View Poll Results: Should be on welfare be allowed to vote?

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Thread: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by rabbitcaebannog View Post
    What did they say about taxes and voting?
    That people who pay taxes should be able to vote, and that people who don't have to pay taxes but can vote themselves benefits from the treasury will signal the end of the Republic.

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    Are you contemplating whether I might be of the opinion that only men should be able to vote? Don't get too excited. To the extent that a person, woman or man, is an autonomous adult, subject to taxes collected by a government, such a person must be allowed to vote in elections to that government (taxation with representation).
    Right, like under the French monarchy all over again.

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    Women generally didn't pay taxes back then either. They were regarded as dependents. Dependents don't vote. This isn't even coherent.It's not myopic. There are adults with varying degrees of dependence on others for survival. On the extreme end of the spectrum, consider profoundly physically and mentally disabled adults. Some are unable to even express a preference in voting. If an adult is adjudicated disabled and has no rights or responsibilities because of that dependence, why do you regard this disabled person's right to vote so essential? And then there are many more adults who are less dependent, but still somewhat dependent on society's other adults to get by. Where on this spectrum should the right to vote be drawn? Or should no such line be drawn? Should we regard voting rights as sacrosanct such that being 18+ years from birth means you absolutely can vote?It's a philosophical argument. I am of the opinion that what underlies the voting privilege is being subject to the mandatory contribution to public goods and services provided by the level of government for which one would vote. I am not subject to New York taxes and similarly cannot vote in New York elections.
    I'm not following you down your rabbit hole, Alice. The topic....and I am having to remind you once again...is:

    Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?



    I'm not going into some other convoluted justification of disenfranchisement by equating all welfare recipients to the mentally ill, or that since you don't live in a certain state you cannot vote there (!?).
    Quote Originally Posted by Drumpf
    "I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose voters."
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    That people who pay taxes should be able to vote, and that people who don't have to pay taxes but can vote themselves benefits from the treasury will signal the end of the Republic.
    Um, it's already been established that the wealthiest among us vote themselves subsidies.

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    I'm not following you down your rabbit hole, Alice. The topic....and I am having to remind you once again...is:

    Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?

    I'm not going into some other convoluted justification of disenfranchisement by equating all welfare recipients to the mentally ill, or that since you don't live in a certain state you cannot vote there (!?).
    Any government to whose taxes I am subject, I can vote in those elections. People on welfare are in some cases not subject to those taxes because they are very poor and very dependent on society to get by. They don't pay taxes, rather they only receive benefits from those taxes. This is the essence of dependence. Minors are dependent and they don't have the voting privilege. Never have had it. Voting is (or should be) more of a function of being subject to that government's taxes than simply be some universal privilege you receive when turning 18.

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    That people who pay taxes should be able to vote, and that people who don't have to pay taxes but can vote themselves benefits from the treasury will signal the end of the Republic.
    But you have already argued that those with a "conflict of interest" (Seniors) should not vote.....but they do STILL pay taxes.

    Oh noes.....you are once again going to have to contort your extremist Founders argument around yet another modern conundrum!
    Quote Originally Posted by Drumpf
    "I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose voters."
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by rabbitcaebannog View Post
    Um, it's already been established that the wealthiest among us vote themselves subsidies.
    Campaign contributions are different than voting. David Koch, as an example, only wields one vote. He can use that one vote for the candidate he believes will help his business, but he also is subject to the taxes of that government. He can also donate his money to basically anyone he wants. If he was adjudicated disabled and had no means for caring for himself, he would not be subject to the financial burden of producing a tax for the government, and thus would not be able to vote.

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Gimmesometruth View Post
    But you have already argued that those with a "conflict of interest" (Seniors) should not vote.....but they do STILL pay taxes.
    Where did I assert tax-paying seniors should not vote?

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    Any government to whose taxes I am subject, I can vote in those elections.
    No. People work out of state, pay taxes to that state, yet cannot vote in that state....it is not thier residence.
    People on welfare are in some cases not subject to those taxes because they are very poor and very dependent on society to get by. They don't pay taxes, rather they only receive benefits from those taxes.
    Most able bodied adults on SNAP work and pay taxes, yet under your convoluted extremist one size fit, they should not vote.
    This is the essence of dependence. Minors are dependent and they don't have the voting privilege. Never have had it.
    I have no idea why you think their not voting is based on "dependence", this is a false premise.
    Voting is (or should be) more of a function of being subject to that government's taxes than simply be some universal privilege you receive when turning 18.
    And you go hopping down your convoluted extremists Founders rabbit hole again, to hell with amendments!
    Quote Originally Posted by Drumpf
    "I could stand in the middle of 5th Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn't lose voters."
    Quote Originally Posted by Moderate Right View Post
    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bodhisattva View Post
    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Neomalthusian View Post
    Campaign contributions are different than voting. David Koch, as an example, only wields one vote. He can use that one vote for the candidate he believes will help his business, but he also is subject to the taxes of that government. He can also donate his money to basically anyone he wants. If he was adjudicated disabled and had no means for caring for himself, he would not be subject to the financial burden of producing a tax for the government, and thus would not be able to vote.
    So, basically only people with money can vote themselves handouts?

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