View Poll Results: Would you support the decision of Texas to peacefully and democratically secede, if voted upon

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  • Yes

    69 51.49%
  • No

    61 45.52%
  • Bumbershoot

    4 2.99%
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Thread: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

  1. #501
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    sorry cant get around the founders...even after you screwed up and tried to use them..now you resort to other tactics.
    Madison is

    A Founder.

    You lose.

    You didn't even know the Constitution stated
    "Treason against the United States shall consist only in levying war against them"

    link removed by mod for breaking Vegas...

    Ur posts R A Joke.
    Last edited by Goshin; 05-04-15 at 08:26 PM.

  2. #502
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paperview View Post
    Madison is

    A Founder.

    You lose.

    You didn't even know the Constitution stated
    "Treason against the United States shall consist only in levying war against them"


    http://www.debatepolitics.com/penalt...post1064589650

    U r A Joke.
    thats right he is a founder, when you read the federalist papers it will open your eyes..until then they are closed for you.

    to levy is to IMPOSE...........THE SOUTHERN STATES DID NOT IMPOSE A WAR ON THE U.S....SO AGAIN YOU ARE WRONG.

    Quote Originally Posted by Paperview View Post
    So they could call themselves Confederate Americans.

    Who wanted nothing to do with the United States of America.
    http://www.debatepolitics.com/polls/...-exist-19.html (Should Confederate Memorial Day(s) exist?)
    Last edited by Master PO; 05-04-15 at 07:57 PM.
    Anti-Democracy advocate, Mixed government is the only good government

    THE
    second point to be examined is, whether the [constitutional ]convention were authorized to frame and propose this mixed Constitution.


  3. #503
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    ...
    to levy is to IMPOSE...........THE SOUTHERN STATES DID NOT IMPOSE A WAR ON THE U.S....SO AGAIN YOU ARE WRONG.
    ...
    Hey genio, the rebels fired the first shots. They imposed WAR.

    The first shots were fired in January of 1861.

    Buchanan was President and he was trying to resupply Sumter.



    Click to enlarge


    The South fired upon the Union Steamship Star of the West

    They took another ship and seized it: "The Marion."

    Then converted her to a Man of War ship.
    THE STEAMSHIP "MARION." ; SEIZED BY THE STATE OF SOUTH CAROLINA TO BE CONVERTED INTO A MAN-OF-WAR.

    Star of the West

    Note the date on the Harpers Weekly newspaper: January, 1861, linked above.
    THE FIRST OF THE WAR.

    "WE publish herewith pictures of the United States steam-sloop Brooklyn, and of the steamship Star of the West, and of the steamship Marion, which three vessels figured so prominently in the movements of last week; and on page 37 we give a large plan of Charleston harbor, showing the forts, etc., together with a view of Fort Johnson. These pictures will enable our readers to realize what is going on in this most memorable contest of the present age.

    On Wednesday morning, January 9, 1861, the

    first shots were fired At daybreak on that morning at the steamship Star of the West, with 250 United States troops on board, attempted to enter the harbor of Charleston for the purpose of communicating with Fort Sumter

    The people of Charleston had been warned of her coming and of her errand by telegraph. They determined to prevent her reaching Fort Sumter. Accordingly, as soon as she came within range, batteries on Morris Island and at Fort Moultrie opened on her. The first shot was fired across her bows ;

    whereupon she increased her speed, and hoisted the stars and stripes. Other shots were then fired in rapid succession from Morris Island, two or more of which hulled the steamer, and compelled her to put about and go to sea.

    The accompanying picture shows the Star of the West as she entered Charleston harbor; the plan will explain the situation of the forts, and the position of the steamer when she was fired upon. The channel through which she passed runs close by Morris Island for some distance.
    Fort Sumter made no demonstration, except at the port-holes, where guns were run out bearing on Morris Island."


    They did this before Lincoln even set foot in the office. Before they had even all officially Seceded. --> An ACT OF WAR.

    Seizing government property of forts and arsenals all across the South is also an Act of War.

  4. #504
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Paperview View Post
    Hey genio, the rebels fired the first shots. They imposed WAR.

    The first shots were fired in January of 1861.

    Buchanan was President and he was trying to resupply Sumter.



    Click to enlarge


    The South fired upon the Union Steamship Star of the West

    They took another ship and seized it: "The Marion."

    Then converted her to a Man of War ship.
    THE STEAMSHIP "MARION." ; SEIZED BY THE STATE OF SOUTH CAROLINA TO BE CONVERTED INTO A MAN-OF-WAR.

    Star of the West

    Note the date on the Harpers Weekly newspaper: January, 1861, linked above.
    THE FIRST OF THE WAR.

    "WE publish herewith pictures of the United States steam-sloop Brooklyn, and of the steamship Star of the West, and of the steamship Marion, which three vessels figured so prominently in the movements of last week; and on page 37 we give a large plan of Charleston harbor, showing the forts, etc., together with a view of Fort Johnson. These pictures will enable our readers to realize what is going on in this most memorable contest of the present age.

    On Wednesday morning, January 9, 1861, the

    first shots were fired At daybreak on that morning at the steamship Star of the West, with 250 United States troops on board, attempted to enter the harbor of Charleston for the purpose of communicating with Fort Sumter

    The people of Charleston had been warned of her coming and of her errand by telegraph. They determined to prevent her reaching Fort Sumter. Accordingly, as soon as she came within range, batteries on Morris Island and at Fort Moultrie opened on her. The first shot was fired across her bows ;

    whereupon she increased her speed, and hoisted the stars and stripes. Other shots were then fired in rapid succession from Morris Island, two or more of which hulled the steamer, and compelled her to put about and go to sea.

    The accompanying picture shows the Star of the West as she entered Charleston harbor; the plan will explain the situation of the forts, and the position of the steamer when she was fired upon. The channel through which she passed runs close by Morris Island for some distance.
    Fort Sumter made no demonstration, except at the port-holes, where guns were run out bearing on Morris Island."


    They did this before Lincoln even set foot in the office. Before they had even all officially Seceded. --> An ACT OF WAR.

    Seizing government property of forts and arsenals all across the South is also an Act of War.
    you stated the south wanted nothing to do with the united states, when you proceed to tell me they want to levy, impose war on the united states..
    Anti-Democracy advocate, Mixed government is the only good government

    THE
    second point to be examined is, whether the [constitutional ]convention were authorized to frame and propose this mixed Constitution.


  5. #505
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    I'll one up this: texas should be removed from the union
    what legal mechanism would that entail?

  6. #506
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by jonny5 View Post
    If enough people were willing, I would join them.
    The more targets the merrier. So much for you guys being patriotic though. Anti-Union is very much anti-American. And as such then please give your anti-American movement a go. It would be good to weed out those that hate America.

  7. #507
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    While unlikely anytime too soon, it's not unthinkable that one day, Texas might vote to secede from the United States and re-establish itself as an independent nation.

    If done in a peaceful and democratic manner...that is, if the people of Texas overwhelmingly voted to withdraw from the U.S. In a referendum similar to the one recently held in Scotland, would you support the right of Texas to go her own way?
    Hell no. I'd support sending troops to prevent such a referendum from even taking place and dissolve the legislature if they try to enact it. Secession is treason. Texas belongs to the Union, the entire Union. I'm not a slavish worshiper of the right to self-determination.

  8. #508
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    Hell no. I'd support sending troops to prevent such a referendum from even taking place and dissolve the legislature if they try to enact it. Secession is treason. Texas belongs to the Union, the entire Union. I'm not a slavish worshiper of the right to self-determination.
    No you are a slavish worshipper to the primacy of the integrity of the State over the self-determination and freedom of the people. it's a point of view and you're entitled to it.

  9. #509
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by LeoVlaming View Post
    No you are a slavish worshipper to the primacy of the integrity of the State over the self-determination and freedom of the people. it's a point of view and you're entitled to it.
    Self-determination, like everything else, must be wedded to an admirable purpose. Preventing the splintering of the Union is more admirable and offers more utility than any argument I've ever heard for secession. I could care less if people within an artificially defined space decide they want to leave. If they want to go they can leave the country, but the country isn't going with them. The economic, military, and cultural contribution of the area of land known as Texas, of the people living within that area, and the property and resources therein, are of great value to the country and will be retained.

    Fortunately this is an idle fear. Secessionism would be strangled in its cradle.

  10. #510
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Sherman123 View Post
    Self-determination, like everything else, must be wedded to an admirable purpose. Preventing the splintering of the Union is more admirable and offers more utility than any argument I've ever heard for secession. I could care less if people within an artificially defined space decide they want to leave. If they want to go they can leave the country, but the country isn't going with them. The economic, military, and cultural contribution of the area of land known as Texas, of the people living within that area, and the property and resources therein, are of great value to the country and will be retained.

    Fortunately this is an idle fear. Secessionism would be strangled in its cradle.
    A nice exposition of the theory that the people belong to the State, rather than the reverse.

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