View Poll Results: Was I wrong to ask her to stop?

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Thread: Was I wrong?

  1. #101
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    Great post.
    I agree. A couple of more points of free advice FWIW

    1) Do document and stick to the facts, as it's been suggested.

    2) Ignore stonewall's advice. If you assume an adverserial relationship, that's what you're going to get and as you said earlier, having a problem with a same sex couple is not going to help you with your potential coaching career. Turning a potential problem into a supporter will.

    If she's determined to be adversarial, let her hang herself. Just document what goes on for future reference.

    3) You should do everything possible to get along with her. Along these lines

    a) When you next see her, tell her your apology was sincere and that you're thrilled that you two will be "working together". Use that phrase. Do not say she will be "helping" you and do not call her an "Assistant Coach" You do not want to say anything that could be perceived as diminishing her. Instead, you want to raise her status (and document that fact) in relation to you. You may even want to write something in advance and memorize it (and document it) beforehand.

    b) If she has suggestions, let your 2nd Asst Coach respond to them before you do. If the 2nd Asst doesn't respond, prompt them by asking "What do you think?". If the 2nd isn't there, say "Sounds great. Why don't you see what xxxxx thinks"

    Let the other Asst Coach be the one who complains about this woman. And if she complains about you, her complaint will be that you're cooperating with the lesbian mother. Her complaints will be a twofer for you (ie the lesbian mother will get complaints, and you will be portrayed as being cooperating with the lesbian mother which will inoculate you against potential future complaints that you're hostile to homosexuals)
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  2. #102
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    I agree. A couple of more points of free advice FWIW

    1) Do document and stick to the facts, as it's been suggested.

    2) Ignore stonewall's advice. If you assume an adverserial relationship, that's what you're going to get and as you said earlier, having a problem with a same sex couple is not going to help you with your potential coaching career. Turning a potential problem into a supporter will.

    If she's determined to be adversarial, let her hang herself. Just document what goes on for future reference.

    3) You should do everything possible to get along with her. Along these lines

    a) When you next see her, tell her your apology was sincere and that you're thrilled that you two will be "working together". Use that phrase. Do not say she will be "helping" you and do not call her an "Assistant Coach" You do not want to say anything that could be perceived as diminishing her. Instead, you want to raise her status (and document that fact) in relation to you. You may even want to write something in advance and memorize it (and document it) beforehand.

    b) If she has suggestions, let your 2nd Asst Coach respond to them before you do. If the 2nd Asst doesn't respond, prompt them by asking "What do you think?". If the 2nd isn't there, say "Sounds great. Why don't you see what xxxxx thinks"

    Let the other Asst Coach be the one who complains about this woman. And if she complains about you, her complaint will be that you're cooperating with the lesbian mother. Her complaints will be a twofer for you (ie the lesbian mother will get complaints, and you will be portrayed as being cooperating with the lesbian mother which will inoculate you against potential future complaints that you're hostile to homosexuals)
    great suggestions top to bottom.
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
    Stephen R. Covey


  3. #103
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    great suggestions top to bottom.
    DON'T use that expression around her!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


























    just kidding
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    Why confuse things with facts?

  4. #104
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    I agree. A couple of more points of free advice FWIW

    1) Do document and stick to the facts, as it's been suggested.

    2) Ignore stonewall's advice. If you assume an adverserial relationship, that's what you're going to get and as you said earlier, having a problem with a same sex couple is not going to help you with your potential coaching career. Turning a potential problem into a supporter will.

    If she's determined to be adversarial, let her hang herself. Just document what goes on for future reference.

    3) You should do everything possible to get along with her. Along these lines

    a) When you next see her, tell her your apology was sincere and that you're thrilled that you two will be "working together". Use that phrase. Do not say she will be "helping" you and do not call her an "Assistant Coach" You do not want to say anything that could be perceived as diminishing her. Instead, you want to raise her status (and document that fact) in relation to you. You may even want to write something in advance and memorize it (and document it) beforehand.

    b) If she has suggestions, let your 2nd Asst Coach respond to them before you do. If the 2nd Asst doesn't respond, prompt them by asking "What do you think?". If the 2nd isn't there, say "Sounds great. Why don't you see what xxxxx thinks"

    Let the other Asst Coach be the one who complains about this woman. And if she complains about you, her complaint will be that you're cooperating with the lesbian mother. Her complaints will be a twofer for you (ie the lesbian mother will get complaints, and you will be portrayed as being cooperating with the lesbian mother which will inoculate you against potential future complaints that you're hostile to homosexuals)
    You've eliminated most of what I would consider acceptable language. What would you suggest to "raise her status" without offending at the same time?
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  5. #105
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Sounds like she was fishing for a lawsuit. Suing people is good business in America

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    I coach for the city here where i live. Varying sports for ages 4-13 depending on where they need help coaching. For baseball this year one of my teams is a 4-5 year old t ball team. We had our first practice last night and two women came with a little girl. I introduced myself and said hi and they immediately went on a little speech about how they are together, they are lesbians, they are raising this girl together, nothing wrong with that. Then go into whats going to happen if I discriminate against their daughter because of their sexuality, threatening lawsuits and explaining that there are laws ect. I told them I was there to teach their daughter softball, and their sexual orientation was not a factor at all and moved along. As I am meeting other parents a few of them commented that this lady had approached them and gave them a similar speech out of nowhere. After all the kids were there I gathered the kids together and started off having the kids introduce themselves to their teammates. No additional information really, just kid would say my name is Earl. And everyone would say Hi Earl to start to learn teammates names. When the little girl told everyone her name, again the lady popped into action giving her speech to everyone out there. I stopped her after about a minute and spoke to her privately, or as privately as I could on a baseball field, and let her know that it is not appropriate to interrupt a team activity like that, and again told her noone is going to be discriminating against her daughter. So today I get a call from the city letting me know she filed a complaint and is taking her child off of my team because I told her she had to hide her sexuality at our practices so it wouldn't bother other parents. I dont recall my exact wording but it was not mean, the word hiding or even sexuality didnt come out of my mouth. I only asked her not to interrupt our practices and tried to assure he that I don't care what her sexual preference is, I am there to teach baseball and the other parents are only there to watch.

    Was I wrong to ask her to stop what she was doing?

  6. #106
    Randian PUA
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    You've eliminated most of what I would consider acceptable language. What would you suggest to "raise her status" without offending at the same time?
    Basically, language that portrays Kreton and his new Asst Coach as equals.
    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    Justice Thomas' opinions consistently contain precise, detailed constitutional analyses.
    Quote Originally Posted by jaeger19 View Post
    the vast majority of folks that need healthcare are on Medicare.. both rich and poor..

  7. #107
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    I coach for the city here where i live. Varying sports for ages 4-13 depending on where they need help coaching. For baseball this year one of my teams is a 4-5 year old t ball team. We had our first practice last night and two women came with a little girl. I introduced myself and said hi and they immediately went on a little speech about how they are together, they are lesbians, they are raising this girl together, nothing wrong with that. Then go into whats going to happen if I discriminate against their daughter because of their sexuality, threatening lawsuits and explaining that there are laws ect. I told them I was there to teach their daughter softball, and their sexual orientation was not a factor at all and moved along. As I am meeting other parents a few of them commented that this lady had approached them and gave them a similar speech out of nowhere. After all the kids were there I gathered the kids together and started off having the kids introduce themselves to their teammates. No additional information really, just kid would say my name is Earl. And everyone would say Hi Earl to start to learn teammates names. When the little girl told everyone her name, again the lady popped into action giving her speech to everyone out there. I stopped her after about a minute and spoke to her privately, or as privately as I could on a baseball field, and let her know that it is not appropriate to interrupt a team activity like that, and again told her noone is going to be discriminating against her daughter. So today I get a call from the city letting me know she filed a complaint and is taking her child off of my team because I told her she had to hide her sexuality at our practices so it wouldn't bother other parents. I dont recall my exact wording but it was not mean, the word hiding or even sexuality didnt come out of my mouth. I only asked her not to interrupt our practices and tried to assure he that I don't care what her sexual preference is, I am there to teach baseball and the other parents are only there to watch.

    Was I wrong to ask her to stop what she was doing?
    I think this incident helped enormously to reinforce equal treatment ... LGBT people can be as big arseholes as anyone else.

    If this scenario played out as you described, and I'm not questioning your account for a second, then you behaved appropriately, which I'm sure others present would back you up on. I don't think you've anything to worry about.
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  8. #108
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    So had the meeting. Started off really poorly because she and her wife were there and No-one told me that. I thought it was me and the city reps. That really irritated me.

    Anyhow, I explained why I asked her to knock it off. She had a list of problems with me it seemed like. First when I greeted her I asked the child's name and then asked who her mother was, which is offensive since she had two mothers and I shouldn't have assumed they weren't together. Then she claims I refused to acknowledge her spouse. Which through all of this the spouse never really said or did anything so I was pretty much just talking to the parent who was talking. Which not addressing her spouse means I refused to acknowledge them as a couple somehow.

    Then she claims that after she told me they were together I looked like I wanted to get away. Which this is somewhat true, largely because I didn't want to hear it, but also because other kids were arriving and I wanted to greet them more than listen to her.

    Then she said other parents were staring and giving her looks and I allowed it and she felt like parents were going to tell thier kids to not involve hers. Which as a coach I would never allow.

    Then of course I singled her out to set an example to everyone that I was in charge. Which is not why I pulled her aside.

    Then I made the apparently horrible mistake in the meeting of saying that I don't care if she is gay or not. And holy **** did that set her off. I was not supposed to call her gay, which may have some merit, I am not overly pc so maybe. And saying I didn't care about her sexualitat turned into I don't believe in civil rights or equality since I don't care about homosexual equality. Really wasn't sure how it got there.

    Though all of this I was explaining that she is taking everything way out off context and reading into things that aren't there.

    In the end, I was asked to apologize and promise to be more attentive of the sensitive issue. Which it took everything in me to do. It really did. She also got a refund and her child will be playing for free, and also will be allowed to play basketball for free when that starts. Her child is back on my team, and she is going to be my assistant coach to ensure he child gets fair playing time. Which I don't get since all children play the field, there are no reserves.

    But whatever I guess. Not too happy at them moment
    I'm sorry but I actually lol'd a bit at that last bit. she's going to be your freaking ASSISTANT COACH??? that's a situation that has "sitcom" written all over it.

  9. #109
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by nota bene View Post
    Yup. She's just an asshole. And I feel sorry for her kid--really, can you imagine the embarrassing incidents of the future?

    I feel sorry for the kid too. My 6 year old practically faints from embarrassment if I so much as hug her or even try to hold her hand. Not that it stops me from doing it but I would never in a million years go so far as to stand up in front of her friends or teammates and make a public spectacle of my sexuality.
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  10. #110
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by sangha View Post
    Basically, language that portrays Kreton and his new Asst Coach as equals.
    Maybe it's just my way of thinking, but somebody needs to be in charge. They're not equals, in the coaching of the team.
    Huntsman / Kasich 2020

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