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Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

  • Yes

    Votes: 23 39.0%

  • No

    Votes: 27 45.8%

  • Other

    Votes: 9 15.3%
  • Total voters
    59
Mason66 said:
Does a rattlesnake have a right to eat a mouse?
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Yes, but not near my dogs. I try to keep all prime rodent habitat (like wood piles and tall grass) well away from the dog pens. Usually the rattlesnkes stay out in the pastures but when the pastures get bush hogged then the snakes tend to relocate.
 
spud_meister said:
Important semantics.
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Reminds me of the scene in A Few Good Men where Demi Moore objects, is overruled by the judge, then proceeds to "strenuously object". :lol:

Quote from movie:
Lt. Weinberg: "I strenuously object?" Is that how it works? Hm? "Objection." "Overruled." "Oh, no, no, no. No, I STRENUOUSLY object." "Oh. Well, if you strenuously object then I should take some time to reconsider."

If they're IMPORTANT semantics, that changes everything.
 
Black Dog said:
So when confronted with the facts that insects are animals and have the ability to experience pain and suffering... they are "psychotic."

So where do insects fall on this scale? Probably further away from mammals and even cephalopods. But how do you KNOW? We don’t. New studies are coming out and it will be exciting to follow them.

As of right now the animal testing regulations draw a line between vertebrates and non-vertebrates (with the exceptions of some cephalopods). I do not think any research to date warrants a discussion of moving the line, but at the same time I do not think we should rule out the possibility that insects are capable of pain, albeit through different neurological pathways. - Relax. I'm an Entomologist | Do insects feel pain?

So again I ask...

Just the cute fuzzy ones?
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Aren't you drawing your own arbitrary line between companion animals (which should be protected from abuse) and livestock (**** them, it their own fault that they taste so good)?
 
spud_meister said:
Because there is, or was, the potential to understand rights. Animals are dumb, there's no point giving them rights.
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I don't think animals are dumb at all. They may have a different type of understanding and intelligence but that doesn't make them "dumb".
 
I don't think animals should necessarily have rights, but I believe animal cruelty should be illegal and endangered species protected.
 
Black Dog said:
What line of thinking would that be? Humans are omnivores, and we eat meat and plants. We are not going to give up our meat supply because a few yokels feel bad about it.
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Right. Why should we have ever given up bear baiting and dog fighting because of the sensiblities of a few yokels?


Black Dog said:
No it's not. It's like the idiots who try and compare humans children for the same reason... they are still humans.
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Wasn't the argument made that animals are "dumb" and for that reason alone, they have no rights (which, if true, means they have no right to protection). It's a valid point to then point out that there are plenty of humans who are "dumb" as well.
 
X Factor said:
Aren't you drawing your own arbitrary line between companion animals (which should be protected from abuse) and livestock (**** them, it their own fault that they taste so good)?
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No. I have no idea where you came up with that.
 
X Factor said:
Right. Why should we have ever given up bear baiting and dog fighting because of the sensiblities of a few yokels?
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When did we give those up? We made them illegal, huge difference.

X Factor said:
Wasn't the argument made that animals are "dumb" and for that reason alone, they have no rights (which, if true, means they have no right to protection). It's a valid point to then point out that there are plenty of humans who are "dumb" as well.
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Yes by Spud. Animals are dumb, this is just one of the reasons not to give them "rights." They are not and will never be human is another.
 
X Factor said:
I don't think animals are dumb at all. They may have a different type of understanding and intelligence but that doesn't make them "dumb".
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Is a 5 or 6 year old dumb? Because the smartest animal on planet earth is about that smart. Has nothing to do with a "different type of understanding." The vast majority of what we call animals are quite stupid or dumb by human standards. I will use the alligator for example. Here is an animal that can grow up to 12 feet long. It's brain is the size of a marble. Not much going on there but instinct.
 
Dovkan said:
Animal rights is the idea that some, or all, non-human animals are entitled to the possession of their own lives, and that their most basic interests – such as the lack of suffering – should be afforded the same consideration as similar interests of human beings.
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Let us define the possession of their own lives. Please don't get me wrong, all animal cruelty, neglect should be punished severely. I would go even further to say that breeding of domesticated animals should be closely monitored until all animals have a suitable home.
But with rights come responsibilities. Animals, more often than not, can't be held responsible for their own circumstance, just as we can't expect a dog or cat to know when not to cross a busy road.
 
Dovkan said:
Current farming practices are disgusting and shameful, which is why I truly believe vegan ism is the future, but that's another thing entirely.
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Define "cruel". I grew up in the chicken farming business and let me tell you something about chickens man. Chickens are some of the dumbest ****ing animals in the world. Well at least at night. In the day time they are fairly crafty. If you have a chicken farm with about 70,000+ chickens how do you think you gather them all up in less than 6 hours to take to the slaughter house? You turn off the lights. If you turn off the lights they are so dumb that they think they are asleep. They won't even move. If you are in a sea of chickens with the lights off you literally have to kick them out of your way to get out the door. I made that mistake once when I was a kid. Other than that farmers do everything they can to protect them and be humane. They have to constantly worry about chicken hawks, wild cats, dogs, the heat, the cold, disease, tornados, hurricanes, etc. My thing is, actually do it be a farmer, and see how hard it is to raise these things then preach.
 
SMTA said:
Seconds, as in second helping.

Are pictures required for you?
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You know you must be civil even when it goes over my head. :2razz:
 
Dovkan said:
This issue is very important to me, and I would like to hear others opinions. I think this is a very important issue that doesn't get the attention that it deserves.
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I think it depends entirely on the animal. I think primates, cetaceans, and perhaps a few other species should be subject to more stringent protections due to their capacity for intelligence and possible sentience. However I wouldn't go so far as to call those rights. I'd also always keep those protections circumscribed as human need should always trump any protection we give to an animal.
 
Dovkan said:
This issue is very important to me, and I would like to hear others opinions. I think this is a very important issue that doesn't get the attention that it deserves.
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Unless animals evolve full human level intelligence and sentience via Planet of the Apes. Then I say no.
 
Dovkan said:
Current farming practices are disgusting and shameful, which is why I truly believe vegan ism is the future, but that's another thing entirely.
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Veganism is not the future or at least a future I don't want to live in. As the human population grows things in your view are only going to get worst to feed the population.
 
JohnWOlin said:
Define "cruel". I grew up in the chicken farming business and let me tell you something about chickens man. Chickens are some of the dumbest ****ing animals in the world. Well at least at night. In the day time they are fairly crafty. If you have a chicken farm with about 70,000+ chickens how do you think you gather them all up in less than 6 hours to take to the slaughter house? You turn off the lights. If you turn off the lights they are so dumb that they think they are asleep. They won't even move. If you are in a sea of chickens with the lights off you literally have to kick them out of your way to get out the door. I made that mistake once when I was a kid. Other than that farmers do everything they can to protect them and be humane. They have to constantly worry about chicken hawks, wild cats, dogs, the heat, the cold, disease, tornados, hurricanes, etc. My thing is, actually do it be a farmer, and see how hard it is to raise these things then preach.
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YE9l94b3x9U
 
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