View Poll Results: Do you believe George W Bush was a good president?

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    27 29.03%
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Thread: Do you believe Bush was a good president?

  1. #231
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    Re: Do you believe Bush was a good president?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    I don't care about Bush either way... the point is that just as we later found out that Bush made his Iraq decision based off of bad intelligence, at the time it seemed like the right decision. Time gives a more accurate perspective on these things. That said, historians are generally Liberal... that, coupled with the lack of transparency and the media sucking Obama's dick every day leads me to not care at all what the current presidential scholars conclude. If Obama turns out to be great or not according to them in 50 doesn't bother me although I think some of his major policies are crap.
    You don't care about Bush either way, yet throughout this entire thread are ranting about why "Bush is better than Obama", and will be regarded that way in the future.

    interesting.

  2. #232
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    Re: Do you believe Bush was a good president?

    Quote Originally Posted by Puigb View Post
    You don't care about Bush either way, yet throughout this entire thread are ranting about why "Bush is better than Obama", and will be regarded that way in the future.

    interesting.
    Yes. People can be objective and not become emotionally vested one way or the other and simply analyze the facts.

    Too bad for America that this seems to be a foreign concept to many..

  3. #233

    Re: Do you believe Bush was a good president?

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    Not just here, apparently.


    Bush Now More Popular than Obama
    http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/03/politi...ting-cnn-poll/

    Hahahahaha.
    Polar is not the same as doing a poor job.

  4. #234
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    Re: Do you believe Bush was a good president?

    Passing the Patriot Act, invading Iraq on false pretenses, winning 2000 illegitimately, trying to prevent gays from having the right to marry, ramping up debt, implementing NCLB and running public education into the ground, Medicare Part D, inadequately responding to the recession, the list goes on and on.

    Probably one of our worst presidents ever.
    Social democrat is no longer an accurate description of my views.

  5. #235
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    Re: Do you believe Bush was a good president?

    Quote Originally Posted by SocialDemocrat View Post
    Passing the Patriot Act, invading Iraq on false pretenses, winning 2000 illegitimately, trying to prevent gays from having the right to marry, ramping up debt, implementing NCLB and running public education into the ground, Medicare Part D, inadequately responding to the recession, the list goes on and on.

    Probably one of our worst presidents ever.
    Only to someone who doesn't want to consider facts.

    For example, Bush signed the law...yes...but it was presented to him by Congress. The law passed the House 357-66 and it passed the Senate 98-1. Seems to me both Parties in Congress is the one you should be blaming instead of Bush.
    TANSTAAFL
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  6. #236
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    Re: Do you believe Bush was a good president?

    Quote Originally Posted by Mycroft View Post
    Only to someone who doesn't want to consider facts.

    For example, Bush signed the law...yes...but it was presented to him by Congress. The law passed the House 357-66 and it passed the Senate 98-1. Seems to me both Parties in Congress is the one you should be blaming instead of Bush.
    Obviously I find fault with everyone who voted for the Patriot Act, but this is not a thread on my opinion of the two major parties. Secondly, Bush signed the bill into law; no matter how you twist it, he had the option to veto it and chose not to. He is responsible for any bills he signs into law, just like any other president.
    Social democrat is no longer an accurate description of my views.

  7. #237
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    Re: Do you believe Bush was a good president?

    Quote Originally Posted by SocialDemocrat View Post
    Passing the Patriot Act, invading Iraq on false pretenses, winning 2000 illegitimately, trying to prevent gays from having the right to marry, ramping up debt, implementing NCLB and running public education into the ground, Medicare Part D, inadequately responding to the recession, the list goes on and on.

    Probably one of our worst presidents ever.
    Honestly, are you just saying all those things or do you REALLY believe them?

    I mean, have you ever researched any of the criticisms at all to find out both sides of those issues?

    If you did why wouldn't you strengthen your case by alluding to the other side of the coin and telling why those arguments are mistaken?

    Because as it stands now, I can dispel almost every one of the things you posted.

    And that would embarrass you pretty badly.

    But that's not my game. I just want the facts to be presented.

    So, do you want to post the opposing arguments or shall I?

  8. #238
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    Re: Do you believe Bush was a good president?

    Quote Originally Posted by SocialDemocrat View Post
    Obviously I find fault with everyone who voted for the Patriot Act, but this is not a thread on my opinion of the two major parties. Secondly, Bush signed the bill into law; no matter how you twist it, he had the option to veto it and chose not to. He is responsible for any bills he signs into law, just like any other president.
    I can make a case for the Patriot Act which you likely have never considered and which I believe you'd find compelling.

    Here goes.

    The Patriot Act, in addition to all of the claims made for it, did an important thing for America in the days after 9/11.

    It assured all of the Bubba's in this country that they would not have to take justice into their own hands in order to keep us safe from Jihadists.

    The Patriot Act was strong medicine. Like Chemo.

    It is no joke, and it did the job of making us feel that the Government was serious about detecting the Jihadis and protecting us from a subsequent attack. It was a measure which we all could feel infringed on each of us a little even though we are patriots and innocent with nothing to hide or fear on that score.

    So, with that strong medicine America's Bubbas did not go out shooting every Muslim they saw.

    And how many Muslims ever thanked W for that?

    They ALL should have.

    It was the only thing which allowed them to live with as little fear of reprisals as they did.

    Though that isn't to say there weren't some reprisal or back-lash attacks.

    Just that there would have been more and they could have been more serious without the Patriot Act calming some American jitters.
    Last edited by Tazmanian Devil; 06-21-15 at 04:04 AM.

  9. #239
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    Re: Do you believe Bush was a good president?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tazmanian Devil View Post
    I can make a case for the Patriot Act which you likely have never considered and which I believe you'd find compelling.

    Here goes.

    The Patriot Act, in addition to all of the claims made for it, did an important thing for America in the days after 9/11.

    It assured all of the Bubba's in this country that they would not have to take justice into their own hands in order to keep us safe from Jihadists.

    The Patriot Act was strong medicine. Like Chemo.

    It is no joke, and it did the job of making us feel that the Government was serious about detecting the Jihadis and protecting us from a subsequent attack. It was a measure which we all could feel infringed on each of us a little even though we are patriots and innocent with nothing to hide or fear on that score.

    So, with that strong medicine America's Bubbas did not go out shooting every Muslim they saw.

    And how many Muslims ever thanked W for that?

    They ALL should have.

    It was the only thing which allowed them to live with as little fear of reprisals as they did.

    We all saw what happened after the Iraqi invasion of Kuwait.
    The funny thing is the amount of truth probably in the argument.

    I wouldn't say that this prevented all recriminations nor that the fact that the lack of such measures in Europe has been followed by a strong increase in dislike and even hate of Muslims as indicative of the total correctness of the link. But it is definitely worth remarking on.

  10. #240
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    Re: Do you believe Bush was a good president?

    Quote Originally Posted by SocialDemocrat View Post
    Obviously I find fault with everyone who voted for the Patriot Act, but this is not a thread on my opinion of the two major parties. Secondly, Bush signed the bill into law; no matter how you twist it, he had the option to veto it and chose not to. He is responsible for any bills he signs into law, just like any other president.
    And you think it was a bad instrument among the alternatives that were?
    Admittedly I did not like treating terrorism as war instead of international crime. But even there, I well understand the reasoning for a more robust stand. I would have much preferred using 9.11 as a leverage to build a supranational system of r2p and dependable general enforcement. But I am not at all sure that would have worked at the time and did not believe so at the time, whereas the war approach did convince the UN to introduce the r2p norm breaking with its focus on legality based on the absolute sovereignty of the ruler in the member state, which was unheard of but important. It also has convinced the European elite of the necessity of being involved in making international peace and carrying more of the substantial hard and soft costs. Germany's present engagements and internal discussion is a point in fact.

    Bush actually did this initiative enormous good as the Bad Cop. Where we fell over was when the Good Cop lost our way.

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