View Poll Results: Can Senator Sanders win the democratic nomination for president?

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  • Yes

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Thread: Can Senator Sanders win the democratic nomination for president?

  1. #61
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    Re: Can Senator Sanders win the democratic nomination for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    I disagree completely. The left is much more realistic about what it takes to get a candidate elected. If the left were as apathetic as you claim...they would have sat out the last several elections...but they didn't.
    ...did you entirely miss 2010/2014? When the lefts' base is excited about a candidate (Obama), they turn out. When they aren't, they don't.

    Statistically, the groups that make up the lefts' base (young people, african americans, single women) are simply less likely to vote. In some circumstances they can be pulled to (for example, a candidate they are excited about), but generally:



    They're more likely to not bother.

    ..you have a strong right-wing base to the Republican party that uses its threats to get the candidates to cowtow to their issues. It is probably why Romney lost. If he hadn't sold his soul to the right-wing and flip flopped on every major issue and stayed true to his convictions....but instead he felt the need to pander to the right-wing base and he couldn't shake his etch a sketch enough to reinvent himself for the GE
    Sort of - you have it backwards. Romney was to the GOP in 2012 was Hillary will likely be to the DNC in 2016 - a candidate that doesn't really match the base, and thus depresses turnout.

    Americans have gotten more polarized over the past few years. A winning national-level candidate now is one that excites their base without scaring off the middle.

    Last edited by cpwill; 05-03-15 at 09:25 AM.
    “In America we have a two-party system,” a Republican congressional staffer told a visiting group of Russian legislators. “There is the stupid party. And there is the evil party. I am proud to be a member of the stupid party. Periodically, the two parties get together and do something that is both stupid and evil. This is called: bipartisanship."

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    Re: Can Senator Sanders win the democratic nomination for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    what do you think? Does Sanders have a chance?
    Only hope.
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    Re: Can Senator Sanders win the democratic nomination for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by Removable Mind View Post
    Sanders is running for one reason. He's got something to say. What he has to say won't be heard otherwise. If this is what he has to do...more power to him. I think some will be surprised at the number of people who are really sick of the Clintons and would vote for Bernie...if nothing else but to make a collective political statement that enough is enough of the Clinton Dynasty.
    Lets hope that the GOPer's have come to the same understanding concerning their own Bush Dynasty!!!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Can Senator Sanders win the democratic nomination for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by Navy Pride View Post
    what do you think? Does Sanders have a chance?
    Bernie doesn't have to win to win.

    Even if he isn't nominated, he can move the debate. That will be a win for him...and for America.
    Proud to be a tax and spend leftist.

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    Re: Can Senator Sanders win the democratic nomination for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    ...did you entirely miss 2010/2014? When the lefts' base is excited about a candidate (Obama), they turn out. When they aren't, they don't.

    Statistically, the groups that make up the lefts' base (young people, african americans, single women) are simply less likely to vote. In some circumstances they can be pulled to (for example, a candidate they are excited about), but generally:



    They're more likely to not bother.



    Sort of - you have it backwards. Romney was to the GOP in 2012 was Hillary will likely be to the DNC in 2016 - a candidate that doesn't really match the base, and thus depresses turnout.

    Americans have gotten more polarized over the past few years. A winning national-level candidate now is one that excites their base without scaring off the middle.

    Keep making the Romney/Hilary comparison maybe someday it will stick. Is that what they say on talk radio nowadays? I haven't seen that comparison anywhere. And probably a lot of reasons why that graph shows us so close in 2004 was due to fear. In 2014 it's due to a great dysfunction in congress and the horrible channels where people get their "information" from.

    That graph also shows the independent base being bigger than ever, with a majority of independents leaning left.
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    Re: Can Senator Sanders win the democratic nomination for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by cpwill View Post
    ...did you entirely miss 2010/2014? When the lefts' base is excited about a candidate (Obama), they turn out. When they aren't, they don't.

    Statistically, the groups that make up the lefts' base (young people, african americans, single women) are simply less likely to vote. In some circumstances they can be pulled to (for example, a candidate they are excited about), but generally:



    They're more likely to not bother.



    Sort of - you have it backwards. Romney was to the GOP in 2012 was Hillary will likely be to the DNC in 2016 - a candidate that doesn't really match the base, and thus depresses turnout.

    Americans have gotten more polarized over the past few years. A winning national-level candidate now is one that excites their base without scaring off the middle.


    You are talking about two different things. We are not talking about the Democratic "base" we were talking about "liberal voters". I might agree with you if we were talking about the base. The point is, the conversation was whether liberal voters will turn out to vote for Hillary despite the fact that she is essentially a moderate/centrist candidate. Hilary will have no problems appealing to the base of the party and liberals will come out and hold their nose and vote for her because they know what the altervative is.
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    Re: Can Senator Sanders win the democratic nomination for president?

    Best Senator in the Congress. He would make a terrific President - maybe one of the best ever.

    He has no chance of being nominated nor of ever being elected.
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    Can Senator Sanders win the democratic nomination for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    You are talking about two different things. We are not talking about the Democratic "base" we were talking about "liberal voters". I might agree with you if we were talking about the base. The point is, the conversation was whether liberal voters will turn out to vote for Hillary despite the fact that she is essentially a moderate/centrist candidate. Hilary will have no problems appealing to the base of the party and liberals will come out and hold their nose and vote for her because they know what the altervative is.
    Oh stop it. You keep saying she's a moderate, but moderate voters never thought of her as a moderate. Just because you rabid liberals think she's not good enough doesn't mean she's actually a moderate. That's your problem, not ours.O'Malley is a moderate, Jim Webb is a moderate. Hillary Clinton is not.
    Last edited by Fiddytree; 05-03-15 at 02:53 PM.
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    Re: Can Senator Sanders win the democratic nomination for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by JohnWOlin View Post
    Keep making the Romney/Hilary comparison maybe someday it will stick. Is that what they say on talk radio nowadays?
    I have no idea what they are saying on talk radio. Probably a variety of things.

    But if you think that Hillary excites the liberal base of the Democrat party, I think you haven't been paying attention. In that respect she absolutely is a Romney - both of their bases know full well that they parrot the beliefs they feel will get them elected, rather than ones they hold.

    I haven't seen that comparison anywhere.
    Well then, given the way that this place tends to echo the arguments you find in the public discourse, it probably isn't "what they are saying on talk radio".

    And probably a lot of reasons why that graph shows us so close in 2004 was due to fear. In 2014 it's due to a great dysfunction in congress and the horrible channels where people get their "information" from.
    Fear? No - you saw a lot of issue overlap and a broad "middle". America was a bell curve, politically speaking. Now? Not so much. Though the balkanization of information-sphere's is probably (as you identify) a major driver of that trend. It's fully possible for most folks now to spend their regular days never coming into contact with well-informed but opposing views, and so they tend to view those who disagree not as being incorrect, but rather as being illegitimate.

    That graph also shows the independent base being bigger than ever, with a majority of independents leaning left.
    No it doesn't. It identifies that people are becoming more ideologically consistent. The middle is shrinking - "independents" mostly grow or not as a party's base is more or less willing to identify with it.
    “In America we have a two-party system,” a Republican congressional staffer told a visiting group of Russian legislators. “There is the stupid party. And there is the evil party. I am proud to be a member of the stupid party. Periodically, the two parties get together and do something that is both stupid and evil. This is called: bipartisanship."

  10. #70
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    Re: Can Senator Sanders win the democratic nomination for president?

    Quote Originally Posted by disneydude View Post
    You are talking about two different things. We are not talking about the Democratic "base" we were talking about "liberal voters".
    That's like saying that we aren't discussing Dogs - we are discussing Domesticated Canines. You might have an odd wolf or coyote here or there, but fundamentally, those are the same thing.

    I might agree with you if we were talking about the base. The point is, the conversation was whether liberal voters will turn out to vote for Hillary despite the fact that she is essentially a moderate/centrist candidate. Hilary will have no problems appealing to the base of the party and liberals will come out and hold their nose and vote for her because they know what the altervative is.
    you might. Thankfully, many of your fellows will not. There might be a third-party candidate that attracts them (if Sanders runs as an independent, for example), or they may choose to say that they are striking a pose because "Man, like, they're all, like, politicians, and, like, part of the system, like, you know?", or they may not even care. But they are less likely - statistically - to vote for Her Inevitableness if she doesn't excite the base.
    “In America we have a two-party system,” a Republican congressional staffer told a visiting group of Russian legislators. “There is the stupid party. And there is the evil party. I am proud to be a member of the stupid party. Periodically, the two parties get together and do something that is both stupid and evil. This is called: bipartisanship."

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