View Poll Results: Is outsourcing jobs overseas patriotic?

Voters
42. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    6 14.29%
  • No

    29 69.05%
  • Maybe

    6 14.29%
  • Don't know

    1 2.38%
Page 19 of 24 FirstFirst ... 91718192021 ... LastLast
Results 181 to 190 of 236

Thread: Is outsourcing jobs overseas patriotic?

  1. #181
    Don't give a Rat's Ass
    SMTA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    OH
    Last Seen
    03-27-17 @ 12:44 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    19,407

    Re: Is outsourcing jobs overseas patriotic?

    Quote Originally Posted by MildSteel View Post
    Oh no! What happens when you outsource manufacturing jobs overseas is that you erode middle class purchasing power. To make up for it, the Federal Reserve devised cheap credit which facilitated a housing bubble, which in turn led to the huge derivatives market, of which mortgage back securities (MBS), were a part. The derivatives market then overheated, no one then knew exactly how much risk they were exposed to, investors panicked, and the system unraveled. If the Fed had not stepped in, and literally take TRILLIONS OF DOLLARS IN TOXIC MBS debt from the banks and put it on their books, the whole system would have fallen a part. Now, that's the truth.
    Wrong again!

    The FED did not make up 'cheap credit'.

    Homeowners borrowed too much on then homes, then borrowed more as the housing values increased.

    They became upside down in their loans due to stupidity - when the houses became overpriced, the market corrected prices downward, and left them over-extended in their loans.

    The lenders exactly knew the risks of the extended credit of homeowners, but continued to loan more money in spite of insufficient credit worthiness of borrowers, and then bet against the feasibility of their own loan, and got caught.

    These lenders knew exactly what they were doing, but got caught in the housing market price drop.

    Get your facts straight.
    Greatness lies not in being strong, but in the right use of strength - Henry Ward Beecher
    Baby sister, I was born game and I intend to go out that way - Rooster Cogburn

  2. #182
    Don't give a Rat's Ass
    SMTA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    OH
    Last Seen
    03-27-17 @ 12:44 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    19,407

    Re: Is outsourcing jobs overseas patriotic?

    Quote Originally Posted by MildSteel View Post
    Nope - see post #181.

    Using you own incorrect post does not substantiate your own incorrect information.

    Research before you post.
    Greatness lies not in being strong, but in the right use of strength - Henry Ward Beecher
    Baby sister, I was born game and I intend to go out that way - Rooster Cogburn

  3. #183
    Don't give a Rat's Ass
    SMTA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    OH
    Last Seen
    03-27-17 @ 12:44 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    19,407

    Re: Is outsourcing jobs overseas patriotic?

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    That (bolded above) assertion requires documentation - perhaps a link would be in order. The nonsense about the oil price shock did not affect US autos any more than foreign autos. If you care to look, you will find that US autos tended to be high profit, low gas milage monsters which was a poor marketing decision - also you will find that the US auto industry had "no lay off" union contracts and ridiculous "lifetime" benefit packages costing billions simply to pay prior workers and their dependents to do nothing.

    Attachment 67183340

    UAW Workers Actually Cost the Big Three Automakers $70 an Hour
    Boom! And the OP's logic is once again proven to be drastically wrong.
    Greatness lies not in being strong, but in the right use of strength - Henry Ward Beecher
    Baby sister, I was born game and I intend to go out that way - Rooster Cogburn

  4. #184
    Sometimes wrong
    ttwtt78640's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Uhland, Texas
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 10:08 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    29,228

    Re: Is outsourcing jobs overseas patriotic?

    Quote Originally Posted by SMTA View Post
    Boom! And the OP's logic is once again proven to be drastically wrong.
    Yep, but logic is tossed out the window when union benefits are being demanded. Even today GM continues to award unions even more than they deserve, after all, they can just get the taxpayer's to make it all better.

    On Wednesday, G.M. chose to once again open its checkbook. For the first time since emerging from bankruptcy in 2009, when it received a $49 billion bailout from taxpayers, G.M. gave its 48,000 union workers a bonus greater than their contract called for.

    Each worker will receive up to a record $9,000 in profit-sharing, even though the company’s actual profits were diminished by the cost of more than 80 recalls and warranted a payment that would be about $2,400 smaller.
    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/05/bu...t-in-2014.html
    “The reasonable man adapts himself to the world: the unreasonable one persists to adapt the world to himself.
    Therefore all progress depends on the unreasonable man.” ― George Bernard Shaw, Man and Superman

  5. #185
    Banned
    Join Date
    Mar 2014
    Last Seen
    08-18-15 @ 08:36 AM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    4,974

    Re: Is outsourcing jobs overseas patriotic?

    Quote Originally Posted by smta View Post
    wrong again!

    The fed did not make up 'cheap credit'.
    WRONG! WRONG! WRONG!

    Back during the u.s. Invasion of iraq, when the u.s. Government issued its now-famous deck of playing cards featuring pictures of the 52 arch villains of the iraqi police state, saddam hussein's face adorned the ace of spades. If the barack obama administration wanted to engage in a similar public relations campaign – this time with a focus on the u.s. Real estate crisis – that top card should be reserved for former federal reserve chairman alan greenspan.

    In a speech before the national association of realtors last tuesday, sir alan "the-bubble-blower" greenspan claimed that his low-interest-rate policies in the early and middle years of this decade had no effect on mortgage rates or real estate prices. As a result, he claims no responsibility for the subprime mortgage crisis. But even current treasury secretary timothy f. Geithner – who shared interest-rate-policy responsibility as governor of the new york fed during the greenspan regime – recently admitted that overly accommodative policy helped inflate the bubble. So what does greenspan know that everyone else doesn't?

    Greenspan's primary defense is that mortgage rates were a function of long-term interest rates that were simply not responding to the movement in short-term rates, which he did control. While it is true that the flow of capital from foreign creditors with excess dollars did keep long rates low despite rising short rates, this "conundrum" was not the leading factor in the housing bubble. Although rates on 30-year-fixed-rate mortgages are based on long-term bonds, by 2005 such loans had become an endangered species. The housing bubble was all about adjustable-rate mortgages (arms) with teaser rates of one to seven years – which are primarily based on the benchmark fed funds.

    The rock-bottom teaser rates, permitted by the 1.0% fed funds rate, were the primary reason that many homebuyers were able to qualify for mortgages they couldn't otherwise afford – which, in turn, enabled them to bid u.s. Home prices up to "bubble" levels. By pushing down the cost of short-term money, the u.s. Central bank enabled homebuyers to make big bets on rising real estate prices. Without the fed's help, few borrowers would have "qualified" for these risky mortgages and real estate prices never would have been bid up so high.

    Greenspan expresses exasperation now, as he did then, that his careful nudging of interest rates higher by quarter-point increments did not translate into corresponding increases in long-term rates. Unfortunately, according to greenspan, the markets would not cooperate with his wise guidance, and to his dismay, mortgage rates fell despite his best efforts.

    As they say in texas, that dog just won't hunt. If the "measured pace" of his quarter-point rate hikes were too slow to produce the desired effect, why didn't greenspan jack up the pressure? With interest rates far below the official inflation rate for so many years during the bubble, he certainly had plenty of room to maneuver. The claim that he was unhappy with the ultimate results of his rate hikes – despite his having done nothing to adjust that policy – is ridiculous.

    In addition to his colossal errors on interest-rate policy, there were many other ways greenspan blew air into the real estate bubble. One example was what the market called the "greenspan put." by creating the perception in word and deed (that has since proven accurate) that the fed would backstop any major market or economic declines, lenders became more comfortable making risky loans.

    In an often-quoted 2004 speech, greenspan went so far as to actively encourage the use of adjustable-rate mortgages and praised home-equity extractions for their role in contributing to economic growth. In fact, rather than criticizing homeowners for treating their houses like atm machines, he often praised the innovative ways in which such homeowners were "managing" their personal balance sheets.

    In short, greenspan was as much a proponent of leverage for homeowners on main street as he was for bankers on wall street.

    The bottom line is that greenspan fathered the housing bubble and now he refuses to acknowledge kinship with his wayward child. His denial of responsibility is an act of stunning bravado, and is a testament to his ability to turn even the simplest of situations into an impenetrable tangle of theories and statistics.
    "the maestro" easily trumps the private sector jokers who now hold top dishonors in our pack of economic villains. The fact that greenspan still has any credibility shows just how little understanding the general public – including wall street and the media – actually has about this crisis.
    History Will Show That Alan Greenspan Played a Key Role in Creating the U.S. Housing Bubble

  6. #186
    Don't give a Rat's Ass
    SMTA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    OH
    Last Seen
    03-27-17 @ 12:44 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    19,407

    Re: Is outsourcing jobs overseas patriotic?

    Quote Originally Posted by ttwtt78640 View Post
    Yep, but logic is tossed out the window when union benefits are being demanded. Even today GM continues to award unions even more than they deserve, after all, they can just get the taxpayer's to make it all better.



    http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/05/bu...t-in-2014.html
    I don't recall the numbers, but the Japanese US auto makers had $3,000~4,000 per car advantage due to the union pension payouts several years ago.

    There used to be huge deficits for US makers due to slower output and much longer die change times.

    In spite of the unions, the US output has become more efficient over the last 5 years.

    The 2008 crash even woke some of the morons up.
    Greatness lies not in being strong, but in the right use of strength - Henry Ward Beecher
    Baby sister, I was born game and I intend to go out that way - Rooster Cogburn

  7. #187
    Sage

    Join Date
    Dec 2013
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 03:27 AM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    25,161

    Re: Is outsourcing jobs overseas patriotic?

    Quote Originally Posted by SMTA View Post
    I don't recall the numbers, but the Japanese US auto makers had $3,000~4,000 per car advantage due to the union pension payouts several years ago.

    There used to be huge deficits for US makers due to slower output and much longer die change times.

    In spite of the unions, the US output has become more efficient over the last 5 years.

    The 2008 crash even woke some of the morons up.
    yep and it continues to grow as those automakers offer generous 401k plans instead of pensions.
    it also helps that foreign plants are more efficient with their people.

    the guy that puts the screws in can put the bolts on as well. if something is wrong and someone knows how to fix it they fix it.
    they don't have to wait an hour for the guy that changes the fuses to show up to do it they just change the fuse or belt or whatever.

  8. #188
    Don't give a Rat's Ass
    SMTA's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    OH
    Last Seen
    03-27-17 @ 12:44 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    19,407

    Re: Is outsourcing jobs overseas patriotic?

    Right, right, right!

    Nice try, but you lost again.

    I was unable to read the link itself, as there were blocking popups regarding CIA secrets and other paranoid TEOTWAWKI claims.

    Try this Wall Street Journal link, which you may understand, which shows what I said is true.

    Please do not discount such a trusted source, as there is no CIA / Alien / or Conspiracy Theory mumbo-jumbo on their page.

    Thomas, Hennessey and Holtz-Eakin: What Caused the Financial Crisis? - WSJ
    Greatness lies not in being strong, but in the right use of strength - Henry Ward Beecher
    Baby sister, I was born game and I intend to go out that way - Rooster Cogburn

  9. #189
    Villiage Idiot
    imagep's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Location
    Upstate SC
    Last Seen
    03-27-17 @ 11:02 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Independent
    Posts
    23,114

    Re: Is outsourcing jobs overseas patriotic?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fearandloathing View Post
    It can only be answered with a question:

    How much more are you willing to pay for your gadgets to have them made in the US?

    You can't have cheap **** and a higher minimum wage, income 'equality" etc.
    Of course you can.

    If I make $10/hr today, and tomorrow we have a minimum wage increase which pushes my wage to $11/hr, I could care less if that min wage increase caused a few percent inflation because I can still purchase more than I could before.

    And since I can now purchase more than I could before, demand increases, businesses expand and become more profitable, more people get jobs, and as a nation we produce more and thus we all become more wealthy.

    I don't really see this evil darkside to that.
    Quote Originally Posted by ocean515 View Post
    ...I'm not interested in debating someone who is trolling for an argument....
    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    I see a big problem with the idea that whatever the majority wants is OK.

  10. #190
    Sage
    Born Free's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2011
    Location
    Sonny and Nice
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 09:01 PM
    Lean
    Conservative
    Posts
    6,069

    Re: Is outsourcing jobs overseas patriotic?

    Quote Originally Posted by imagep View Post
    Why would our standard of living crash?

    If we stopped outsourcing as many jobs, then more people in the US would have jobs, which means we would produce more wealth right here in the USA.

    Now maybe that would cause a few percent inflation, but like it or not, the Federal Reserve has determined that a few percent of inflation is stimulative to our economy and they strive to achieve such. So if we had a few percent of inflation due to cost push pressure, it would simply help to achieve the Feds goal, without the fed having to intervene by pumping more money into the system - so most likely there would be no additional inflation than what would have occurred without more jobs.

    In the mean time, our wages would naturally tend to rise as employers have to compete harder and harder for workers, consumption increases as more people get jobs, production increases as businesses strive to meet demand, and the GDP increases. None of that is a bad thing, it's basically what happens when we have a strong economy.

    You think that a strong economy = crash?
    You become an isolationist and you no longer have access to cheap goods. You mentioned inflation, let me tell you it would skyrocket. Go to any store and most of what you find is made in china or elsewhere. You take that all away and prices would skyrocket, try and find a shirt made in the US or shoes, etc. Try and find an outdoor patio set made in the US. Toys etc etc etc. you cut off imports and your standard of living would crash.
    Liberals - Punish the Successful, Reward the Unsuccessful
    Liberals - Tax, Borrow, Spend, and Give Free Stuff
    Obama's legacy - President Donald Trump

Page 19 of 24 FirstFirst ... 91718192021 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •