View Poll Results: Would you support the decision of Texas to peacefully and democratically secede, if voted upon

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  • Yes

    69 51.49%
  • No

    61 45.52%
  • Bumbershoot

    4 2.99%
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Thread: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

  1. #331
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post

    what on earth does race have to do with anything?
    This map might argue, to the educated eye, that race might have a lot to do with a great many things as Rhett Butler might say :P




    You see those areas in blue on the last map good sir (and the areas in red on the first map)? Those are Democrat Party ideological strongholds in Texas. They will not go for Secession good sir. I'm sure you have already factored that in but I just wanted to make sure.

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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    Some people are butthurt that we would even entertain the idea that we Texans might be better off without them. They resent our conservative values and our independent spirit. They resent that they can't kick us around at will.

    Losing Texas would be terrible for the U.S. and be a huge sign of weakness a la the breakup of the Soviet Union, so no doubt they would do all they could to hang on to us. But I don't believe war or sanctions would be feasible options. I think they inevitably would have to bribe us to stay, that's my hunch.
    Most of my siblings live in East Texas, aka "the swamp". Texas has humidity, hurricanes, tornados, fleas, ticks, and the Bush family, all detrimental (in ascending order) to quality of life.
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    Some people are butthurt that we would even entertain the idea that we Texans might be better off without them. They resent our conservative values and our independent spirit. They resent that they can't kick us around at will.

    Losing Texas would be terrible for the U.S. and be a huge sign of weakness a la the breakup of the Soviet Union, so no doubt they would do all they could to hang on to us. But I don't believe war or sanctions would be feasible options. I think they inevitably would have to bribe us to stay, that's my hunch.
    it's not really the details that bug me... it's the very idea that so many folks here virulently oppose self-determination.
    they would have you dead before they allowed you live under a government of your choosing.... it's so very ...American

  4. #334
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ryan5 View Post
    This map might argue, to the educated eye, that race might have a lot to do with a great many things as Rhett Butler might say :P




    You see those areas in blue on the last map good sir (and the areas in red on the first map)? Those are Democrat Party ideological strongholds in Texas. They will not go for Secession good sir. I'm sure you have already factored that in but I just wanted to make sure.
    I'[ve seen your maps... you need to explain why you think race is a factor in any of this

    it's your argument to make, not mine to guess at.

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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    Bull ****. Texas doesn't have any one "by the balls" because the US can last a whole lot longer without Texas than Texas can with sanctions imposed.

    And the same thing you describe happening would happen anyway if Texas left the US, so it would be a losing situation for the US to allow Texas to leave anyway.

    Show me which Fortune 500 companies would support Texas secession from the US first. Not just those that are based in Texas, but actually would support a secession. Evidence of this support please.
    They're already in Texas. Show you evidence of the status quo? Tell you what, since you're making the assertion, why don't you show me evidence that these companies would leave, and that they would have the means to do so, and I'll await your reply.

    If you don't think cutting off one tenth of the Fortune 500 would tank the stock market, that's on you.

    If you don't think millions of Anericans depend on the stock market for retirement income, that's on you.

    If you don't think American presidents have Wall Street backers who depend on a healthy stock market, that's on you

    If you don't think Texas resources like defense contractors, semiconductor makers and oil giants are essential to the U.S. Economy, that's on you.

    If you think the American president, who is elected by all these people who would be harmed, would do whatever he could to avoid such repercussions, that's on you as well.

    As far as I'm concerned, these things are unarguable.

    And to say you can "outlast" Texas is wrong as well. It's not in Americas character to "outlast" anyone. We're an instant gratification culture. We don't have it in our character to scrape by for a cause, we want our SUV's and our flat screens and our cheeseburgers. That's who we are.

    Texas, on the other hand, would be struggling for independence. A man fighting for his home turf is going to outlast, outfight, and out-will anyone trying to do harm from the outside.

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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    I'[ve seen your maps... you need to explain why you think race is a factor in any of this

    it's your argument to make, not mine to guess at.
    That dude clearly doesn't understand Texas. He's giving us a map, I live here and travel all around the state constantly.

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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    it's true the USA would hold out longer than Texas... and it's also true that the US would suffer greatly as well.


    in any event, y'all are still stuck on civil wars.... the bloodlust runs strong, i guess.

    I'll check back in later to see if we're back on topic or not.
    According to those who back this, the US would suffer more by letting Texas go, so why do that? In reality, such a push would be squashed before it started because the federal government would almost certainly turn up the heat on Texans and more specifically Texas based companies.

    Now, if secession still appeared likely, then the plans would be drawn up to stop it as soon as the vote was final. US military forces would be in their faster than anything. And while I'm certain Texans wanting secession would put up a fight, they would not stand much chance against the US military, along with sanctions. It may very well cost the US money, but would be worth it in the eyes of many to do so. Plus, we would almost certainly "charge" Texas for such a thing. And all these things and more would be put out to the people of Texas prior to any vote. They would see that such a thing would not be taken lightly.
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by UtahBill View Post
    Most of my siblings live in East Texas, aka "the swamp". Texas has humidity, hurricanes, tornados, fleas, ticks, and the Bush family, all detrimental (in ascending order) to quality of life.
    I'm on a plane from Salt Lake to Dallas. You know what's detrimental to the quality of life...the fact that half your state is completely dead due to all the salt in the ground. Looks like you're on the moon.

    Mountains are beautiful though.

  9. #339
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by Peter Grimm View Post
    They're already in Texas. Show you evidence of the status quo? Tell you what, since you're making the assertion, why don't you show me evidence that these companies would leave, and that they would have the means to do so, and I'll await your reply.

    If you don't think cutting off one tenth of the Fortune 500 would tank the stock market, that's on you.

    If you don't think millions of Anericans depend on the stock market for retirement income, that's on you.

    If you don't think American presidents have Wall Street backers who depend on a healthy stock market, that's on you

    If you don't think Texas resources like defense contractors, semiconductor makers and oil giants are essential to the U.S. Economy, that's on you.

    If you think the American president, who is elected by all these people who would be harmed, would do whatever he could to avoid such repercussions, that's on you as well.

    As far as I'm concerned, these things are unarguable.

    And to say you can "outlast" Texas is wrong as well. It's not in Americas character to "outlast" anyone. We're an instant gratification culture. We don't have it in our character to scrape by for a cause, we want our SUV's and our flat screens and our cheeseburgers. That's who we are.

    Texas, on the other hand, would be struggling for independence. A man fighting for his home turf is going to outlast, outfight, and out-will anyone trying to do harm from the outside.
    You seem to not understand. Any talk of secession being likely in Texas would begin to be fought by the US government long before any vote ever made it up to the Texas state government. The first people that the US government would discuss the situation with would be those Fortune 500 companies. There is no way that the majority of them would support secession, but that would be even more cemented by the federal government showing them the outcome of secession. Then you would have at least the majority of those companies pushing against secession, including almost certainly an overwhelming campaign to gain opposition to the proposal. Then, if it still lost, many of these companies could simply help to usher in the federal troops, especially if they got some benefits from the government for opposing the secession and/or supporting the federal government as they came through to take down the secessionists.
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    Re: Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    According to those who back this, the US would suffer more by letting Texas go, so why do that? In reality, such a push would be squashed before it started because the federal government would almost certainly turn up the heat on Texans and more specifically Texas based companies.

    Now, if secession still appeared likely, then the plans would be drawn up to stop it as soon as the vote was final. US military forces would be in their faster than anything. And while I'm certain Texans wanting secession would put up a fight, they would not stand much chance against the US military, along with sanctions. It may very well cost the US money, but would be worth it in the eyes of many to do so. Plus, we would almost certainly "charge" Texas for such a thing. And all these things and more would be put out to the people of Texas prior to any vote. They would see that such a thing would not be taken lightly.
    Neither side would suffer if the breakup were amicable. We could form a trade union similar to the EU, and have a mutual defense treaty. Texans don't dislike America, they love America, they just want a Jeffersonian democracy that's more in line with the original intent of the constitution.

    We'll have our own president, we'll lower taxes and have a smaller govt, we'll pray in school and guns will be legal, we won't have obamacare. But via treaties and such, would be happy to continue to trade freely and cooperate on defense matters

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