View Poll Results: Is SSM a Human Right?

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    24 48.00%
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    24 48.00%
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Thread: Is SSM a Human Right?

  1. #21
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    Re: Is SSM a Human Right?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    well you would think that, however states have tried to make the case that its in their interest not to grant the privilege of marriage to SS, and they use democracy a vote of the people also.......which is why democracy is not always a good thing.
    Nothing is always a good thing but democracy is always the best method. A diversity of perspectives is the best way to examine a problem and arrive at a robust solution. It takes time, which is not necessarily a bad thing as you claim.

    Are you a fascism apologist?


    ps. SSM is a civil right, though one could claim equality under the law is a human right, as everyone would naturally want to be treated equally under the law (given that non-SSM already exists). So, in a void it's a civil right but given the context of others' already having marriage it could be construed as a human right via equality.
    Last edited by ecofarm; 05-02-15 at 04:18 PM.

  2. #22
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    Re: Is SSM a Human Right?

    Government sanctioned marriage isn't a human right because government isn't a human right.
    If you expect people to be rational, you aren't being rational.

  3. #23
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    Re: Is SSM a Human Right?

    Quote Originally Posted by mpg View Post
    Government sanctioned marriage isn't a human right because government isn't a human right.
    What about from the context of government sanctioned marriage already existing and some people being denied. Being denied equal treatment under the law is a human rights issue.

    Sure, if there were not others already allowed to marry, then it would clearly be a civil right. The fact that it already exists for some muddies the water.

  4. #24
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    Re: Is SSM a Human Right?

    There are no "human rights". Rights are manufactured, envisioned by humans.

  5. #25
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    Re: Is SSM a Human Right?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    that is correct..... and its created by government.
    I mean it is a legal right created by government unlike human rights
    "Sovereignty is not given, it is taken." ATATÜRK

  6. #26
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    Re: Is SSM a Human Right?

    Quote Originally Posted by Medusa View Post
    I mean it is a legal right created by government unlike human rights
    One can argue that being treated equally is a natural desire of all people and thereby falls under human rights. You're looking at this in a contextual void. It's not just about government recognition, it's about equality because some can already marry.

    I see it as such:

    "Recognize my marriage" is a civil rights issue.

    "Recognize me the same as others" is a human rights issue.

  7. #27
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    Re: Is SSM a Human Right?

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    One can argue that being treated equally is a natural desire of all people and thereby falls under human rights. You're looking at this in a contextual void. It's not just about government recognition, it's about equality because some can already marry.

    I see it as such:

    "Recognize my marriage" is a civil rights issue.

    "Recognize me the same as others" is a human rights issue.
    Not much of an argument. The "natural desire" of most people is to be special, NOT to be equal.

  8. #28
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    Re: Is SSM a Human Right?

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    There are no "human rights". Rights are manufactured, envisioned by humans.
    Human rights are like natural rights, they are derived by any group naturally and thereby are not dependent on authority or government. These rights can be violated but they always exist. It's a simple sociological concept, I'm surprised some are unable to grasp it.

  9. #29
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    Re: Is SSM a Human Right?

    Quote Originally Posted by clownboy View Post
    Not much of an argument. The "natural desire" of most people is to be special, NOT to be equal.
    You're not looking at it sociologically. One must presume, in the generation of a natural abstract object, that one must agree to the rule instituted and that it is for everyone. One such rule, generated naturally in all groups, is equal treatment under the law.

  10. #30
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    Re: Is SSM a Human Right?

    Quote Originally Posted by ecofarm View Post
    Human rights are like natural rights, they are derived by any group naturally and thereby are not dependent on authority or government. These rights can be violated but they always exist. It's a simple sociological concept, I'm surprised some are unable to grasp it.
    I thought you to be intelligent and am surprised to see you fall for that nonsense. None of that is true. There have been plenty of large population groups who never think of certain elements as a right. There is no "right" to life in the older Oriental cultures. In fact with Eastern and Oriental cultures a caste system is the natural process.

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