View Poll Results: Do You Believe in Natural Rights?

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  • Yes

    36 41.38%
  • No

    51 58.62%
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Thread: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

  1. #541
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    You can post whatever you want me to see in the Bouvier Law Dictionary. But even if it does define a word as you want it defined, does that override all the other dictionaries that define the same word in the same way as the definitions I posted?
    ask yourself this question.... why does this dictionary, and Black's Law, have two different definitions.....if it means the same.

  2. #542
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    There is no natural right to infringe upon. Thus falls your entire premise.
    so what did the 2A recognize given the supreme court in Cruikshank held that the 2A recognized a pre-existing right

    that is why your argument is specious and you think that the way to obliterate the 2A is to pretend its foundation does not exist
    Quote Originally Posted by EarlzP View Post
    Why would you not want to register your weapon?
    Quote Originally Posted by Celebrity View Post
    , as long as you can own one or fewer guns, your right to bear a firearm is not being infringed upon.

  3. #543
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    ask yourself this question.... why does this dictionary, and Black's Law, have two different definitions.....if it means the same.
    This is the first you've brought up re Black's Law. Couldn't make your case using Bouvier, huh?

    But here you go with Black's definitions which agree with Bouvier:

    What is INALIENABLE?
    Not subject to alienation ; the characteristic of those things which cannot be bought or sold or transferred from one person to another, such as rivers and public highways, and certain personal rights; e. g., liberty.
    Law Dictionary: What is INALIENABLE? definition of INALIENABLE (Black's Law Dictionary)

    What is UNALIENABLE?
    Incapable of being aliened, that is, sold and transferred.
    Law Dictionary: What is UNALIENABLE? definition of UNALIENABLE (Black's Law Dictionary)
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

  4. #544
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    so what did the 2A recognize given the supreme court


    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    The Heller ruling is irrelevant in stating what the Constitution actually says and what the Founders intended by what it says.
    he loves this word....

    notice... hes claiming his favorite USSC ruling is irrelevant

  5. #545
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    he loves this word....

    notice... hes claiming his favorite USSC ruling is irrelevant
    what is hilarious is he quickly cites the FDR lapdog supreme court to justify the commerce clause being the source of federal gun control power but he completely ignores the Landmark (and far more esteemed) Cruikshank decision-a decision the CITY OF CHICAGO cited in support of its gun ban-that held that

    1) the Bill of rights CREATED NO RIGHTS

    2) But MERELY recognized pre-existing rights

    3) that are not dependent upon the constitution for their existence

    4) and which only prevents Federal action
    Quote Originally Posted by EarlzP View Post
    Why would you not want to register your weapon?
    Quote Originally Posted by Celebrity View Post
    , as long as you can own one or fewer guns, your right to bear a firearm is not being infringed upon.

  6. #546
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    This is the first you've brought up re Black's Law. Couldn't make your case using Bouvier, huh?

    But here you go with Black's definitions which agree with Bouvier:

    What is INALIENABLE?
    Not subject to alienation ; the characteristic of those things which cannot be bought or sold or transferred from one person to another, such as rivers and public highways, and certain personal rights; e. g., liberty.
    Law Dictionary: What is INALIENABLE? definition of INALIENABLE (Black's Law Dictionary)

    What is UNALIENABLE?
    Incapable of being aliened, that is, sold and transferred.
    Law Dictionary: What is UNALIENABLE? definition of UNALIENABLE (Black's Law Dictionary)
    no.... i can make them in several aways ....would you look me to provide them to you, i will if you wish.

  7. #547
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    i said that in the original version of the document it was more religious....because Jefferson used "sacred."

    the document uses their creator , it does not say the Lord god, leaving the reader with subjective reading because it says

    When in the Course of human events, it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another, and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

    We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness.--That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed, -
    The use of the term God, referring to anything, indicates a belief in a higher power. Added to the term Creator, I don't think you can argue that they were leaving this open to a non-religious interpretation. These were religious men who created a government based on Judeo-Christian ideals. They believed in allowing others to freely practice the religion of their choice, but that doesn't change the nature of THEIR beliefs and the impact that those beliefs had on our government. They are saying that these rights are granted by a higher power. Thus, use of the DOI to justify 'natural rights' that do not involve a higher power is the same as playing "Born in the USA" at a patriotic gathering: The user just doesn't understand or admit to the meaning of the words, and is trying to pretend that the very clear language carries ambiguity that was just not intended.

  8. #548
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by TurtleDude View Post
    what is hilarious is he quickly cites the FDR lapdog supreme court to justify the commerce clause being the source of federal gun control power but he completely ignores the Landmark (and far more esteemed) Cruikshank decision-a decision the CITY OF CHICAGO cited in support of its gun ban-that held that

    1) the Bill of rights CREATED NO RIGHTS

    2) But MERELY recognized pre-existing rights

    3) that are not dependent upon the constitution for their existence

    4) and which only prevents Federal action
    i agree.

  9. #549
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    no.... i can make them in several aways ....would you look me to provide them to you, i will if you wish.
    Go ahead if you think the definitions I posted for both law dictionaries are not what they say.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

  10. #550
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    i agree.
    If you agree, then what are you fussing with me about?
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

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