View Poll Results: Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

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  • Yes

    23 38.98%
  • No

    27 45.76%
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Thread: Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

  1. #221
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    Re: Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    Only that black people aren't animals and they are actually just as human as white people are, so unless you're claiming animals are mislabeled as inferior to humans when they aren't you're not having a point here.
    That is what i'm saying yes, would've thought the other paragraphs made that clear.

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    Just like X you have taken to the belief that because I said animals are closer to an object than they are to a person that suddenly means they have no emotions or thinking capabilities at all. I haven't said it, so do concern yourself with what I said and not with what you'd like to have me say eh.
    Plenty of humans fit this description as well, putting their *special* thinking skills to work with frequent brain farts on twitter. A lot of males in particular still take pride in showing no emotion, and may as well have none

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    If they were half intelligent as human beings are they would have ****ed up the planet quite like humans do. And the way you label human intelligence as simply being the abilities to "create useless objects and philosophies" is ridiculous. We've extended our life length by more than twice in few millenniums, we're capable of traveling out to space, what the hell are you even talking about. Show me a chimp that understands Einstein's theory of relativity or Newton's three laws of motions and then we'll talk.
    Either they're smart enough to *not* **** up the planet, or a species smarter than humans would've figured out a way to control climate change before it became a crisis.

    Few humans understand these things either. You are attributing to the whole species a few accomplishments by truly exceptional humans. How many in your graduating class understood relativity, or how to build a space ship? Even then, our space ships have blown up right after taking off, and relativity is still under revision. For every leap, there's a stumble

    Quote Originally Posted by Apocalypse View Post
    I don't believe that the ability to create a true AI is something that is within our technological reach. Regardless even if it could happen no one can know what level of intelligence will such machines reach or if they'll exceed human beings at all, and not just be humans with a much faster calculation speed.
    Computers are already besting the human chess champion, winning jeapordy, driving cars for us. Some of the leaders in this field predict they'll become self aware by 2040
    Last edited by chromium; 04-23-15 at 09:20 AM.

  2. #222
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    Re: Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    Would you treat a snake with the same level of respect you give your dogs?
    Until it tries to bite my ankle with deadly venom, sure. Then i'll plead self defense when i stomp on it

  3. #223
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    Re: Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

    Quote Originally Posted by Medusa View Post
    which one ,tv or dog ???

    only one ' yes ' gets 'likes ' .interesting
    He's saying they're the same.

  4. #224
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    Re: Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    He's saying they're the same.
    too bad ,cotton. I would bite him if I were his dog
    "Sovereignty is not given, it is taken." ATATÜRK

  5. #225
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    Re: Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    Would you treat a snake with the same level of respect you give your dogs?
    Probably more. Having encountered a couple rattle snakes where I live, I tend to give snakes a lot of room. Speaking of respect, how can you claim respect for any creature you view as being so stupid as to believe they have zero right to not be abused, hurt, tortured, etc.? (If you haven't claimed that you have respect for animals, just let me know that because that would make sense).

  6. #226
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    Re: Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    That is what i'm saying yes, would've thought the other paragraphs made that clear.
    That animals are inferior to human beings? Because that would be my argument.

    Plenty of humans fit this description as well, putting their *special* thinking skills to work with frequent brain farts on twitter. A lot of males in particular still take pride in showing no emotion, and may as well have none
    Unless you're talking about mental disorders I don't know what you're talking about.
    Men who say they don't have emotions, amazingly, have emotions.

    Either they're smart enough to *not* **** up the planet, or a species smarter than humans would've figured out a way to control climate change before it became a crisis.

    Few humans understand these things either. You are attributing to the whole species a few accomplishments by truly exceptional humans. How many in your graduating class understood relativity, or how to build a space ship? Even then, our space ships have blown up right after taking off, and relativity is still under revision. For every leap, there's a stumble
    We're really dodging the point here - that a certain evolution level must be attained before a species should be granted rights that are directly relating to these cognitive abilities, cognitive abilities that animals just don't have.

    Computers are already besting the human chess champion, winning jeapordy, driving cars for us. Some of the leaders in this field predict they'll become self aware by 2040
    It happens to be my field and I do wonder who these "leaders" are.

    A little bit on programs/machines: programs are written by human beings. They are written to function in a certain way as their developer(s) chooses to. These writings are called "scripts". You can write a script as long as you want to, but it will always be limited by the laws of math. This is our current technology. This current technology allows us to write a program that is so good at chess that it beats the world's champion. Why? Because the script covers every possible move. The biggest and perhaps only advantage a program has over a human being is the calculation speed, as such it's obvious why it would beat the human world champion at chess when it has a storage of information regarding every possible move in chess and how it will end and has the ability to scan all these options and pick the best one in a matter of mere nanoseconds.

    However a true AI is a program that programs itself, it's impractical and is not within our technological reach. It's basically science fiction and I don't see a reason to believe it will ever cease being so. If you'll write a script with 1 billion programmers for ten years perhaps you'd reach something that is resembling an AI, but it will not be a true AI since it will still be limited by its script code.
    "The darkest places in hell are reserved for those who maintain their neutrality in times of moral crisis."

    Dante Alighieri

  7. #227
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    Re: Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

    Quote Originally Posted by Medusa View Post
    too bad ,cotton. I would bite him if I were his dog
    Then you'd be put down like a dog.

  8. #228
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    Re: Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    Until it tries to bite my ankle with deadly venom, sure. Then i'll plead self defense when i stomp on it
    But when I voice a similar opinion about dogs, I get told off, despite far more people being killed by dogs than by snakes in my country.
    So follow me into the desert
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  9. #229
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    Re: Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

    Quote Originally Posted by X Factor View Post
    Probably more. Having encountered a couple rattle snakes where I live, I tend to give snakes a lot of room.
    So if you saw an injured snake, you would try to help it in the same way you would a dog?
    Speaking of respect, how can you claim respect for any creature you view as being so stupid as to believe they have zero right to not be abused, hurt, tortured, etc.? (If you haven't claimed that you have respect for animals, just let me know that because that would make sense).
    I respect them because I recognise them for what they are. They're animals, they don't need rights because they can't understand the concept (they're deserving of protection though because I like them). I'll add though, certain social animals do recognise rights, the alpha wolf has a right to eat first from a kill, the alpha baboon has a right to **** all the females, but somehow I don't think that's the sort of rights you think they should have.

    If you were to write a bill of rights for the entire animal kingdom, what would it say?
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  10. #230
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    Re: Should animals have more rights/protection/etc

    Quote Originally Posted by spud_meister View Post
    But when I voice a similar opinion about dogs, I get told off, despite far more people being killed by dogs than by snakes in my country.
    Maybe you don't make clear you're talking about aggressive dogs as opposed to little pet dogs? Compare a doberman (police dog) to a chuwawa and there's a vast diff in potential risk to humans. Also consider whether the dog is trained by its owner or we're talking about a complete stranger coming up to it. Nonetheless, to me the key is if it's acting aggressively and an actual threat, same as any other creature.

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