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Would you support the right of Texas to secede?

Would you support the decision of Texas to peacefully and democratically secede, if voted upon

  • Total voters
    133
shrubnose said:
This was settled 150 years ago when the South lost the Civil War.

Any Texan who isn't happy in the USA can leave any time that they feel like it. The entrances to the exits are all wide open.
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ahh yes, the perennial "love it or leave it" argument.... it works for every issue imaginable.
 
LeoVlaming said:
I believe every nation has the right to self-determination.
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Right, and the USA determined in a Civil War that ended with the South's resounding defeat that the USA would not be split up.

We settled this on the battlefields of that war.
 
I fully support the right of Texas to secede as soon as possible. After all, most Texans (those outside Austin), don't want to be Americans.
 
shrubnose said:
This was settled 150 years ago when the South lost the Civil War.

Any Texan who isn't happy in the USA can leave any time that they feel like it. The entrances to the exits are all wide open.
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this is not correct ...to leave the u.s. the government wants people to pay a tax now.

Thousands Renounce U.S. Citizenship Hitting New Record, Not Just Over Taxes - Forbes

In an unfortunate record, more Americans gave up their U.S. citizenship in 2014 than ever before. The chart below shows a steep uptick, and although the numbers aren’t big in absolute terms, the trend is marked. The names of individuals who renounced their U.S. citizenship or terminated their long-term U.S. residency comes out quarterly. The published name and shame list is invariably incomplete.

Still, it makes 2014 the highest year ever, with 3,415 total. In 2013, there were 2,999 published expatriates. That was a 221% increase. In that context, a 14% increase may not sound like much, but given the demand, the U.S. State Department raised the fee for renunciation from $450 to $2,350. That is more than twenty times the average level in other high-income countries. The State Department says it had to raise the fee given all the extra work they have to process people who are on their way out.
 
no!!!

texas might be crazy - but the kind of crazy that you're glad to have on your side if sh*t goes down

stay in the union my friends!
 
ernst barkmann said:
no i not for secession, only the ability to do it if the people would desire such a thing.
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But if there is say...51% of the people who want to secede...you believe that would be in your best interests?
 
ernst barkmann said:
no i not for secession, only the ability to do it if the people would desire such a thing.
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exactly...

for me, it's a simple matter of self determination.... i'm not one to support holding people hostage to a government they have decided they do not want... even in the case I don't agree with their decision

it's a very American principle, self determination... or least, it used to be... obviously that's not the case any longer.
 
Removable Mind said:
But if there is say...51% of the people who want to secede...you believe that would be in your best interests?
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if the choice was between a convention or a referendum, i would chose the latter.

but 51% ...i myself would consider to close.
 
Bethlehem Bill said:
no!!!

texas might be crazy - but the kind of crazy that you're glad to have on your side if sh*t goes down

stay in the union my friends!
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Texas isn't going anywhere anytime soon... no worries. :)


despite all the fearmongering and posturing, this is all a hypothetical.
 
shrubnose said:
Right, and the USA determined in a Civil War that ended with the South's resounding defeat that the USA would not be split up.

We settled this on the battlefields of that war.
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so we, as Americans, can now dispense with the lie that we support self-determination...

good to know.
 
ernst barkmann said:
this is not correct ...to leave the u.s. the government wants people to pay a tax now.
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Thousands Renounce U.S. Citizenship Hitting New Record, Not Just Over*Taxes - Forbes

In an unfortunate record, more Americans gave up their U.S. citizenship in 2014 than ever before. The chart below shows a steep uptick, and although the numbers aren’t big in absolute terms, the trend is marked. The names of individuals who renounced their U.S. citizenship or terminated their long-term U.S. residency comes out quarterly. The published name and shame list is invariably incomplete.

Still, it makes 2014 the highest year ever, with 3,415 total. In 2013, there were 2,999 published expatriates. That was a 221% increase. In that context, a 14% increase may not sound like much, but given the demand, the U.S. State Department raised the fee for renunciation from $450 to $2,350. That is more than twenty times the average level in other high-income countries. The State Department says it had to raise the fee given all the extra work they have to process people who are on their way out.
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Wrong. It's not a tax, it's a fee charged to cover the costs involved in the process. :roll:
 
As a 5th generation Texan I do not support succession from a government and a country I think has been great to me. And I think these people that promote this are nothing but meager idealist with short sighted views
 
ernst barkmann said:
mute point....the point is the door is not just open to leave the government wants money...which is why i highlighted parts of your post.
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BS, why should the US government pay the costs involved for those who want to leave the USA? There's no such thing as a free lunch.
 
shrubnose said:
Wrong. It's not a tax, it's a fee charged to cover the costs involved in the process. :roll:
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Why should one have to pay anything to renounce their citizenship? If the US incurs costs because someone has decided to no longer be a citizen that is the US's problem not the former citizen.

And $2,350 sounds more punitive and covering administrative expenses.

As a practical matter there's probably not much the US could do about it if the person refused to pay, except perhaps refuse entry if the person ever decided to return for a visit.
 
shrubnose said:
BS, why should the US government pay the costs involved for those who want to leave the USA? There's no such thing as a free lunch.
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thats not the point.....the point you made in your original statement was to the effect people could just exit an open door from the US, and they cannot because they have to pay to exit.
 
To leave America, you generally must prove 5 years of U.S. tax compliance. If you have a net worth greater than $2 million or average annual net income tax for the 5 previous years of $157,000 or more for 2014 (that’s tax, not income), you pay an exit tax. It is a capital gain tax as if you sold your property when you left. At least there’s an exemption of $680,000 for 2014. Long-term residents giving up a Green Card can be required to pay the tax too.

Now, the State Department interim rule just raised the fee for renunciation of U.S. citizenship to $2,350 from $450. Critics note that it’s more than twenty times the average level in other high-income countries. The State Department says it’s about demand on their services and all the extra workload they have to process people who are on their way out.

Expatriation Tax
The expatriation tax provisions under Internal Revenue Code (IRC) sections 877 and 877A apply to US citizens who have renounced their citizenship and long-term residents (as defined in IRC 877(e)) who have ended their US resident status for federal tax purposes. Different rules apply according to the date upon which you expatriated.
Expatriation Tax
 
shrubnose said:
The door is wide open but you have to pay before you pass through it.

Did anyone on this forum ever get a free passport?
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they can pass though it, however it not a simple process of packing your bags and hitting the road.......so when people[not saying you] say "don't like it, leave"...its not that simple
 
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