View Poll Results: Was I wrong to ask her to stop?

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Thread: Was I wrong?

  1. #91
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Kreton,

    I had to mull this over overnight. I will not criticize you for your decision. It is your's and your's alone. But, just to throw my 2c in, I don't think I would have been as accommodating.

    1) I don't think I would have apologized, because I had nothing to apologize for. If anything, she should have apologized, though I doubt I would have suggested it (would have just elevated the confrontation). Regardless, she's a bully in her own right and I would resist giving in to her bullying.

    2) I most certainly would not have accepted her as an assistant coach. She has already shown that even lacking a legitimate cause she will pro-actively create one as it suits her agenda. She will be second guessing your decisions to the end of the season.

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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    damn! where to start?
    *edited for brevity*
    that this woman would find it necessary to initially approach you as she did, insisting that you become aware of her sexual orientation, which otherwise would have remained unknown to you, tells me that she is either looking to litigate for money or validation or both ... or she is ****ing crazy. that she exposed her circumstance to the parents and then interrupted your team introductions to put that out there indicates it may be the latter. find something else to so. NOW. and **** park & rec
    Excellent post nothing to add really excpet that she may be looking for money/validation AND be ****ing crazy. Lets not limit the possibilities
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  3. #93
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    damn! where to start?
    ok, the couple's kid. G_d bless him, because he has a difficult journey immediately ahead of him

    Janfu has mentioned this earlier in the thread and i cannot encourage you enough to follow that advice: create a file on your personal computer and record every event exactly as you recall. play-by-play. NO commentary; this real-time record needs to document factually what is transpiring. fortunately, thanks to your thread, you can assemble the initial entries by cutting & pasting your descriptive posts. NOT your conclusions, inferences, thoughts, anything other than the facts. just maintain a running entry as soon as you come home so that your record is clear and continuous. take notes on the field if you must to assure your record is accurate and complete
    right now, you recall many things. you have already acknowledged you are vague about what you precisely said. be absolutely clear going forward. and this record will serve you well down the road if her motivations are to litigate. hopefully, they are not ... but you must prepare for the worst. please do a memorandum for the record after every episode in which something seems irregular to you

    as a sports official of 31 years, it appears you did absolutely nothing wrong. i would say you handled the initial sequence of events expertly. you listened to the woman explain her unique personal situation and you tried to assure her that her relationship would in no way impact the way you coached the team. perfect. and then, when you were coordinating team introductions, you intervened to preempt the woman's inappropriate intrusion into the team's activities. she was stepping all over your role as coach. and you did not permit that. kudos

    not so much for park & rec. they allowed you to believe you were coming to meet with them to give your side of the story. of course they needed to document in any instance in which a parent alleges the coach acted improperly. and you showed up, thinking that was what you were going to do explain what happened from your perspective. but the park/rec officials blindsided you into a confrontation with a woman on a mission. not only did they retain the kid on your team but added his parent as an assistant coach. besides giving modest financial concessions that only allows the parent to believe she has won. that her approach works. because it did


    Great post. A big part of the reason why I won't move on from the position is I have been coaching for the city for 4 years and I am not going to walk away from the reference if I can help it. One thing to point out is everything that happened with this lady happened before or during the first 5 minutes or so of practice. Practice went well without any problems from that point forward. Another thing to point out is my daughter is on the team and I don't want to pull her either.

    Part of the reason I didn't think to remember exactly what I said or write it down or anything (and i got the call the next afternoon after it was pretty much out of my mind) was I have had confrontations and had to correct parents in the past. Its probably impossible to coach without butting heads with a couple parents. Usually it is for them being too hard on their kid during games/practice. Or yelling at the ump or ref. I had one parent in soccer I overheard tell his kid to intentionally trip a kid who had, probably unintentionally, tripped his kid. He and I had it out along with refs and other parents jumping in. But nothing ever has come of any parent/coach problems in the past. So I really didn't expect anything to happen. Practice went well from that point, she was helping her daughter like other parents were doing, I met with each parents briefly after to discuss how their kids were doing, including her. No problems. In my mind after leaving practice was that I had corrected it and we were done.
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  4. #94
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    that this woman would find it necessary to initially approach you as she did, insisting that you become aware of her sexual orientation, which otherwise would have remained unknown to you, tells me that she is either looking to litigate for money or validation or both ... or she is ****ing crazy. that she exposed her circumstance to the parents and then interrupted your team introductions to put that out there indicates it may be the latter. find something else to so. NOW. and **** park & rec
    She claims I put her on the defensive after my initial meeting with her and made her feel the need to address it. Again I don't think I did, other than while we were talking I was looking for other kids coming and cut her short to go greet them. She might be looking to litigate, or she may have completely misinterpreted what I was doing and why. I must have pissed her off early and she had a hard time letting it go. I don't really know or get her motivation, but if it was me like she claims I can be more attentive of it. I'll be naming another asst coach at the next practice and I'll keep them nearby. Or if her and I have to have another side talk like Tuesday, he/she'll come with us.

    you say this coaching activity is essential for your portfolio to qualify as a high school coach. you indicated you have an 8th grade team that you coach. to me, this tee ball skill set appears to be moving you backwards from your goal.
    Ive heard that coaching Tball is a very positive thing to have on a resume as it is one of the harder things to coach. Getting 4 years olds to catch and throw straight is not an easy thing to do, and I jumped on it for the opportunity to coach my daughter. Tball coaching may not be essential before, but once I have signed on as a coach it is. To walk away from this negatively completely negates everything I have done with parks and rec. Alternatively I can turn this around, help make the headache go away for the city, and my recommendation only improves. (they didn't say that I am assuming).

    maybe you only coach round ball. but if you are a football coach you should be working with a high school team over the summer. not a whole lot of guys volunteer for that. be found helping a weak program get stronger.
    No football for me. At least not American football hehe. I coach soccer and baseball. I love football, but never tried to coach it. I actually stumbled into coaching soccer after signing my son up at the Y. The Y called parents letting everyone know they weren't going to have soccer that season because they didn't have enough coaches to manage the teams. So I volunteered, with some other parents, and went from there. After soccer ended I stayed on for baseball and stuck with those. I did basketball for a season, but didnt like it. Never tried football.

    because i officiate youth games i must annually buy a background check from first advantage to document that i present no negative history with kids. i would encourage you to seek a background check from first advantage (mine was $10) and then encourage park and rec to require one from all coaching staff - if you stick around that long. if would not surprise me if she does not check out alright. would park & rec want an uncleared person around a bunch of kids? PM me if you want more info and i will share it
    Head coaches (like myself) have to undergo a background check, driving history. Asst coaches are parents who step up and want to help, so they dont.
    Last edited by Kreton; 06-04-15 at 09:48 AM.
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  5. #95
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    sorry to split it up like that. but apparently there is a 5000 character limit and between quoting you and typing i went well over.
    “Most people do not listen with the intent to understand; they listen with the intent to reply.”
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  6. #96
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    Great post. A big part of the reason why I won't move on from the position is I have been coaching for the city for 4 years and I am not going to walk away from the reference if I can help it. One thing to point out is everything that happened with this lady happened before or during the first 5 minutes or so of practice. Practice went well without any problems from that point forward. Another thing to point out is my daughter is on the team and I don't want to pull her either.
    Wasn't this after she had left?
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  7. #97
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    sorry to split it up like that. but apparently there is a 5000 character limit and between quoting you and typing i went well over.
    i had to truncate my original post to fit within the character limit
    didn't leave any room for your remarks
    but delighted to see you have a direction on this. coaching your own kid adds an element i did not anticipate
    pleased to learn you will have another asst coach ... if nothing else, to keep the other one in line
    hope you have a great season
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  8. #98
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    Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    I coach for the city here where i live. Varying sports for ages 4-13 depending on where they need help coaching. For baseball this year one of my teams is a 4-5 year old t ball team. We had our first practice last night and two women came with a little girl. I introduced myself and said hi and they immediately went on a little speech about how they are together, they are lesbians, they are raising this girl together, nothing wrong with that. Then go into whats going to happen if I discriminate against their daughter because of their sexuality, threatening lawsuits and explaining that there are laws ect. I told them I was there to teach their daughter softball, and their sexual orientation was not a factor at all and moved along. As I am meeting other parents a few of them commented that this lady had approached them and gave them a similar speech out of nowhere. After all the kids were there I gathered the kids together and started off having the kids introduce themselves to their teammates. No additional information really, just kid would say my name is Earl. And everyone would say Hi Earl to start to learn teammates names. When the little girl told everyone her name, again the lady popped into action giving her speech to everyone out there. I stopped her after about a minute and spoke to her privately, or as privately as I could on a baseball field, and let her know that it is not appropriate to interrupt a team activity like that, and again told her noone is going to be discriminating against her daughter. So today I get a call from the city letting me know she filed a complaint and is taking her child off of my team because I told her she had to hide her sexuality at our practices so it wouldn't bother other parents. I dont recall my exact wording but it was not mean, the word hiding or even sexuality didnt come out of my mouth. I only asked her not to interrupt our practices and tried to assure he that I don't care what her sexual preference is, I am there to teach baseball and the other parents are only there to watch.

    Was I wrong to ask her to stop what she was doing?
    From your version...no. Parents, especially in this day and age, have gotten WAY more entitled. They think their child is special. And in this case...this parent seems to be looking to make your life miserable. Or a pay day? Just document everything. Talk to other parents and make sure that the truth is that she brought the topic up alone AND interrupted practice.

    It isn't her show. She doesn't call the shots. She doesn't get to interrupt other people's activities with her sexuality. She isn't protected from being called and treated like an asshole when she acts like an asshole. SHE made the issue. Not you.

    You didn't tell her to hide her sexuality. You told her that her sexuality isn't important. It isn't. She shouldn't be interrupting the kids activities with things not involved with what they are doing...like her sexuality.
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  9. #99
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    Re: Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    Wasn't this after she had left?
    No she stayed the whole practice. Sorry if i implied she left. She contacted the city the next day and took her off my team and complained.
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  10. #100
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    Was I wrong?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kreton View Post
    So had the meeting. Started off really poorly because she and her wife were there and No-one told me that. I thought it was me and the city reps. That really irritated me.

    Anyhow, I explained why I asked her to knock it off. She had a list of problems with me it seemed like. First when I greeted her I asked the child's name and then asked who her mother was, which is offensive since she had two mothers and I shouldn't have assumed they weren't together. Then she claims I refused to acknowledge her spouse. Which through all of this the spouse never really said or did anything so I was pretty much just talking to the parent who was talking. Which not addressing her spouse means I refused to acknowledge them as a couple somehow.

    Then she claims that after she told me they were together I looked like I wanted to get away. Which this is somewhat true, largely because I didn't want to hear it, but also because other kids were arriving and I wanted to greet them more than listen to her.

    Then she said other parents were staring and giving her looks and I allowed it and she felt like parents were going to tell thier kids to not involve hers. Which as a coach I would never allow.

    Then of course I singled her out to set an example to everyone that I was in charge. Which is not why I pulled her aside.

    Then I made the apparently horrible mistake in the meeting of saying that I don't care if she is gay or not. And holy **** did that set her off. I was not supposed to call her gay, which may have some merit, I am not overly pc so maybe. And saying I didn't care about her sexualitat turned into I don't believe in civil rights or equality since I don't care about homosexual equality. Really wasn't sure how it got there.

    Though all of this I was explaining that she is taking everything way out off context and reading into things that aren't there.

    In the end, I was asked to apologize and promise to be more attentive of the sensitive issue. Which it took everything in me to do. It really did. She also got a refund and her child will be playing for free, and also will be allowed to play basketball for free when that starts. Her child is back on my team, and she is going to be my assistant coach to ensure he child gets fair playing time. Which I don't get since all children play the field, there are no reserves.

    But whatever I guess. Not too happy at them moment
    Yea. You gotta go to war. And it won't be your choice. Sorry. Problem parents don't stop there. She will be in your face at every single "injustice" that you commit against her poor innocent child and her protected "sexuality." I have dealt with it before when I was teaching and working with youth.

    My biggest piece of advice for you is: DON'T NEGOTIATE WITH TERRORISTS! Whoever runs your place negotiated. And they just lost. You need to go and have your own meeting with the city and explain to them that this person is a problem (when she is a problem). You need to make detailed notes if an incident occurs. You need to know what she says too. And you need to make it very clear that HER sexuality is not important. Her attitude is what caused the problems.

    She is going to be a problem again. I'm sorry to tell you. And the city needs to be ready by having notes of her poor behavior. And never mention her sexuality. Mention her interruptions.

    But if the kid is gone...just be prepared for it to happen again. We live in a society of "victims."
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