View Poll Results: Do You Believe in Natural Rights?

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  • Yes

    36 41.38%
  • No

    51 58.62%
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Thread: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

  1. #371
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    Have a nice day Jerry. I made my argument for why natural rights exist. And you cannot make them go away by saying over and over that they do not.
    That's the problem, you haven't. You've claimed natural rights exist. You haven't shown that they really do. People are pointing to documents written by people who believed in natural rights. That doesn't prove that they are actually real. If he can't make them go away by saying they do not exist, you cannot wish them into existence by repeating that they do. You have to present some kind of evidence that they're real and differentiate them, in reality, from the only kind of rights we can actually demonstrate exist, legal rights. The burden of proof is entirely on the shoulders of the natural rights proponents. When do you guys think you'll do more than stamp your feet and ardently demand that these things exist?
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  2. #372
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    Well I have made my argument. And no, the right to think cannot be taken from me. The right to hope, to aspire, to believe, etc. cannot be taken from me. I can be denied my ability to exercise such things as I choose, but they cannot be taken from me. Again 'inalienable' means that you cannot surrender, sell, or transfer it to somebody else. The U.S. Constitution was originally intended to recognize and protect inalienable or natural rights so that no king or religious authority or anybody else could prevent the people from exercising them.

    And however much anybody tries to deny that, it is the truth just as not having the ability to understand what natural rights are or the concept behind them does not mean that such natural rights do not exist.
    Greetings, AlbqOwl.

    Excellent!

  3. #373
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    that is the only argument they have...."they don't exist"

    when you ask them to prove it, you get more of the same.

    then they tell you to prove they exist, when that question should be directed at them, how can they prove they don't exist, since natural rights are part of our laws, principles, and of history of the world and america
    But they do exist because each of us knows from our own experience and observation that we have ability to reason, think, hope, aspire, enjoy, create, believe, etc. I think the problem is in our crappy education system that no longer teaches people how to learn, how to think, how to reason. Instead it teaches them what is politically correct to think and say, discourages any deviation from that. A broader concept is simply lost on them. Maybe that cause their brains to atrophy so that they can no longer conceive of anything outside of what they have been taught?
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

  4. #374
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    That's the problem, you haven't. You've claimed natural rights exist. You haven't shown that they really do. People are pointing to documents written by people who believed in natural rights. That doesn't prove that they are actually real. If he can't make them go away by saying they do not exist, you cannot wish them into existence by repeating that they do. You have to present some kind of evidence that they're real and differentiate them, in reality, from the only kind of rights we can actually demonstrate exist, legal rights. The burden of proof is entirely on the shoulders of the natural rights proponents. When do you guys think you'll do more than stamp your feet and ardently demand that these things exist?
    so you are going to post a video of a 19yr old kid telling me natural rights don't exist, and that is supposed to prove your case?

  5. #375
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    But they do exist because each of us knows from our own experience and observation that we have ability to reason, think, hope, aspire, enjoy, create, believe, etc. I think the problem is in our crappy education system that no longer teaches people how to learn, how to think, how to reason. Instead it teaches them what is politically correct to think and say, discourages any deviation from that. A broader concept is simply lost on them. Maybe that cause their brains to atrophy so that they can no longer conceive of anything outside of what they have been taught?
    hug a tree today!

    get in touch with your feelings

  6. #376
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    That's the problem, you haven't. You've claimed natural rights exist. You haven't shown that they really do. People are pointing to documents written by people who believed in natural rights. That doesn't prove that they are actually real. If he can't make them go away by saying they do not exist, you cannot wish them into existence by repeating that they do. You have to present some kind of evidence that they're real and differentiate them, in reality, from the only kind of rights we can actually demonstrate exist, legal rights. The burden of proof is entirely on the shoulders of the natural rights proponents. When do you guys think you'll do more than stamp your feet and ardently demand that these things exist?
    Okay. I'll concede that you have no ability to think, reason, believe, create, aspire, hope, or conceive outside of what others allow you to do. So for you natural rights don't exist. But they exist for me. And there is no force or power in the universe given to anybody or anything that can prove they do not.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

  7. #377
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    so you are going to post a video of a 19yr old kid telling me natural rights don't exist, and that is supposed to prove your case?
    I'm still waiting for you to come up with any evidence. At least that 19 year old kid tried. That makes him braver than you.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

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  8. #378
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    hug a tree today!

    get in touch with your feelings
    LOL. But only if the government allows it. Otherwise such things are rights that don't exist unless government says they do.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

  9. #379
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    Okay. I'll concede that you have no ability to think, reason, believe, create, aspire, hope, or conceive outside of what others allow you to do. So for you natural rights don't exist. But they exist for me. And there is no force or power in the universe given to anybody or anything that can prove they do not.
    That's not how things work in reality. Either they exist for everyone or they exist for no one. You just keep going around making empty, baseless and entirely unsupported claims and the second anyone questions your assertions, you get all emotional and irrational. Until you can back up your claims, nobody has the slightest reason to take them seriously. The fact that neither you, nor any of the other natural rights proponents don't have the slightest clue how logic works is quite telling.
    There is nothing demonstrably true that religion can provide the world that cannot be achieved more rationally through entirely secular means.

    Blog me! YouTube me! VidMe me!

  10. #380
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    Re: Do You Believe In Natural Rights?

    Quote Originally Posted by Cephus View Post
    I'm still waiting for you to come up with any evidence. At least that 19 year old kid tried. That makes him braver than you.
    i already have many times...and it smashed your kid to a pulp.

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