View Poll Results: Would you support the decision of Texas to peacefully and democratically secede, if voted upon

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  • Yes

    69 51.49%
  • No

    61 45.52%
  • Bumbershoot

    4 2.99%
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Thread: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

  1. #951
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    I think I might've OD'd on my ADD meds before I wrote that. But thanks. ADD can be a lot of fun...if one's wife is very, very patient and understanding. Which sorta gives credence to John Carrey's quip (and I think he has ADHD) that "Behind every successful man is a woman rolling her eyes."

    You've got a good point on the SS - but we'd just have them that we'll continue paying what they're owed out of the SS trust fund - it is their money after all - and we could forgive their entire part of the national debt in return for us moving all our military and space program personnel and equipment out of their new nation. And if Texas needs oil, we'll tell them that we don't want to mess with Texas, but that Texas can certainly go frack itself!

    Sorry - couldn't resist....
    And what about those not yet qualified to collect SS?
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    hmm... the fantasy-city of Aynrandia versus the reality of Detroit.

    not a lot of room for y'all to trash talk there.
    Your post pretty much describes the gulf between the far right and everybody else - FANTASY versus REALITY. Lots of the far right already live in their own personal Aynrandia - they just have not changed their official address.
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    that's true, it would be new territory...that has nothing to do with calculating their share of national debt, though... or even if the issue of national debt would be negotiated at all.

    there would be a lot to negotiate... welfare benefits and social security might be among them... but it's doubtful they would be paramount in the negotiations.
    I suspect lots of people would see that far far differently. The far right would want to make it easy for a state to secede and your attitude on the debt seems part and parcel of that. Secession should be made as hard and difficult and expensive as possible so as to discourage the incremental dismantling of the USA. Germany and Nazisim could not destroy us but the far right seems to have an idea to do it piece by piece like the old Mark Twain boiling the frog .
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    And what about those not yet qualified to collect SS?
    They get theirs when their time comes - treat it like a long-term insurance policy for them, since they want to privatize everything. But I wonder if in the future we would deny their claim due to the pre-existing condition of them having been American citizens....
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Your post pretty much describes the gulf between the far right and everybody else - FANTASY versus REALITY. Lots of the far right already live in their own personal Aynrandia - they just have not changed their official address.
    fantasy Aynrandia versus reality Detroit.

    nuff said.

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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    I suspect lots of people would see that far far differently. The far right would want to make it easy for a state to secede and your attitude on the debt seems part and parcel of that. Secession should be made as hard and difficult and expensive as possible so as to discourage the incremental dismantling of the USA. Germany and Nazisim could not destroy us but the far right seems to have an idea to do it piece by piece like the old Mark Twain boiling the frog .
    well, i have no idea what the far right wants (nor do you).. but I'm not talking about making it easy whatsoever..... I think it takes much more than simply saying "we're out" ... it must take much more than that to ensure an fair and amicable break.... and no, that wouldn't be easy at all.
    you're talking about making it a punitive deal... when it's already a difficult negotiation to even bring the split to fruition.... there's no need to whip the runaways slaves,when there's a much better way to handling things.

    this isn't the 1860's... the initial split would necessarily be handled by current mechanisms, such as a 2/3rds vote in Congress after a referendum within the state itself.
    at this point in time, under current conditions, that would be an impossibility..... but in this hypothetical, it's already assumed the split occurred peacefully and amicably.

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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    I think I might've OD'd on my ADD meds before I wrote that. But thanks. ADD can be a lot of fun...if one's wife is very, very patient and understanding. Which sorta gives credence to John Carrey's quip (and I think he has ADHD) that "Behind every successful man is a woman rolling her eyes."

    You've got a good point on the SS - but we'd just have them that we'll continue paying what they're owed out of the SS trust fund - it is their money after all - and we could forgive their entire part of the national debt in return for us moving all our military and space program personnel and equipment out of their new nation. And if Texas needs oil, we'll tell them that we don't want to mess with Texas, but that Texas can certainly go frack itself!

    Sorry - couldn't resist....
    wait... " if Texas needs oil"?..I'm thinking Texas already has oil....and natural gas.... and refineries...and the pipelines to deliver it to the US after they purchase it ( though strategic reserves are probably already bought and paid for and would need to be guaranteed for delivery upon demand)
    you're thinking is backwards.

    on the SS issue, I doubt the US would continue to pay benefits for any great length of time... though it's possible to pay for current living recipients under a grandfather clause of some sort.

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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    wait... " if Texas needs oil"?..I'm thinking Texas already has oil....and natural gas.... and refineries...and the pipelines to deliver it to the US after they purchase it ( though strategic reserves are probably already bought and paid for and would need to be guaranteed for delivery upon demand)
    you're thinking is backwards.

    on the SS issue, I doubt the US would continue to pay benefits for any great length of time... though it's possible to pay for current living recipients under a grandfather clause of some sort.
    Guy, my post was meant to get a smile from my fellow liberals. My whole quip about the oil was meant as a setup for the line to tell Texas to "go frack itself."

    And btw - when it comes to "you're thinking is backwards." "You're" is a contraction of "You are". You should have said "Your thinking" instead, since "your' is the possessive of "you", which is what you obviously meant. When using contractions, regardless of whether it's blogging or official or academic or whatever, always say internally to yourself what the words are without the contraction. For instance, tell yourself "it is" instead of "it's" or "its" so you'll know which one is truly appropriate in context. Same thing for "they are" instead of they're" or "their", so you'll know which one fits. Do that for all contractions, and it will greatly benefit you as the years go by.
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  9. #959
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    it's not that no one has any rights in the absence of that government, it's that we would lack a protection mechanism ( which you allude to in your first sentence)... without systemic protections, it simply become easier to violate those rights that are possessed.

    of course, government , itself, can violate those rights... and government, if illegitimately and incorrectly instituted, can utterly fail in serving to protects rights ( such as North Korea)
    The Constitution has no protection when a State proclaims that they dont want its protections. When a State tries to secede from the US Constitution they do so without any provisions in the law of the land. They are in fact acting outside of the US Constitution. And if the States grievances are that the Constitution has been corrupted beyond any help and is a travesty to liberties and freedoms then the State at that point is not seceding from that which no longer actually exists. ANd there is not a legitimate excuse for any State to peacefully secede without provocation. So stories about a States right to self-determine their own government is being met by their existence under the US Constitutions power as the law of the land. If the States self-determination isnt being met and cannot be addressed then as I said the State isnt seceding from that which does not exist anymore.

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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    Guy, my post was meant to get a smile from my fellow liberals. My whole quip about the oil was meant as a setup for the line to tell Texas to "go frack itself."

    And btw - when it comes to "you're thinking is backwards." "You're" is a contraction of "You are". You should have said "Your thinking" instead, since "your' is the possessive of "you", which is what you obviously meant. When using contractions, regardless of whether it's blogging or official or academic or whatever, always say internally to yourself what the words are without the contraction. For instance, tell yourself "it is" instead of "it's" or "its" so you'll know which one is truly appropriate in context. Same thing for "they are" instead of they're" or "their", so you'll know which one fits. Do that for all contractions, and it will greatly benefit you as the years go by.
    ok, so you were trolling... fair enough

    I don't need a lesson in grammar.. it was a mistake... unfurl your panties.

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