View Poll Results: Should be on welfare be allowed to vote?

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Thread: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

  1. #221
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    re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    simple...... because before the 17th, the senator was the representative of the state legislature, he submitted any legislation he received to vote on to his state legislature, who read the bill and directed him how to vote on it.

    all powers per federalism which was established by the constitution, laid powers in the federal government, while all others powers remained with the states, when the federal government creates any legislation which is not part of the delegated powers of congress, then it automatically is steeping into states powers, the states since they controlled the senate had the power to kill any bill which would violate the separation of powers.....keeping a check on federal power, maintaining the states powers, and preventing democracy from taking hold in america.
    Where do you get the fiction that the senator was representing the state legislature? You make up this nonsense which is not at all true. The senator represented the state - and that includes ALL of the people in that state no matter if the legislature appointed the senator.
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    re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by Zyphlin View Post
    Absolutely. There's no reasonable explanation as to why they shouldn't. Becuase they gain a benefit from the government? So does every single other american. I understand the issues brought up by the likes of Ben Franklin and de Tocqueville as it relates to the faltering of democracy once it's discovered one can in essence vote themselves money, "welfare" is not the only means in which this occurs and limiting voting based singularly on that seems less an effort to restore democracy or legitimacy and instead simply a calculated partisan plan abscent any honest desires for liberty.
    But. . . .there is one other argument to be made. (Disclaimer: I am not uncharitable or unsympathetic to the poor. I devote a great deal of my time and talent and personal resources up close and personal with the poor.)

    You may bend over backwards to accommodate the guest in your home and that makes you a good and gracious host. But how would you feel about it if that guest then assumed power to dictate to you what his sleeping accommodations will be, what food and drink you will serve at whatever expense, and that his every need be met?

    How is that different from those who cannot or will not work for what they have dictating to those who must provide for them how much the others will provide?
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

  3. #223
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    re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Where do you get the fiction that the senator was representing the state legislature? You make up this nonsense which is not at all true. The senator represented the state - and that includes ALL of the people in that state no matter if the legislature appointed the senator.
    if you cant figure that out you are sad.....a representative represents the people/body that put him into office.

    the state legislature puts the senator into office, ..the people do not put him into office.

    the senates job before the 17th, was to check the power of the federal government, block the collective captivity of the people in the house, protect rights of the people, and to maintain the states powers.
    Last edited by Master PO; 04-23-15 at 02:04 PM.
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    re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    if you cant figure that out you are sad.....a representative represents the people/body that put him into office.

    the state legislature puts the senator into office, ..the people do not put him into office.
    The Constitution DOES NOT SAY THAT. You just made it up.
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    re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    The Constitution DOES NOT SAY THAT. You just made it up.

    does not need to,...... the state legislatures put the senators in office didn't they before the 17th.......yes or no?
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    re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    does not need to,...... the state legislatures put the senators in office didn't they before the 17th.......yes or no?
    Actually it does need to say that to support your allegation. And it does NOT say that. So you just made it up.

    Yes, the state legislature as representatives of the people of the state placed senators in office. They did that exactly the same way they passed laws for the state representing the people and in the name of the people. As such the senators represented the entire state - and that includes all the people of the state for without the people there would be no state.
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    re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by AlbqOwl View Post
    But. . . .there is one other argument to be made. (Disclaimer: I am not uncharitable or unsympathetic to the poor. I devote a great deal of my time and talent and personal resources up close and personal with the poor.)

    You may bend over backwards to accommodate the guest in your home and that makes you a good and gracious host. But how would you feel about it if that guest then assumed power to dictate to you what his sleeping accommodations will be, what food and drink you will serve at whatever expense, and that his every need be met?

    How is that different from those who cannot or will not work for what they have dictating to those who must provide for them how much the others will provide?
    The numbers are too diluted for that to happen.
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    re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Of course they should have the right to vote.

    The 15th and 19th amendments stopped stuffy old rich white landowners from being the only ones to vote.

    (posted this without reading every page - if it's been mentioned, my apologies)
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    re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    The numbers are too diluted for that to happen.
    The numbers of what are too diluted?
    "I think the best way of doing good to the poor, is not making them easy in poverty, but leading or driving them out of it." --Benjamin Franklin 1776

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    re: Should people on welfare be allowed to vote?[W:504]

    Quote Originally Posted by haymarket View Post
    Actually it does need to say that to support your allegation. And it does NOT say that. So you just made it up.

    Yes, the state legislature as representatives of the people of the state placed senators in office. They did that exactly the same way they passed laws for the state representing the people and in the name of the people. As such the senators represented the entire state - and that includes all the people of the state for without the people there would be no state.
    sorry wrong.

    the house the representative body of the people........the senate is the representative body of the states.

    the senator is chosen by the state legislature, not the people, therefore he represents the legislative body of the state.
    Anti-Democracy advocate, Mixed government is the only good government

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    second point to be examined is, whether the [constitutional ]convention were authorized to frame and propose this mixed Constitution.


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