View Poll Results: Which would you support on federal or state property?

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  • Confederate and black power flags

    2 4.88%
  • Only confederate

    5 12.20%
  • Only black power

    0 0%
  • neither

    34 82.93%
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Thread: If you support the government flying the confederate flag......

  1. #71
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    Re: If you support the government flying the confederate flag......

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    Tribal high school?
    No, public. We also have a highschool styled after prostitution.

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    Re: If you support the government flying the confederate flag......

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    You are not offending enough folks with that flag.





    Try this one.






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    Re: If you support the government flying the confederate flag......

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    And more sadly, the tendency is to demand that others support our sociopolitical views or else they are targeted to be demonized and, if possible, crushed. Such is a very unhealthy thing for a people who presumably value liberty. Such as people not being allowed to assign their own interpretation of the Confederate flag and declared racist if they do not see it in the politically correct definition.
    You're spot on. Frankly, I'm a little disturbed by the growing tendency of corporations to throw their economic weight around in all manner of political affairs. One example is Univision's decision to drop the Miss Universe Pageant because Donald Trump flapped his lips. Trump owns the pageant with NBC. So what was NBC's sin? Guilt by association? And why punish the people whose livelihoods depend on it? Another example is this decision by Apple to drop games with the Battle Flag in them. The developer of Ultimate General: Gettysburg makes some good points:

    "Spielberg's Schindler's List did not try to amend his movie to look more comfortable. The historical Gettysburg movie (1993) is still on iTunes. We believe that all historical art forms: books, movies, or games such as ours, help to learn and understand history, depicting events as they were. True stories are more important to us than money," Thomadis wrote. "Therefore, we are not going to amend the game's content and Ultimate General: Gettysburg will no longer be available on App Store. We really hope that Apple's decision will achieve the desired results. We can't change history, but we can change the future."

    Read more: Apple Removes Confederate Flag-Bearing Games From App Store | Rolling Stone
    So Apple apparently wants him to remove the flag from the game, but the game developer is prepared to tell Apple to take a hike. Bully for him, and shame on Apple.
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    Re: If you support the government flying the confederate flag......

    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    That sounds all well and good...and I agree with that, to a certain extent. But there will be situations that will test your attitude.

    For example, let's suppose the City of Charleston has a parade...maybe a 4th of July parade...and a group of Civil War enacters want to participate. Should the city refuse them if they carry that flag?

    Or, for example, LGBT folks want to take part in a city-sponsored parade...should they be allowed to fly their rainbow flag?

    I know you are talking about government buildings and I'm talking about parades, but this whole Charleston thing is about a war memorial. The only thing they all have in common is government involvement.
    I do not have a problem with parades and museums having other countries flags and special interest groups flags.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

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    Re: If you support the government flying the confederate flag......

    Quote Originally Posted by American View Post
    The Christian Gay Jew Nazis of Islam?
    You left out the Wiccans, the Rodney Dangerfield of religions.
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    Re: If you support the government flying the confederate flag......

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahlevah View Post
    Yeah, but we're really talking about the flag, not slavery.
    We were speaking about what the flag's originally meaning.

    It did not represent hatred and racism.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ahlevah View Post
    I mean, why would Georgia, for example, put a huge Confederate Battle Flag on its state flag in 1956, almost 100 years after slavery ended? The fact is you had a lot of white folks who didn't like blacks in their schools, restaurants, hotels, parks, etc, and they wanted to send a message to the country and federal government that no one was going to tell them how they should treat their niggers.
    1. Doesn't matter to it's original meaning.
    2. It was similar in what it originally represented, a rebellious attitude to an overbearing Federal Government actions against a State. Again the Federal Government was taking away something that was legal.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ahlevah View Post
    Okay, I thought you were referring to the Moorish invasion of the Iberian Peninsula, but, be that as it may, you're engaging in a distinction without a difference. Whether the people were enslaved with an army or a naval incursion or landing force is irrelevant to my point, which was the invader depended on military force and had no interest in the moral aspect of slavery.
    Distinction without a difference?
    The difference in what we was being spoken about is extreme. You are speaking about spoils of wart which were allowed.

    Versus what I was speaking about which amount to be criminal acts. Piracy and marauding. Which I believe is a distinction with a difference.





    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    IMO we as a people have so politicized and polarized the issue of racism that many now assign 'racism' to what is in no way racist and fail to see what is racist in what they themselves promote or support.

    And more sadly, the tendency is to demand that others support our sociopolitical views or else they are targeted to be demonized and, if possible, crushed. Such is a very unhealthy thing for a people who presumably value liberty. Such as people not being allowed to assign their own interpretation of the Confederate flag and declared racist if they do not see it in the politically correct definition.
    Agreed. Totally.
    So pardon me while I respond to the rest of what you said.


    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    It is racist only to the extent that a people of one race assumed power over the people of another race.
    I disagree.
    Just because blacks were sold to folks of other races does not in any way make it racist or racism when the ownership of a any slave changed hands from from black to white.


    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    just because they were of a different race. It was racist because they considered those they enslaved inferior to themselves.
    That is not racist or racism. Darn near all races have been enslaved at some point in time. Thinking a slave was inferior by position was part and parcel of slavery.
    Which were the points already made.
    When a black person owned a black slave it was not racism, it was slavery. When white person owned a white slave it was not racism, it was slavery.
    When those folks owned slaves of other races it was not racism. It was still just the legal institution of slavery.
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
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    Re: If you support the government flying the confederate flag......

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    We were speaking about what the flag's originally meaning.

    It did not represent hatred and racism.


    1. Doesn't matter to it's original meaning.
    2. It was similar in what it originally represented, a rebellious attitude to an overbearing Federal Government actions against a State. Again the Federal Government was taking away something that was legal.


    Distinction without a difference?
    The difference in what we was being spoken about is extreme. You are speaking about spoils of wart which were allowed.

    Versus what I was speaking about which amount to be criminal acts. Piracy and marauding. Which I believe is a distinction with a difference.





    Agreed. Totally.
    So pardon me while I respond to the rest of what you said.


    I disagree.
    Just because blacks were sold to folks of other races does not in any way make it racist or racism when the ownership of a any slave changed hands from from black to white.


    That is not racist or racism. Darn near all races have been enslaved at some point in time. Thinking a slave was inferior by position was part and parcel of slavery.
    Which were the points already made.
    When a black person owned a black slave it was not racism, it was slavery. When white person owned a white slave it was not racism, it was slavery.
    When those folks owned slaves of other races it was not racism. It was still just the legal institution of slavery.
    What made it racism was that black people were seen as inferior beings and therefore could be enslaved. When only black people are seen as suitable to be made slaves and white people are not, that is racism.
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    Re: If you support the government flying the confederate flag......

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    We were speaking about what the flag's originally meaning.
    Right. It was used in battle in a war which ended in 1865 and was later incorporated into the Confederate national flag. But, thanks to Jim Crow and the post-WWII bigots, it has no place on a modern state flag. I mean, this symbol dates back 6,000 years and is a good luck charm in Buddhism and Hinduism, but good luck getting it on a state flag:

    If you support the government flying the confederate flag......-hinduswastika-png

    Quote Originally Posted by Excon View Post
    It did not represent hatred and racism.
    Neither did the swastika, but then we see what happened there. In the words of Paul to the Galatians: "Be not deceived; God is not mocked: for whatsoever a man soweth, that shall he also reap."
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    Re: If you support the government flying the confederate flag......

    Quote Originally Posted by tarheel View Post
    All states that were part of the Confederacy are only allowed to exist if their state constitution forbids succeeding from the United States. South Carolina would be violating their own constitution if they flew a Confederate flag over their capitol building.
    That doesn't make any sense.

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    Re: If you support the government flying the confederate flag......

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    What made it racism was that black people were seen as inferior beings and therefore could be enslaved. When only black people are seen as suitable to be made slaves and white people are not, that is racism.
    Either you are not paying attention to the conversation you decided to quote from, or you are simply ignoring it.

    We are speaking to it's origins.
    There was no racism in the act of slavery no matter who was doing the enslaving.

    They were seen as inferior becasue they were a slave, not becasue of their race.

    Again.
    Just because blacks were sold to folks of other races does not in any way make it racist or racism when the ownership of a any slave changed hands from from black to white.

    When a black person owned a black slave it was not racism, it was slavery.

    When white person owned a white slave it was not racism, it was slavery.

    When those folks owned slaves of other races it was not racism.

    It was still just the legal institution of slavery.





    Quote Originally Posted by Ahlevah View Post
    it has no place on a modern state flag.
    Says who?
    There happens to be a lot of folks who think otherwise and who see it as meaning something other than the biased bs of the perpetually aggrieved.


    Quote Originally Posted by Ahlevah View Post
    but good luck getting it on a state flag
    Right now? Not here, but possibly in another country where it exist on different flags.

    Here, it could happen at some point in the future.

    If you are interested in helping it get back to it's original meaning.
    Reclaim The Swastika : The symbol for spiritual victory
    “The law is reason, free from passion.”
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