View Poll Results: Should be on welfare be allowed to vote?

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    99 82.50%
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    15 12.50%
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Thread: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

  1. #591
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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    I suppose if you want to get picky over word choice the proper word for it is theft.
    Nope, I'm not getting picky. It's codified and justified in the nation's most supreme document. It's not robbery, theft or any other synonym because they all require the action to be a crime. Taxation is not a crime in any form.
    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    Original constitutional law? Lol. Taxes are placed on commerce with the threat violence. If you don't pay your taxes, the system goes after you. It's really that simple. The founders understood this. That's how the British crown enforced it, that's how it was always enforced in every system. This absurd notion that they weren't going to enforce taxation through violence is simply anachronistic.
    wrong, commerce is voluntary transaction, no one forces commerce on you

    article 1 section 8 clause 1 deals with commerce.....states are taxed and the money send to Washington...per the constitution.

    commerce taxes are indirect taxes, ..income tax is a direct tax.

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    if the people want government to give them the vote..it would be a privilege of government, and a privilege cannot override a right.
    Not if the government gives the right to vote in order to secure the citizens consent to be governed.
    "If you can't stand the way this place is, Take yourself to higher places!"
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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    The government cannot govern without the support and consent of its citizens.
    I don't recall a government ever giving giving up its power willingly, but I do recall revolutions going badly and the same ruling body continuing on like they were.

  5. #595
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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    I don't see where the OP includes 'ever'. I see the OP offering an interesting question to answer and pretty much leaves it up to those discussing it to interpret what 'voting' might mean or include.

    And everybody doesn't pay all the taxes they want imposed on everybody else. Everybody doesn't benefit from government programs targeted for specific special interest groups. Of course the less prosperous are all for the more prosperous paying all the taxes. But is that a fair system when the less prosperous then benefit from what the more prosperous pay for?

    Or is the more fair way to have everybody chip in for the benefits they receive? And those who cannot or will not do that will be at the mercy of those who do but are not given power to demand that others support them?
    lol no the word never was never used. But the OP as I said didn't mean just on welfare issues the intent was all voting. "Should they be allowed to vote while on welfare?"


    I see that you want to all about personal responsibility. Voting is the patriotic responsibility and duty of ALL Americans.

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    Not if the government gives the right to vote in order to secure the citizens consent to be governed.
    No government in the history of the world has ever really ruled by the consent of the governed. It's a pretty cool slogan though.

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Unitedwestand13 View Post
    Not if the government gives the right to vote in order to secure the citizens consent to be governed.
    government cannot give you a right

    natural rights and privileges are the only thing stated in the constitution...government creates privileges and only government is to honor privileges.. not the people.

    natural law is recognized by federal law.

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Hatuey View Post
    And his situation had nothing to do with what I discussed.
    It has everything to do with whether poor people are more likely to act out in discontent. The evidence suggests that just isn't the case, or at least poverty is not the reason for the acting out. And I think the issue of 'hunger' is a non starter because that is extremely rare in the USA and is pretty much entirely unnecessary when it does happen.
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    If a person is receiving SNAP then he or she benefits himself/herself by voting for the person who will ensure SNAP benefits. The person receiving SNAP benefits does not pay for them. Persons ineligible for SNAP benefits pay for them.
    You did not answer the question, you simply repeated your contention. This is not a debate, it is simply you repeating unsubstantiated Randian rhetoric.

    EDIT:

    I already stated that the majority of ABA SNAP recipients work, so yes, they contribute to their own benefits, and when their benefits end and they continue to work, they pay into the system.
    Last edited by Gimmesometruth; 04-26-15 at 04:40 PM.
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    When it comes down to it, all facts are cherry picked.
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    He didn't say it didn't make sense. He said it is complete nonsense.

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    Re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    wrong, commerce is voluntary transaction, no one forces commerce on you
    And that's irrelevant to taxation itself because taxation has never been a voluntary matter. Neither sovereigns nor modern states have ever taxed subjects and citizens under anything other than the threat of force. To claim so is absolutely revisionist. To believe the FFs thought in such terms? Ridiculous at best considering they created their new system by pulling the little bits of other systems that they liked. If you can name such a system at any period in recorded human history, I'll concede the opposite.

    I refuse to accept the view that mankind is so tragically bound to the starless midnight of racism and war that the bright daybreak of peace and brotherhood can never become a reality. - MLK

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