why is that? Because the videos, even if "forced" to be made did show exactly the same things that Christians were being accused of. Yet there was no outcry about that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    Point is, Christians don't suffer discrimination, and in fact I'm almost inclined to say that they've been so perfectly insulated by their majority status that a lot of them honestly don't even know what it is. So when they face a public backlash for their practice of discrimination or wanting people to live by Christian morals, they're so baffled by the challenge to their majority reach that they don't even have a word for it, so they grasp for the first one at hand and call it "discrimination."
    So because its not "systemic" in your opinion then its ok to ignore the, in your opinion, "minor" instances of discrimination? Why?

    And do you realize that you just admitted that there is indeed discrimination going on towards Christians?
    I have an answer for everything...you may not like the answer or it may not satisfy your curiosity..but it will still be an answer. ~ Kal'Stang

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