View Poll Results: Is America the greatest Country anymore? Or do you agree with Will?

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  • Yes, America is the greatest Country.

    36 62.07%
  • I agree with Will.

    22 37.93%
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Thread: Is America the greatest Country anymore? Or do you agree with Will?

  1. #321
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    Re: Is America the greatest Country anymore? Or do you agree with Will?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    The United States is only being hurt or humiliated by the stupidity of its own citizens. We're the only industrialized nation where we're still debating the reality of evolution or climate change. No one on the left celebrates that. We're terribly behind on equal treatment for women and gays. No one on the left celebrates that. We've become one of the worst industrialized nations for economic mobility and equity. No one on the left celebrates that. And the worst humiliation that this country suffers is how few of its citizens are actually ashamed of these things. That causes us a lot more harm. And if we could stop chanting "USA #1" long enough to see our problems, then maybe we could start to do something about them.
    Great post Pasch!!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  2. #322
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    Re: Is America the greatest Country anymore? Or do you agree with Will?

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Anybody can justify anything. Your hero Curtis LeMay, realised that the victors in war walk, while the losers are tried and hung. He knew well that had the US lost the war, he'd have been tried.
    Yeah, I read the same Wiki entry you did. I also know that when it comes to warfare there is really only one rule: don't lose.
    Нава́льный 2018

  3. #323
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    Re: Is America the greatest Country anymore? Or do you agree with Will?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    The United States is only being hurt or humiliated by the stupidity of its own citizens. We're the only industrialized nation where we're still debating the reality of evolution or climate change. No one on the left celebrates that. We're terribly behind on equal treatment for women and gays. No one on the left celebrates that. We've become one of the worst industrialized nations for economic mobility and equity. No one on the left celebrates that. And the worst humiliation that this country suffers is how few of its citizens are actually ashamed of these things. That causes us a lot more harm. And if we could stop chanting "USA #1" long enough to see our problems, then maybe we could start to do something about them.
    The U.S. has had "problems" throughout its nearly 239-year existence. That's nothing new. What's new is this sense of entitlement that the left fosters. They've taken JFK's admonition regarding service to country and turned it on its head: "Ask not what you can do for your country, but what your country can do for you."
    Нава́льный 2018

  4. #324
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    Re: Is America the greatest Country anymore? Or do you agree with Will?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahlevah View Post
    The U.S. has had "problems" throughout its nearly 239-year existence. That's nothing new. What's new is this sense of entitlement that the left fosters. They've taken JFK's admonition regarding service to country and turned it on its head: "Ask not what you can do for your country, but what your country can do for you."
    Once again, you don't seem to have any idea what your political opponents actually have to say. That entitlement that you oppose, it only exists in your own mind. We don't say anything like that. We don't advocate anything like that. The only ones expressing that kind of entitlement are the Tea Partiers whining that they don't want to pay taxes anymore, despite using government to enrich their lives for decades and passing the bill on to my generation. The entitled person is the one with the "keep your government hands off my Medicare" sign.
    Liberté. Égalité. Fraternité.

  5. #325
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    Re: Is America the greatest Country anymore? Or do you agree with Will?

    Quote Originally Posted by Leo View Post
    There will never be an acceptable and logical counter to the claim that any nation is the greatest country on earth - because that is simply an illogical claim which can never be proven.

    Furthermore it is a claim so heavily invested in nationalistic pride that anyone so lacking in sensibility as to make it, is going to be incapable of accepting any evidence of its illegitimacy.

    I have said this before, and I will say it again - there is no such animal as 'the greatest country' and there never has been. There are simply insufficient objective and universally accepted criteria by which to arrive at that judgement.

    It may be claimed that Scandinavia offers the most social justice; that Germany makes the best machinery; that Australia boasts the best white-sand beaches; and so on. Many such claims are verifiable, but what do they prove other than the obvious advantages? Is it common to hear Swedes, or Germans, or Australians, claim theirs is the best country in the world? And if they did, should that be taken as self-evident?

    "I am the greatest!" claims are most often evidence of an underlying sense of uncertainty, at best, and inferiority, at worst. After all, what self-evidently superior being has to tell others of his superiority? There is an old adage which says "Self-praise is no recommendation." From which one must draw the obvious inference that compliments must come from someone else.
    That's a good post. I am not usually given to throwing savage accusations at America for its own sake, but when Americans crow about being the greatest, they deserve to be dragged off their pedestals and I'm prepared to be merciless on this thread to achieve that aim. The Scots do the same to us English in similar situations and we deserve no less. I know plenty of Scots among my own family and friends, and when English people are not asserting their superiority, then many Scots are willing to freely pay us some genuine compliments, as equals. When we go looking for compliments, then unsurprisingly the opposite happens.

  6. #326
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    Re: Is America the greatest Country anymore? Or do you agree with Will?

    Quote Originally Posted by Andalublue View Post
    I agree with you entirely, but... Muhammed Ali? He WAS the greatest, wasn't he?
    Till he came along, we had to make do with Alexander, Catherine, Peter and Alfred.

  7. #327
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    Re: Is America the greatest Country anymore? Or do you agree with Will?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paschendale View Post
    Once again, you don't seem to have any idea what your political opponents actually have to say. That entitlement that you oppose, it only exists in your own mind. We don't say anything like that. We don't advocate anything like that. The only ones expressing that kind of entitlement are the Tea Partiers whining that they don't want to pay taxes anymore, despite using government to enrich their lives for decades and passing the bill on to my generation. The entitled person is the one with the "keep your government hands off my Medicare" sign.
    Exactly...it's bizarre that the generation that benefited from the most robust federal and state government in the history of the US turned all "anti-government" after they got older and would have to start paying back. Of course, as you mention...that doesn't include SS and Medicare....they "earned" that.

    I read an article calling it the "locusts" generation and honestly, as the years go by that's exactly what it's proven to be.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

  8. #328
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    Re: Is America the greatest Country anymore? Or do you agree with Will?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahlevah View Post
    Correct. If the U.S. doesn't demand an apology or reparations from Afghanistan for harboring al-Qaeda after it bombed our embassies and killed thousands of innocent people on 9/11, then it shouldn't presume that it did nothing wrong. But do we owe Afghanistan an apology for excising this cancer from the country? No.
    Sadly at least 18,000 to 20,000 civilians have died in the course of this "excision". Civilian casualties in the war in Afghanistan (2001
    So we can assume that there at least 18,000 to 20,000 other people in Afghanistan who are very upset about American and allied attacks on their country. These civilian casualties are breeding the next generation of fundamentalists. A life is a life - and a US or British life is not worth more than a life of someone in the Middle East without a voice.

    Have a look also t Malala and Nabila: worlds apart - Al Jazeera English which tells the story of Nabila, an 8 year old Afghan whose grandmother was killed by a US drone and who made it all the way from Afghanistan to Capitol Hill to address a Congressional hearing about it - just 5 representatives turned up. Here's an extract from the article below:

    "The unmanned aircraft released its deadly payload onto the Rehman family, and in an instant the lives of these children were transformed into a nightmare of pain, confusion and terror. Seven children were wounded, and Nabila's grandmother was killed before her eyes, an act for which no apology, explanation or justification has ever been given.
    This past week Nabila, her schoolteacher father, and her 12-year-old brother travelled to Washington DC to tell their story and to seek answers about the events of that day. However, despite overcoming incredible obstacles in order to travel from their remote village to the United States, Nabila and her family were roundly ignored. At the congressional hearing where they gave testimony, only five out of 430 representatives showed up. In the words of Nabila's father to those few who did attend: "My daughter does not have the face of a terrorist and neither did my mother. It just doesn't make sense to me, why this happened… as a teacher, I wanted to educate Americans and let them know my children have been injured."

    The translator broke down in tears while recounting their story, but the government made it a point to snub this family and ignore the tragedy it had caused to them. Nabila, a slight girl of nine with striking hazel eyes, asked a simple question in her testimony: "What did my grandmother do wrong?" There was no one to answer this question, and few who cared to even listen. Symbolic of the utter contempt in which the government holds the people it claims to be liberating, while the Rehmans recounted their plight, Barack Obama was spending the same time meeting with the CEO of weapons manufacturer Lockheed Martin."

  9. #329
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    Re: Is America the greatest Country anymore? Or do you agree with Will?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ahlevah View Post
    They beheaded citizens of ours. That alone is enough in my opinion to obliterate every last one of them. And, yes, we've been killing terrorists for a long time, and we might have to keep killing them, but every one you eliminate is one less threat you have to deal with. The fact that we haven't had another 9/11 is evidence that we must be doing something right. On the other hand, I'd like to see your evidence that if we didn't confront them with force they wouldn't pose a threat. At some point I think ISIS will be relegated to the dustbin of history. I can't say when, but it will happen, most likely because some people with a lot of weapons just decide to kick ass. Whether we'll be included among the ass kickers I can't say.
    Yes. I am amazed by those on the left who preach: "Don't rock the boat! You'll piss them off!" That kind of logic nearly led to Great Britain's demise as Neville Chamberlain attempted appeasement. And I agree that ISIS will fall...sooner or later. The kind of barbarity that they are practicing will be lead to their demise. The only question is how many beheadings of Christians and moderate muslims will it take before the west steps in? Obama is more concerned with honoring his pledge to the far left not to put boots on the ground then preventing another holocaust.

  10. #330
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    Re: Is America the greatest Country anymore? Or do you agree with Will?

    Quote Originally Posted by Anglo-scot View Post
    I quoted John Kerry's exact words from the article in which he accepted that the USA had committed war crimes in the USA. His views on the whole article are not recorded.

    So I am now possibly a "fool" who writes "nonsense"? Ad hominem stuff which again dodges the issue - getting uncomfortable is it? Shall we debate this properly and get into the definition of "war crime" and see how many of the estimated 20 million deaths caused by America in the last 50 years come within that category? Or, if you want, you can admit that the USA has committed war crimes in its recent past which have hugely dented its "greatness", and we can call it quits.
    Anyone who takes John Kerry's acceptance of American War crime accusations seriously is living in la la land. Kerry does not exactly have a history of credibility on the issue. That's why the swift boat veterans tore him a new ass**** when he ran for president in 2004 touting his military service. He slandered his fellow soldiers in Vietnam with accusations dreamed up by the so-called Winter Soldier investigation which was made up of primarily of soldiers claiming to have seen those alleged war crimes. It turned out that they had not even served a day in Vietnam. One of them did not even serve in the military.

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