View Poll Results: Is American Social Conservatism on a Permanent Decline?

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  • YES American Social Conservatism is on a Permanent Decline

    29 72.50%
  • NO American Social Conservatism is not on a Permanent Decline. It will be Back.

    11 27.50%
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Thread: Is American Social Conservatism on a Permanent Decline?

  1. #61
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    Re: Is American Social Conservatism on a Permanent Decline?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    LOL.....care to give an example? Today's GOP has grown completely wacky because they have tried to appease the right-wing. I don't see the GOP "Capitulating to the libs" at all. The GOP is impotent because the candidates have been falling over each other to out crazy each other in order to get the nod.
    Then you simply aren't paying attention, or are blinded by ideology. I suspect a little of both.

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    Re: Is American Social Conservatism on a Permanent Decline?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan5 View Post
    I firmly believe it is. Do you?


    Social Liberalism in the U.S. on the Rise, Fiscal Conservatism Remains Strong | Cato @ Liberty

    Social Liberalism in the U.S. on the Rise, Fiscal Conservatism Remains Strong

    Yes, at least I hope so.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  3. #63
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    Re: Is American Social Conservatism on a Permanent Decline?

    Quote Originally Posted by countryboy View Post
    Then you simply aren't paying attention, or are blinded by ideology. I suspect a little of both.
    Care to provide an example? How has the GOP "Capitulated to the libs"?

  4. #64
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    Re: Is American Social Conservatism on a Permanent Decline?

    Quote Originally Posted by Einzige View Post
    I never said anything of the sort.

    There's nothing inherently 'wrong' with prejudice; I reject the self-evidence of the 'equality of man'. But I find Christianity anathema for precisely the same reason that the Christian finds liberalism abhorrent - its claim to universalism; its rejection of the distinct, of the peculiar.

    The belief that "salvation belongs, first to the Jew, then to the gentile" is the most destructive doctrine imaginable. A faith is either grounded I'm a people, in their cultural essence, or it works against them, eradicating those distinctions which make them unique.

    My aim is the recreation in American life of the aristocratic consciousness. This is intended as a palliative for three centuries of Christian-coerced democratic decline. I believe that hierarchy - real hierarchy, not an illusory Randian hypercapitalist market hierarchy - is innately valuable: and I in no sense imagine that I would be at the top, or anywhere close to it.

    The social conservative, who hates the liberal 'elite', is a symptom of the populist disease. Every other form of American 'traditionalism', from the Southern slaveocracy of the nineteenth century to the neoliberal 'meritocracy' of today, has made a mockery of genuine distinction of rank, taking as their respective measures an arbitrary racial caste system or fiduciary gain. These too are products of democracy, and as such are inherently tainted. (The landed gentry of the antebellum South is almost precisely the opposite of what I have in mind.)
    You've obviously given this a great deal of thought and study. I apologize if my understanding of the topic limits my ability to respond in kind.

    I don't know exactly by what measure the hierarchy you desire is constructed. Perhaps a little help?

    Tradition is an odd construct. I rooted for the Minnesota Vikings for years out of a tradition dating back to my father. It occurred to me about 5 or 6 years ago that Tarkington doesn't play for them anymore. Tradition destroyed.

    Does a tradition need to have a defined life span to be a tradition? Is the repeated practice of Christmas rituals within a family and unique to that family not a tradition?

    I am not a person that hates the Liberal Elite as individuals, but rather as a political force that seeks to control through deception and guile. The goal of the Liberal Elite is control and direct for profit in the firm belief that they are in possession of the truth.

    In this way the Liberal Elite in no way differs from the Religious Right. The only difference I can see in the desire to control is the method of the delivery of the message. The Religious Right is more like a barking dog while the Liberal Elite is more like a colorless, scentless gas.

    On to your characterization of religion in society:

    "Christianity is decadence; Christianity is decline; Christianity is decay. It is the ferment of the ages. There can be no Restoration until it is done away with."

    It seems that you are hanging much of the ills of society on Christianity.
    I am not of the mind that a man is either of science or of religion. At his best and his worst, man exists in the misty glimmering where the falling angel meets the rising ape. That he chooses a direction from that point defines him as human.

  5. #65
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    Re: Is American Social Conservatism on a Permanent Decline?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    Care to provide an example? How has the GOP "Capitulated to the libs"?
    Where is the promised "repeal and replace"?

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    Re: Is American Social Conservatism on a Permanent Decline?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    The GOP is slowly wise-ing up and coming to the realization that the social conservative agenda of the radical right-wing is what has in large part brought down the party.


    That agenda of which you speak is the same agenda that was pretty universal in this neck of the woods since about 1600.

    Care to square that circle?
    I am not of the mind that a man is either of science or of religion. At his best and his worst, man exists in the misty glimmering where the falling angel meets the rising ape. That he chooses a direction from that point defines him as human.

  7. #67
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    Re: Is American Social Conservatism on a Permanent Decline?

    Quote Originally Posted by countryboy View Post
    Where is the promised "repeal and replace"?
    LOL....seriously? THAT isn't capitulation to the libs....that was just a flat out lie by the GOP that anyone with half a clue found from the start. The GOP was never going to repeal Obamacare...they simply used it as a political ploy. Do you honestly believe that the GOP just gave in and capitulated? That could have repealed and replaced once they gained the senate. The fact that they didn't just exposed their lies and hypocrisy.

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    Re: Is American Social Conservatism on a Permanent Decline?

    Quote Originally Posted by code1211 View Post
    That agenda of which you speak is the same agenda that was pretty universal in this neck of the woods since about 1600.

    Care to square that circle?
    That's true to a point....but it didn't really get politicized until the 80's when the right-wing saw it as a tool to push their agenda. They learned about using it as a wedge to have more political clout in elections. It really hadn't been used in that form previously.

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    Re: Is American Social Conservatism on a Permanent Decline?

    There has been a fair amount of scientific and psychological studies on the issue. Social conservative, authoritarianism types see issues in terms of black and white and absolute wrong and absolute right. They are uncomfortable with ambiguity and have difficultly discussing and recognizing areas of grey. They want the government to endorse the absolute right behavior, and remove freedom and rights to engage in (what they consider) absolute wrong behavior.

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    Social conservatives want to use the government as a vehicle to promote, endorse, and compel adherence to their own personal or religious beliefs. That is pure authoritarianism. For example, even though it would have zero impact on their lives if the same sex couple up the street were to get legal recognition of their marriage, they are still against it. They want prayer in schools because they want their religious beliefs advanced by public institutions. They want the ten commandments displayed at the courthouse because they want their religious beliefs promoted by the state. It's all authoritarianism.

    Very few authoritarian regimes have not been socially conservative regardless of their politics on other issues. Even the Chinese Communist Party is pretty socially conservative on most issues.

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    Re: Is American Social Conservatism on a Permanent Decline?

    ebb and flow .. all determined by specific issues in popular culture, how they are characterized, and how successful the narratives are.

    the only right answer is .. No, it's not on permanent decline... it's absurd to argue as much... such an argument flies in the face of our humanity.

    in many cases the so-called "social liberals" are doing nothing more than conserving and proliferating very old traditions....such as the case of same-sex marriage.

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