View Poll Results: Do You Believe in Natural Rights?

Voters
87. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    36 41.38%
  • No

    51 58.62%
Page 85 of 100 FirstFirst ... 3575838485868795 ... LastLast
Results 841 to 850 of 994

Thread: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

  1. #841
    Undisclosed
    Unrepresented's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2014
    Location
    San Diego
    Last Seen
    06-12-16 @ 08:05 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    4,230

    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahlevah View Post
    Sure, he'll need an army to suppress the population, but as long as he buys the generals off with privilege, wealth, or a good story that's not a problem. A strong internal security service that keeps doubters in line is also a good idea.
    A general is still a single human being. The general will need consent of his troops.
    "The side that stays within its fortifications is beaten." ~Napoleon

  2. #842
    Sage
    Fletch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Mentor Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    14,082

    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    People are not rational just because we are people. There are plenty of irrational people out there. So this whole "by virtue of being a rational animal" thing is an excuse. It is you trying to justify why you believe we have "natural" rights, but animals don't.
    That we are rational animals is not a debatable point. It is a fact. Humans possess the faculty of rational thought. That does not, however, mean that we will always act rationally. As humans, we have a will of our own. We can decide to follow reason or not, but we cannot avoid the consequences of that decision.
    Animals have more "natural" rights to associate with whichever animals of either sex they wish than we do because other animals are not likely to purposely "punish" them for developing an intimate relationship with another animal of the same sex.
    ??? That's a silly analogy. Animals act on instinct, not rational thought. There is no right or wrong action for a bear. There is, however, a right and wrong action for a human because we posses the ability to reason. Since we are born with reason, depend upon it for our survival and are born with a will of our own, it is right for man to use that reason and to follow that will. That is what is meant by natural rights.

    And that is what rights ultimately come down to. Punishment. Can someone or something prevent you from doing something through force or punishment? If so, then that is what we are talking about with "rights". Even thinking and emotions of another person can be controlled, at least to a degree, with enough knowledge about psychology and the ability to manipulate the person.
    What you are describing is not rights but how one goes about violating the rights of others.

    And there are plenty of people who will tell you that people do not in fact have a "right" to mate with whomever they wish. Do people have a natural "right" to mate with a child? Why or why not? What exactly constitutes a child and does the age of the person trying to mate with the "child" make a difference to whether the right exists (what about another child?)?
    If you understand that everyone possesses the same rights, and understand that children lack the mental abilities to make rational choices--which is why they have parents or guardians of those rights--you will get why mating with a child would almost certrainly be a violation of that childs rights.

  3. #843
    Sage
    Fletch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Mentor Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    14,082

    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Then why does ISIS not see it as immoral do you think?
    Because like you, they don't believe in innate rights. Like you, they believe rights are determined by who holds the gun (if they believe in the concept of rights at all).
    I guarantee that in their eyes, they are not doing something immoral, wrong.
    And since you, like them, don't believe that a man has rights by virtue of his nature, you cannot make an argument that what they are doing is immoral. You, like them, believe that morality is subjective. There is nothing that is objectively wrong, so your own ideology disarms you when confronting their evil. Actually, since you, like them, believe evil is subjective, you cant even call their actions evil. They are just doing things you don't like.

    Is abortion immoral, wrong? Do you think the girl having the abortion thinks so or the doctor providing the abortion?
    Quite honestly, the pro-life position is the moral one since what is being discussed is the termination of a human life. Liberals, unable to make moral judgments because they lack a moral foundation, simply support abortion because they want consequence free action.
    You have your beliefs about why things are immoral, wrong, or "evil", but that doesn't make them objective, even if the vast majority of people share those beliefs. It simply makes it a consensus of subjective beliefs about the immorality of something. That doesn't mean that people cannot use that consensus or some other power in fact to force their morality on others. Personally I hope that this is fair and just for as many as possible (almost impossible for any set of laws to be viewed as "fair" or "just" by everyone), but that still doesn't make it objective. The only part that would be objective is saying that something is the law, is or is not against the law to do, or in the case of rights, that something violates a person's rights, rights that are recognized by the collective.
    So killing you would be a crime. Explain why it would be immoral.

  4. #844
    Sage
    Fletch's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Location
    Mentor Ohio
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:45 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    14,082

    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    In fact, all of this is just a desire by some people to avoid having to actually intellectually discuss the issue. They declare these rights to exist without having shown they exist so they can then proclaim victory without having to do the actual legwork. The same thing happens with religion. It's not impressive in either case.
    The truth is, the ones not willing to intellectually address the issue of morality are those whose intellectual laziness brings them to the amoral conclusion that morality is subjective.

  5. #845
    Sage

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:46 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    86,200

    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    sorry... you know the facts
    aha - the white flag of surrender and capitulation flying from your battlements. Excellent!
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

  6. #846
    Mixed Government advocate
    Master PO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    93,000,000 miles from Earth where its very Hot
    Last Seen
    06-15-17 @ 10:08 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    31,331

    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    aha - the white flag of surrender and capitulation flying from your battlements. Excellent!
    nice try....you do alway make me happy when you behave this way...

  7. #847
    Sage

    Join Date
    Sep 2010
    Last Seen
    Today @ 06:46 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    86,200

    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    nice try....you do alway make me happy when you behave this way...
    Then its your lucky day EB and you can wear your white flag of surrender as a Memorial Day uniform.
    __________________________________________________ _
    There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old's life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.... John Rogers

  8. #848
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    United States
    Last Seen
    01-21-16 @ 11:21 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    51,124

    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    rights are recognized by u.s. law, and the congress has never created a right.
    He's guilty of imprecise speach, not a faulty point. He's saying the parts of the Constitution which protect those rights can be repealed, and then your rights can be legaly alienated from you.

    If said rights were natural rights then they would be inalienable and it wouldn't matter who's constitution said what because not even a super masive black hole could deprive you of them.

  9. #849
    Mixed Government advocate
    Master PO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    93,000,000 miles from Earth where its very Hot
    Last Seen
    06-15-17 @ 10:08 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    31,331

    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Then its your lucky day EB and you can wear your white flag of surrender as a Memorial Day uniform.
    hay, if that is what you think, fine, enjoy your day feeling that way...

  10. #850
    Mixed Government advocate
    Master PO's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Location
    93,000,000 miles from Earth where its very Hot
    Last Seen
    06-15-17 @ 10:08 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian - Right
    Posts
    31,331

    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    He's guilty of imprecise speach, not a faulty point. He's saying the parts of the Constitution which protect those rights can be repealed, and then your rights can be legaly alienated from you.

    If said rights were natural rights then they would be inalienable and it wouldn't matter who's constitution said what because not even a super masive black hole could deprive you of them.
    well if the amendment were repealed yes you could make a law, which restricted speech, however it would go before the court and the court has already recognized free speech as well as many other rights, is the USSC going to reverse themselves and say free speech now does not exist.

    right to privacy is not an enumerated right per the constitution ..... how is it secured?....its recognized by law.

Page 85 of 100 FirstFirst ... 3575838485868795 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •