View Poll Results: Is traditional marriage a Constitutional right?

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  • yes

    11 52.38%
  • no

    10 47.62%
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Thread: traditional marriage

  1. #51
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    Re: traditional marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Lutherf View Post
    Would there be such a thing as "no fault divorce" if government didn't regulate (not just recognize) marriage?
    Well welcome to modern civilization. Governments have always regulated marriage. Before the separation of church and state,the church via government did a lot more regulating of marriage than they do now.
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  2. #52
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    Re: traditional marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    Well they forgot to tell the government then.
    You misinterpreted what I said

    The people decided to give the government the powers you decry.
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  3. #53
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    Re: traditional marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Our opinion on what is and is not constitutional is irrelevant. The only opinions that actually matter are those in the federal court system, and if it goes before SCOTUS, the opinion of the majority of justices. If the majority of justices ruled that you have a constitutional right to kick a Texan, then for all intents and purposes, that would be your constitutional right.
    That is a fallacy.

    For the Supremes to rule that you have a constitutional right to kick a Texan, that right must be stated in the Constitution. The Supremes cannot just "declare" a right that doesn't exist.

    Having said that, it's obvious from various rulings that the Supremes now THINK they have the ability to do that and, since there is no appeal allowed after the Supreme Court rules, we are stuck with it until a later Supreme Court strikes down their own ruling.
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  4. #54
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    Re: traditional marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Fearandloathing View Post
    ?


    There are people who don't know that?
    Apparently.

    Please, gay marriage has been legal here since 1997

    Thanks for your input
    No problem. Were their marriages recognized in US? For instance, a Canadian married SS couple moves to US in 1999, would their marriage still be recognized as legal?

  5. #55
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    Re: traditional marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    That is a fallacy.

    For the Supremes to rule that you have a constitutional right to kick a Texan, that right must be stated in the Constitution. The Supremes cannot just "declare" a right that doesn't exist.

    Having said that, it's obvious from various rulings that the Supremes now THINK they have the ability to do that and, since there is no appeal allowed after the Supreme Court rules, we are stuck with it until a later Supreme Court strikes down their own ruling.
    Which means that for all intents and purposes, if SCOTUS says you have a right, you have a right.

    That said, your argument is flawed anyway. The constitution does not grant you rights, it limits the power of government. In fact, there was great concern at the time of drafting the original Bill of Rights that if they were included in the constitution, some authoritarian in the future would think that was the only rights citizens had.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

  6. #56
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    Re: traditional marriage

    Marriage is not a Constitutional right. Equal treatment under the law is.

  7. #57
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    Re: traditional marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Our opinion on what is and is not constitutional is irrelevant. The only opinions that actually matter are those in the federal court system, and if it goes before SCOTUS, the opinion of the majority of justices. If the majority of justices ruled that you have a constitutional right to kick a Texan, then for all intents and purposes, that would be your constitutional right.
    The SCOTUS is comprised of humans, and is therefore fallible.
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

  8. #58
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    Re: traditional marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by mpg View Post
    This is about a consenting man and a consenting woman who aren't related and are of sound mind and body. Is it a Constitutional right?

    This is not about a church wedding or a private wedding. This is about government marriage.

    I apologize in advance if I haven't made this clear enough.
    No. In fact, not only is governmental marriage not a right, but I don't think it should exist in the first place. The government has no business judging the validity of people's relationships.

    HOWEVER, because governmental marriages DOES exist, and because it is the ONLY WAY to access some of your own rights and familial safeguards, it is certainly a right for all consensual families, regardless of configuration, to have equal access to their own rights. If gays cannot access this, they are inherently being financially discriminated against, and the stability of their families is being legally threatened.

    Therefore, it is a right for gays to have access to governmental marriage, unless or until the government stops using marriage as the only path to accessing some of your familial rights.
    Last edited by SmokeAndMirrors; 06-27-15 at 04:42 PM.

  9. #59
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    Re: traditional marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    You misinterpreted what I said

    The people decided to give the government the powers you decry.
    No. They did not IMO. They simply failed to notice what was happening and then, once made dependent on government, they allowed it.
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  10. #60
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    Re: traditional marriage

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    Not a single one of the Founders got everything they wanted in the Constitution and most likely every single one had to compromise and accept some phrase or clause that they did not think should be there. What they did finally mostly agree on--a few never agreed to sign the final document--was the original Constitution that everybody felt they could live with and that would accomplish at least most of what they wanted to accomplish and could sell to the folks back home, most especially after the Bill of Rights was added. The document they adopted was brilliantly conceived and allowed the most amazing nation the world to flourish with people who governed themselves.

    I believe they would ALL to a man be rolling in their graves at the mere suggestion of any part of the federal government, let alone the Supreme Court, dictating to the people what marriage must be and what the people were required to accept. At the same time they may have agreed or disagreed with whatever decisions the people made on that issue themselves but would have allowed the people to decide.
    And a way to change that Constitution so that when things changed in the future, as they knew it would, so could the Constitution. And it did, to include an Amendment that limited state power, rights in favor of individual power, rights.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

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