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Should transwomen be legally treated as women?[W:165,1392]

Should transwomen be legally trreated as women?


  • Total voters
    160
Re: Should perverted men who “identify” as women be legally treated as women?

And did the two tests come back with different gender results?

Gender wasn't tested, hence my point of how extensive such tests are. And they only sent my blood, not other places where DNA is more likely to be different within our bodies.
 
Re: Should perverted men who “identify” as women be legally treated as women?

Threads like these sure do demonstrate how Social Conservatives are Authoritarians in the truest since of the world. They take an issue that personally bothers them yet has no impact at all on their life of their family's life, but since it personally bothers them, they wan't their personal beliefs codified into law.

And social liberals are any different? I believe that you and I are currently discussing something else which puts us at odds. I'm arguing for more freedom for business owners, you're arguing to punish business owners that don't serve SSM.

Funny that.....
 
Re: Should perverted men who “identify” as women be legally treated as women?

Yes, everyone does. Is that the argument you want to go with?

If DNA determines sex, then everyone would then be both sexes if everyone has both XX and XY chromosomes in their bodies.
 
Re: Should perverted men who “identify” as women be legally treated as women?

If DNA determines sex, then everyone would then be both sexes if everyone has both XX and XY chromosomes in their bodies.

Seriously, that is not the way it works and you know it. :dohI would humor this crap if I didn't know for a fact that you knew better.
 
Re: Should perverted men who “identify” as women be legally treated as women?

Seriously, that is not the way it works and you know it. :dohI would humor this crap if I didn't know for a fact that you knew better.

What I know is that you are confusing sex and gender. They are not the same thing.

Plus, it really shouldn't matter to you how feminine a man or woman was or masculine a man or woman was, nor what pronouns they wish to be called by or by what legal name they wish to go by. It is their life, not yours.
 
Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

They get to be seen as women by the law. It's basically the government lying for them.

Yes, but what does that mean? How does the government treat me differently as a woman?
 
Re: Should perverted men who “identify” as women be legally treated as women?

What I know is that you are confusing sex and gender. They are not the same thing.

The later I can define in any way I please and I'm defining it by sex since it is the most logical. You can't possibly tell me I'm wrong either since it's subjective. :D
 
Re: Should perverted men who “identify” as women be legally treated as women?

Gender wasn't tested, hence my point of how extensive such tests are.

Ah. Well, then, if there is a concern about gender, feel free to do so. I don't think anyone is going to stop you, except perhaps some folks on the other side who might one day argue that doing so is bigoted.
 
Re: Should perverted men who “identify” as women be legally treated as women?

The later I can define in any way I please and I'm defining it by sex since it is the most logical. You can't possibly tell me I'm wrong either since it's subjective. :D

:lol: I lol'd :D


It's All Subjective!!! Unless You Come To A Conclusion I Disagree With!!! :lol:
 
Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

Might I note right now that all of the six 'No' responses are male posters?
 
Re: Should perverted men who “identify” as women be legally treated as women?

Ah. Well, then, if there is a concern about gender, feel free to do so. I don't think anyone is going to stop you, except perhaps some folks on the other side who might one day argue that doing so is bigoted.

Sex wasn't tested either, just in case you were wondering.
 
Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

Might I note right now that all of the six 'No' responses are male posters?

Men are HATEFUL!


:lol:
 
Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

Might I note right now that all of the six 'No' responses are male posters?

I'll change that since I totally agree with digsbe.
 
Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

Might I note right now that all of the six 'No' responses are male posters?

Nah. I just redefined myself to a third, joint, gender.
 
Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

The fact that this has 8 votes of no bothers me....
 
Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

The fact that this has 8 votes of no bothers me....

Why does that bother you? Did you really think people would buy into the idea that men are women because of hormones and surgery?
 
Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

I generally agree that Transwomen should be treated as women, but I can see where there would be some issues.

For example, a UFC fighter who is a Transwoman: Do you allow them to fight with the women?
 
Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

I find it strange the entire discussion is about the locker room.

how are sports handled? Are we saying a transwomen can legally compete with women in professional sports?

I'm pretty ignorant on this issues, but wouldn't' they have a genetic advantage?
 
Re: Should perverted men who “identify” as women be legally treated as women?

All the madness and lies notwithstanding, it's a matter of simple mammalian biology.

One who has XY chromosomes and was born with “boy parts” is male.

One who has XX chromosomes and was born with “girl parts” is female.

“Transgenderism” is nothing more than insanity backed up by Political Correctness.
http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intersex
 
Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

Why do you care? What difference does it possibly make in your life or your family's life for a transgendered person to be legally treated as the sex they transitioned to?
In the modern era of gender equality, the number of issues where the government deals with sex/gender is shrinking, but there are still a few. For example, men and women have separate prison facilities. Women aren't allowed in military combat. Gay marriage is illegal in some states. There are issues of custody upon the birth of a child. None of these situations may apply to me directly, but it is in the public's best interest to deal with them all.

Except for the military combat restriction, all of these issues are better defined by biological sex than by gender. The practical purpose of having separate prisons is so that a person cannot impregnate their cellmate. Gender reassignment surgery doesn't necessarily prevent this from happening, so it would be better to separate prisoners by biological sex. Basing same-sex marriage laws on gender would mean that there is a surgical operation that invalidates a marriage. Obviously this doesn't make sense for many reasons. Neither does allowing public exposure of breasts to be legal if the person defines those breasts as "male" rather than "female". These are some examples of why biological sex is a better criteria for lawmaking than gender.

Perhaps I missed it, but I haven't heard anyone who opposes say exactly what defines a person's sex.

Biological sex has been defined a number of different ways by science, and still there always seem to be exceptions. But the concept of sex comes from reproductive function, and as mentioned above that is the main purpose of differentiating between the two. So I personally would define it as such: anyone with a functional ovary is female, anyone with a functional testicle is male. This covers 99% of the population. For someone who has neither, we could define it by chromosomes, or by genitals, or simply use a third term such as "neuter" -- but it doesn't make much practical difference, as they can't reproduce so they are immune to most of the significant issues. There are intersex individuals with ambiguous genitalia born relatively often, but there has never been a true human hermaphrodite recorded by medical science with both ovary and testicle, so as far as I know this simple criteria applies to every human on earth.

This relates only to biological sex. Gender is a totally separate thing. It is based on cultural stereotypes that are mostly false. I understand sympathizing with someone who feels like they are the opposite gender, and I have no problem with treating them the way they want to be treated when feasible. That just comes down to human decency. But for legal and practical purposes, biology is better defined and a better practical criteria on almost every issue, and should be used as the basis for our laws rather than gender. This takes nothing away from a trans- person who should be free to live their life as they please, just not redefine biology.

The fact that this has 8 votes of no bothers me....

I voted no, not because I don't like transgender people or want to deprive them of their rights, but because basing laws on something self-identified like "gender" makes less rational sense than basing laws on biological sex, which currently cannot be changed by science.
 
Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

If you define gender as someone that takes hormones and got surgery then you're defining it in a stupid way.
I'm defining it as the social construct that it is.
 
Re: Should transwomen be legally treated as women?

Depends on how far they are in the process of becoming a woman. If they are nothing more than a man in drag with no hormone therapy etc. to change into a woman behind them, then no, they should not be treated as women. But if they are so far in the process of becoming a woman that it would be impossible to revert back into a man, then yes, they should be legally seen as women (when it comes to the legal issues that is).
 
Re: Should perverted men who “identify” as women be legally treated as women?


Intersex is a whole different thing from transgenderism. One really has little to do with the other.

Transgenderism is a pure mental illness. Intersex is a very rare condition (actually a range of different conditions) in which one having it truly, physically, biologically, is not really quite male or quite female, but something in between.
 
Re: Should perverted men who “identify” as women be legally treated as women?

Intersex is a whole different thing from transgenderism. One really has little to do with the other.

Transgenderism is a pure mental illness. Intersex is a very rare condition (actually a range of different conditions) in which one having it truly, physically, biologically, is not really quite male or quite female, but something in between.
Intersex gives us an excellent example of how gender isn't a binary issue, and is much more complex than two chromosomes. If we can accept that there are gradients within gender and sex, accepting transgender becomes the next obvious mental step.
 
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