View Poll Results: Would you support the decision of Texas to peacefully and democratically secede, if voted upon

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  • Yes

    69 51.49%
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    61 45.52%
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Thread: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

  1. #621
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by FreedomFromAll View Post
    So then if there is a convention (or a vote) that decides that we are all slaves then you are good with that?
    sorry, people have a right to alter or abolish their government....there is no right to own another person.



    those that say rights are created by man
    ..

    if that were true then the people could hold a convention and create the right to own other people.


    but man does not create his own rights, and cannot create such a a thing.
    Last edited by Master PO; 05-13-15 at 11:26 AM.


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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    sorry, people have a right to alter or abolish their government....there is no right to own another person.



    those that say rights are created by man
    ..

    if that were true then the people could hold a convention and create the right to own other people.


    but man does not create his own rights, and cannot create such a a thing.
    So who does create rights in the USA? Are there mythical gods in the sky dispensing rights like so much Halloween candy to costumed toddlers in October?
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  3. #623
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    So who does create rights in the USA? Are there mythical gods in the sky dispensing rights like so much Halloween candy to costumed toddlers in October?
    rights are recognized by the constitution, those which are not recognized in it fall under the 9th amendment and are recognized by the USSC which is not a law making body, and is not electable by the people.

    Unwritten Law

    Unwritten rules, principles, and norms that have the effect and force of law though they have not been formally enacted by the government.

    Most laws in America are written. The U.S. Code, the Code of Federal Regulations, and the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure are three examples of written laws that are frequently cited in federal court. Each state has a similar body of written laws. By contrast, unwritten law consists of those customs, traditions, practices, usages, and other maxims of human conduct ---- that the government has recognized -------and enforced.

    Unwritten law is most commonly found in primitive societies where illiteracy is prevalent. Because many residents in such societies cannot read or write, there is little point in publishing written laws to govern their conduct. Instead, societal disputes in primitive societies are resolved informally, through appeal to unwritten maxims of fairness or popularly accepted modes of behavior. Litigants present their claims orally in most primitive societies, and judges announce their decisions in the same fashion. The governing body in primitive societies typically enforces the useful traditions that are widely practiced in the community, while those practices that are novel or harmful fall into disuse or are discouraged.

    Much of International Law is a form of primitive unwritten law. For centuries the Rules of War governing hostilities between belligerents consisted of a body of unwritten law. While some of these rules have been codified by international bodies such as the United Nations, many have not. For example, retaliatory reprisals against acts of Terrorism by a foreign government are still governed by unwritten customs in the international community. Each nation also retains discretion in formulating a response to the aggressive acts of a neighboring state.

    In the United States, unwritten law takes on a variety of forms. In Constitutional Law the Supreme Court has ruled that the due process clause of the Fifth and Fourteenth Amendments to the U.S. Constitution protects the right to privacy even though the word privacy is not mentioned in the written text of the Constitution. In Commercial Law the Uniform Commercial Code permits merchants to resolve legal disputes by introducing evidence of unwritten customs, practices, and usages that others in the same trade generally follow. The entire body of Common Law, comprising cases decided by judges on matters relating to torts and contracts, among other things, is said to reflect unwritten standards that have evolved over time. In each case, however, once a court, legislature, or other government body formally adopts a standard, principle, or Maxim in writing, it ceases to be an unwritten law.

    principles :.....as in the principles of the declaration of independence, which are recognized by u.s. federal law.

    maxims of human conduct ............natural rights.

    that the government has recognized
    ..........natural rights which are recognized by the constitution.

    and enforced.........natural rights are enforced by man made laws, which are .........postive law/statutes.

    unwritten law legal definition of unwritten law

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  4. #624
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    if Texas left the union, the union would be in a bad way also.

    because Texas holds oil reserves, Texas holds [1] power grid of the [3] which other states depend on......so it would not be good for both sides.
    I agree... which is part of why Texas is never leaving the Union. But it would be hilarious to send troops in to arrest the errant legislator or militiamen who thinks differently.

  5. #625
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    In American Constitutional Law, fundamental rights have special significance under the U.S. Constitution. Those rights enumerated in the U.S. Constitution are recognized as "fundamental" by the U.S. Supreme Court. According to the Supreme Court, enumerated rights that are incorporated are so fundamental that any law restricting such a right must both serve a compelling state purpose and be narrowly tailored to that compelling purpose.

    Supreme Court to Decide Whether States Must Recognize Same-Sex Marriage

    Supreme Court to Decide Whether States Must Recognize Same-Sex Marriage - WSJ

    U.S. SUPREME COURT MUST RECOGNIZE MARRIAGE RIGHTS OF SAME-SEX COUPLES, SAYS HUMANIST GROUP

    U.S. Supreme Court Must Recognize Marriage Rights of Same-Sex Couples, Says Humanist Group

    the Supreme Court also recognized that the right of the parents to delegate their authority to a teacher in order to instruct their children was protected within the liberty of the Fourteenth Amendment. 4
    Decisions of the United States Supreme Court Upholding Parental Rights as "Fundamental"HSLDA | National Center Special Report[/QUOTE]


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  6. #626
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    sorry, people have a right to alter or abolish their government....there is no right to own another person.



    those that say rights are created by man
    ..

    if that were true then the people could hold a convention and create the right to own other people.


    but man does not create his own rights, and cannot create such a a thing.
    Well sure that is how you feel but the voters and the convention may feel entirely different about rights. You were the one standing behind that convention and a vote for secession as being infallible. If the State of Texas holds a convention or a vote on secession the end result is going to be that a majority (vote) or a minority (convention) is going to dictate secession. Just because a convention created this country isnt a excuse for a convention to dictate their wants onto the rest of us. Such a convention or a vote is designed to act outside of the law of the land a circumnavigation the US Constitution. But then its all a mute point since no State even remotely wants to secede and nor can a State secede without violating the 14th Amendment.

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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    rights are recognized by the constitution, those which are not recognized in it fall under the 9th amendment and are recognized by the USSC which is not a law making body, and is not electable by the people.

    Unwritten Law

    Unwritten rules, principles, and norms that have the effect and force of law though they have not been formally enacted by the government.

    Most laws in America are written. The U.S. Code, the Code of Federal Regulations, and the Federal Rules of Civil Procedure are three examples of written laws that are frequently cited in federal court. Each state has a similar body of written laws. By contrast, unwritten law consists of those customs, traditions, practices, usages, and other maxims of human conduct ---- that the government has recognized -------and enforced.

    Unwritten law is most commonly found in primitive societies where illiteracy is prevalent. Because many residents in such societies cannot read or write, there is little point in publishing written laws to govern their conduct. Instead, societal disputes in primitive societies are resolved informally, through appeal to unwritten maxims of fairness or popularly accepted modes of behavior. Litigants present their claims orally in most primitive societies, and judges announce their decisions in the same fashion. The governing body in primitive societies typically enforces the useful traditions that are widely practiced in the community, while those practices that are novel or harmful fall into disuse or are discouraged.

    Much of International Law is a form of primitive unwritten law. For centuries the Rules of War governing hostilities between belligerents consisted of a body of unwritten law. While some of these rules have been codified by international bodies such as the United Nations, many have not. For example, retaliatory reprisals against acts of Terrorism by a foreign government are still governed by unwritten customs in the international community. Each nation also retains discretion in formulating a response to the aggressive acts of a neighboring state.

    In the United States, unwritten law takes on a variety of forms. In Constitutional Law the Supreme Court has ruled that the due process clause of the Fifth and Fourteenth Amendments to the U.S. Constitution protects the right to privacy even though the word privacy is not mentioned in the written text of the Constitution. In Commercial Law the Uniform Commercial Code permits merchants to resolve legal disputes by introducing evidence of unwritten customs, practices, and usages that others in the same trade generally follow. The entire body of Common Law, comprising cases decided by judges on matters relating to torts and contracts, among other things, is said to reflect unwritten standards that have evolved over time. In each case, however, once a court, legislature, or other government body formally adopts a standard, principle, or Maxim in writing, it ceases to be an unwritten law.

    principles :.....as in the principles of the declaration of independence, which are recognized by u.s. federal law.

    maxims of human conduct ............natural rights.

    that the government has recognized
    ..........natural rights which are recognized by the constitution.

    and enforced.........natural rights are enforced by man made laws, which are .........postive law/statutes.

    unwritten law legal definition of unwritten law

    __________________________________________________ __________________________________
    Victory! Federal Court Recognizes Constitutional Rights of Americans on the No-Fly List

    https://www.aclu.org/blog/victory-fe...ns-no-fly-list
    [/QUOTE]

    There is no such thing as 'unwritten law' in the United States. You can make innumerable arguments to a court on the basis of rights, customs, or practice that may be considered but the moment they are accepted they become part of our common law or federal law, the moment they aren't they become irrelevant.

  8. #628
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    I agree... which is part of why Texas is never leaving the Union. But it would be hilarious to send troops in to arrest the errant legislator or militiamen who thinks differently.
    i don't see it happening.

    the u.s.federal government would cut its own throat by going to a state and arresting the politicians the people have elected.

    secession is a act by the people not by government alone


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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post

    There is no such thing as 'unwritten law' in the United States. You can make innumerable arguments to a court on the basis of rights, customs, or practice that may be considered but the moment they are accepted they become part of our common law or federal law, the moment they aren't they become irrelevant.
    really, what do you think rights are?

    did the congress grant you are right to free speech...among others....where are they granted at?


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  10. #630
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    In American Constitutional Law, fundamental rights have special significance under the U.S. Constitution. Those rights enumerated in the U.S. Constitution are recognized as "fundamental" by the U.S. Supreme Court. According to the Supreme Court, enumerated rights that are incorporated are so fundamental that any law restricting such a right must both serve a compelling state purpose and be narrowly tailored to that compelling purpose.

    Supreme Court to Decide Whether States Must Recognize Same-Sex Marriage

    Supreme Court to Decide Whether States Must Recognize Same-Sex Marriage - WSJ

    U.S. SUPREME COURT MUST RECOGNIZE MARRIAGE RIGHTS OF SAME-SEX COUPLES, SAYS HUMANIST GROUP

    U.S. Supreme Court Must Recognize Marriage Rights of Same-Sex Couples, Says Humanist Group

    the Supreme Court also recognized that the right of the parents to delegate their authority to a teacher in order to instruct their children was protected within the liberty of the Fourteenth Amendment. 4
    Decisions of the United States Supreme Court Upholding Parental Rights as "Fundamental"HSLDA | National Center Special Report
    [/QUOTE]

    That is a verbatim copy paste from wikipedia. What point are you trying to make?

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