View Poll Results: Should a Muslim Owned Business Be Legally Permitted to Refuse Service to Gay People?

Voters
83. You may not vote on this poll
  • Yes

    15 18.07%
  • No

    68 81.93%
Page 14 of 19 FirstFirst ... 41213141516 ... LastLast
Results 131 to 140 of 189

Thread: Should a Muslim Owned Business Be Legally Permitted to Refuse Service to Gay [W:150]

  1. #131
    Almost respectable
    Cardinal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:08 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    33,371

    Re: Should a Muslim Owned Business Be Legally Permitted to Refuse Service to Gay Peop

    Quote Originally Posted by Capster78 View Post
    While I share your fears, because I am an atheist living in a country where 90 plus percent claims to be part of some type of religion, I think your thinking is stuck back in the 50's, possibly earlier. There are many in America who claim to be of a certain religion, but when you get down to it, there are very few fundamentalists / extremists in our country today. People today are relatively liberal when it comes to the acceptance of others. I don't foresee America reverting to, say, a 1950's Germany, if it were not legal to choose who you serve as a business owner. In fact, I think that doing so would reveal those who do secretly have discriminatory views, instead of keeping those views secret and getting rich off of those they secretly hate.
    I don't accept the thinking that because "not too many" people would take advantage of their freedom to discriminate based on religious principle that nobody would have anything to fear. Try to approach it mathematically (I'm not a math major so don't worry, this isn't going to fry your brain). In a mid sized town, there are 20 Pizzerias owned by Christians and three pizzerias owned by gay Muslim atheists (minorities). This is in Mississipi, so "only" thirty percents of the Christian pizzerias would discriminate against the minorities, and just to be fair, thirty percent of the minority pizzerias would discriminate against the Christians. So that means you have 6 pizzerias willing to discriminate against minorities and one pizzeria willing to discriminate against Christians. From there, the White Christians still have 22 pizzerias to choose from while the minorities have 17 to choose from. Team Christian is doing better already. But of course seventeen is still not bad (how much pizza do you really need anyway?). Replace "23 pizzerias" with "one bank," "one supermarket," "one private school," etc., and it gets a bit more grim for Team Minority.

    The argument was never that every Christian store everywhere would turn away minorities en masse resulting in a dystopian Christian theocracy, but that even if only a minority of them did, Christians would have the advantage by simple virtue of being in the overwhelming majority, and the minorities would face greater barriers than a Christian. That is real, tangible damage.

  2. #132
    Sage
    roguenuke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Last Seen
    05-17-17 @ 04:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,935

    Should a Muslim Owned Business Be Legally Permitted to Refuse Service to Gay ...

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    They said they wouldn't want to cater a gay wedding. they also said they wouldn't refuse service to anyone. what you are doing is speculating in contradiction to thier statement
    No, the girls words indicated that they would not provide pizza for a gay wedding. She did not say the word "cater" in the first interview.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  3. #133
    ANTI**ANTIFA
    ReverendHellh0und's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Temple of Solomon
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 02:17 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    73,714

    Re: Should a Muslim Owned Business Be Legally Permitted to Refuse Service to Gay ...

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    No, the girls words indicated that they would not provide pizza for a gay wedding. She did not say the word "cater" in the first interview.

    So what did she mean when she said she wouldn't refuse service to anyone?
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

  4. #134
    Professor
    Capster78's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2012
    Location
    Florida
    Last Seen
    08-24-15 @ 01:35 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Centrist
    Posts
    2,253

    Re: Should a Muslim Owned Business Be Legally Permitted to Refuse Service to Gay Peop

    Quote Originally Posted by Cardinal View Post
    I don't accept the thinking that because "not too many" people would take advantage of their freedom to discriminate based on religious principle that nobody would have anything to fear. Try to approach it mathematically (I'm not a math major so don't worry, this isn't going to fry your brain). In a mid sized town, there are 20 Pizzerias owned by Christians and three pizzerias owned by gay Muslim atheists (minorities). This is in Mississipi, so "only" thirty percents of the Christian pizzerias would discriminate against the minorities, and just to be fair, thirty percent of the minority pizzerias would discriminate against the Christians. So that means you have 6 pizzerias willing to discriminate against minorities and one pizzeria willing to discriminate against Christians. From there, the White Christians still have 22 pizzerias to choose from while the minorities have 17 to choose from. Team Christian is doing better already. But of course seventeen is still not bad (how much pizza do you really need anyway?). Replace "23 pizzerias" with "one bank," "one supermarket," "one private school," etc., and it gets a bit more grim for Team Minority.

    The argument was never that every Christian store everywhere would turn away minorities en masse resulting in a dystopian Christian theocracy, but that even if only a minority of them did, Christians would have the advantage by simple virtue of being in the overwhelming majority, and the minorities would face greater barriers than a Christian. That is real, tangible damage.

    I think you are over thinking this issue. In stark reality, very few businesses would discriminate even if they were given the chance. Because in the realm of importance, money lists higher then religion even for the most religious in America. The fear of loosing revenue in the vast majority of cases, keeps businesses honest. I just don't think your scenario is realistic.
    - There was never a good war, or a bad peace.
    - Idealistically, everything should work as you planed it to. Realistically, it depends on how idealistic you are as to the measure of success.
    - Better to be a pessimist before, and an optimist afterwords.

  5. #135
    Living in Gods country


    JANFU's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2014
    Last Seen
    Today @ 01:13 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Other
    Posts
    16,687

    Re: Should a Muslim Owned Business Be Legally Permitted to Refuse Service to Gay Peop

    Consistency would include all religions.
    Quote Originally Posted by Fenton View Post
    Hillary is the only defense I or anyone else needs.

  6. #136
    Almost respectable
    Cardinal's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Last Seen
    Today @ 03:08 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    33,371

    Re: Should a Muslim Owned Business Be Legally Permitted to Refuse Service to Gay Peop

    Quote Originally Posted by Capster78 View Post
    I think you are over thinking this issue. In stark reality, very few businesses would discriminate even if they were given the chance. Because in the realm of importance, money lists higher then religion even for the most religious in America. The fear of loosing revenue in the vast majority of cases, keeps businesses honest. I just don't think your scenario is realistic.
    What I've demonstrated is that whatever percentage of businesses actually take part in discrimination there is a tangible and measurable impact that places the minority groups at a disadvantage. There is no tangible damage to a business owner serving a minority. Unless they can demonstrate one then they're just going to have to suck it up.

  7. #137
    Advisor
    Join Date
    Apr 2015
    Last Seen
    @
    Gender
    Posts
    555

    Re: Should a Muslim Owned Business Be Legally Permitted to Refuse Service to Gay Peop

    If gay people wants to refuse to put ‘hateful’ messages on something, they should have that right.
    If Muslims want to refuse putting cartoons of Muhammad on a poster, they should have that right.
    If black Americans want to refuse putting images of the KKK on materials, they should have the right to do that.
    If Christians who disagree with gay marriage don’t want to endorse messages that support it, they should have that right.

  8. #138
    Sage
    roguenuke's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Location
    Raleigh, NC
    Last Seen
    05-17-17 @ 04:55 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Moderate
    Posts
    28,935

    Re: Should a Muslim Owned Business Be Legally Permitted to Refuse Service to Gay ...

    Quote Originally Posted by ReverendHellh0und View Post
    So what did she mean when she said she wouldn't refuse service to anyone?
    That is they came in just to order pizza, for consumption there, she'd sell them the pizza. But if they specifically asked for the pizzas for a same sex wedding, she'd deny them. This implies that if she had a similar request for pizzas for an opposite sex marriage, that wouldn't be an issue.
    "A woman is like a teabag, you never know how strong she is until she gets in hot water." - Eleanor Roosevelt

    Keep your religion out of other people's marriages.

  9. #139
    Sage
    Montecresto's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2013
    Last Seen
    03-13-16 @ 10:59 PM
    Lean
    Undisclosed
    Posts
    24,561

    Re: Should a Muslim Owned Business Be Legally Permitted to Refuse Service to Gay Peop

    Quote Originally Posted by Capster78 View Post
    Yes, I think they should be allowed. I don't agree with it, but any business, IMO, should be allowed to deny service to anyone they wish. In the end, the business will be judged by the number of customers that patronize their store.
    Businesses thrived under your model when they were allowed to discriminate against blacks and women. I suppose we should have left well enough alone.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  10. #140
    ANTI**ANTIFA
    ReverendHellh0und's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Temple of Solomon
    Last Seen
    Yesterday @ 02:17 PM
    Gender
    Lean
    Libertarian
    Posts
    73,714

    Re: Should a Muslim Owned Business Be Legally Permitted to Refuse Service to Gay ...

    Quote Originally Posted by roguenuke View Post
    That is they came in just to order pizza, for consumption there, she'd sell them the pizza. But if they specifically asked for the pizzas for a same sex wedding, she'd deny them. This implies that if she had a similar request for pizzas for an opposite sex marriage, that wouldn't be an issue.



    Show me where she said an individual could come in and order 10 pizzas for his gay wedding and they would refuse it.


    “If a gay couple was to come and they wanted us to bring pizzas to their wedding, we’d have to say no,” Crystal told ABC 57.

    Note word bring

    “We said we would serve anyone that came in that door, even gays,” Crystal told The Blaze. “But we would not condone a wedding. We would not cater to that.”

    She means catering as in being there.
    Let evil swiftly befall those who have wrongly condemned us

Page 14 of 19 FirstFirst ... 41213141516 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •