View Poll Results: Should the Confederate Flag be abolished?

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  • Yes

    55 29.57%
  • No

    131 70.43%
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Thread: Confederate Flag[W:1518,2230, 2241]

  1. #841
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by HorseLoverGirl View Post
    I guess you don't understand that hindsight is 20/20.
    It always has been. But what does that have to do with your apparent denial of the reasons for secession as explained by the states themselves in their own statements of secession where SLAVERY played such a prominent motivation?
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    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

  2. #842
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    The Irish who moved here after they were starved out of Ireland and came to the NYC area were treated like ****. I'm descended through my mother from those people. They were banned from stores, jobs, schools, even parks and city streets. I did a lot of research with my sister and my cousin and we were pretty shocked by what we learned about our great grandparents and back. For some odd reason it isn't chic to talk about how mistreated the Irish were in the north.
    Nope. Not at all. They made up a large part of forced soldiers. Hell...the scene in gangs of New York was completely inaccurate with them getting off the boat and being given a gun.
    The Crowd is not the sum of its parts.

  3. #843
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by HorseLoverGirl View Post
    Start with reading The South was Right. A lot of things I have actually found out that have been left out of the history books you'll have to go to heaven to find out, since my granddaddy, who taught me more than I could ever learn in any book, has been gone from this earth for 9 1/2 years now. He got his information from the veterans who lived in the Old Soldier's Home in Richmond VA, while a student at Benedictine College (now Benedictine College Prepatory) in Richmond in the 1920's.
    lol. I remember you from the *H* debate board a few years back.

    We had many an interaction....and your posts were so thoroughly demolished, but it looks like you haven't gained much since.

    One of my favorites of yours was how the Confederate Constitution never once mentioned slavery. lol

    That was golden!

  4. #844
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    Should the Confederate Flag be removed/abolished?

    I say no. The argument is that it represents racism and slavery. That is stupid. So does the American Flag.
    It shouldn't be abolished or anything. But it's a loser flag.
    You know the time is right to take control, we gotta take offense against the status quo

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    "I should have loved freedom, I believe, at all times, but in the time in which we live I am ready to worship it."

  5. #845
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by stonewall50 View Post
    Nope. Not at all. They made up a large part of forced soldiers. Hell...the scene in gangs of New York was completely inaccurate with them getting off the boat and being given a gun.
    Conscripted soldiers made up a relatively tiny proportion of the Union military. It was primarily utilized as a mechanism for encouraging enlistment, something it was much more successful at.

  6. #846
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    Conscripted soldiers made up a relatively tiny proportion of the Union military. It was primarily utilized as a mechanism for encouraging enlistment, something it was much more successful at.
    True. Many are surprised to learn of the 2,100,000 Union soldiers, about 2% were draftees.

    6% were substitutes paid by draftees - and that was part of what made some so upset and ignited those riots. That you could pay someone to fight if you were well off, leading to the oft used phrase then: Rich mans war, poor man's battle.

  7. #847
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    Oh. My bad. I jumped to conclusions. Sorry... I do that but it is also part of my charm. Being a moron.
    I may not agree with you on much but you, sir?/ma'am?, are no moron.

  8. #848
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    Conscripted soldiers made up a relatively tiny proportion of the Union military. It was primarily utilized as a mechanism for encouraging enlistment, something it was much more successful at.
    More common was the practice of military able northerners paying for their more pecunious fellow citizens to do their service for them. I don't think the South had nearly as much trouble getting men of all ages to step forward to fight. Their cause, preserving slavery, was much dearer to their hearts than the northern cause, preserving the Union, was to many northerners. Still, the population in the North was large enough to account for the possible lack of fervor among recruits. And as the South were the aggressors, even attempting to invade the North fairly early in order to kill and pillage, it woke northerners up to the reality that the threat was not just to a principle but to the very fabric of American existence.
    Last edited by digitusmedius; 07-01-15 at 11:48 AM.

  9. #849
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by Moot View Post
    If some of the things you've been saying about the civil war came from those veterans ..then it is highly likely they did, yes.


    ".....The Lost Cause is an interpretation of the American Civil War (18611865) that seeks to present the war, from the perspective of Confederates, in the best possible terms.

    Developed by white Southerners, [B]many of them former Confederate generals, in a postwar climate of economic, racial, and gender uncertainty, the Lost Cause created and romanticized the "Old South" and the Confederate war effort, often distorting history in the process. For this reason, many historians have labeled the Lost Cause a myth or a legend.

    It is certainly an important example of public memory, one in which nostalgia for the Confederate past is accompanied by a collective forgetting of the horrors of slavery. Providing a sense of relief to white Southerners who feared being dishonored by defeat, the Lost Cause was largely accepted in the years following the war by white Americans who found it to be a useful tool in reconciling North and South.

    The Lost Cause has lost much of its academic support but continues to be an important part of how the Civil War is commemorated in the South and remembered in American popular culture..

    Lost Cause, The
    HorseGirl is a nice enough gal, and on other subjects, quite reasonable. I know - I've had literally thousands of interactions with her over a period of several years.

    I can dispell the notion she is a White Supremacist, she's not. She even leans liberal on most things.

    She is however, thoroughly tied to her granddaddy's view of the Confederacy in a rather childlike innocence that has remained with her. Nothing, and I do mean - nothing - you can say will dissuade her of the fables she was told as a child, which she believes to be absolute truth.

    What she gleans from 99% is what she heard gpapa - in an Confederate Old Age home -- from an over 100 year old rebel in the 1930's heard, and her being told this late in his life i(n the 1990's, as I recall).

    In fact, I even looked up the Soldier History of the rebel vet her gpapa told her about, and presented her with the details of him being thrown in a Union prison for most of the war (yeah, that couldn't have had any effect....)

    The other 1% comes from the (completely debunked) Kennedy Twins "The South Was Right."

    She will not look at any information presented outside of those sources. No matter what/

    Trust me on this. Believe me, I've tried. Beyond that, she's a genuinely nice gal.

  10. #850
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    Re: Confederate Flag

    Quote Originally Posted by digitusmedius View Post
    More common was the practice of military able northerners paying for their more pecunious fellow citizens to do their service for them.
    I just that this has already been covered. Apology for the redundancy.

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