• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?

Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?


  • Total voters
    56
I never said I want to create it, I think the societies are a great example of how human beings can work together and provide for each other without the supposed "human nature" I keep hearing about, which is only observed under capitalism.

Yes, they worked together so that the group stayed alive. What else did they do? If the system can offer nothing but keeping people alive I don't see what it is really worth to the world.
 
what kind of answer is that? :lol:

You don't appreciate history, but if you truly want my interpretation, it shows that the "human nature" argument relating to everyone being greedy bastards who would backstab you if they got the chance is ridiculous, as we would never have survived and evolved if we were like that. I believe human nature goes both ways, and is greatly influenced by the systems within the world, capitalism encourages the worst parts of human nature.
 
Yes, they worked together so that the group stayed alive. What else did they do? If the system can offer nothing but keeping people alive I don't see what worth it has to the world.

They farmed for some time, and even then, the system wasn't even a system, it was groups of people caring for each other, no concept of private property.
 
You don't appreciate history, but if you truly want my interpretation, it shows that the "human nature" argument relating to everyone being greedy bastards who would backstab you if they got the chance is ridiculous, as we would never have survived and evolved if we were like that. I believe human nature goes both ways, and is greatly influenced by the systems within the world, capitalism encourages the worst parts of human nature.

There is a difference between fighting for your survival and working together because you need to and people deciding to work together when they have their survival needs meet. If your entire idea is sending everyone back to clawing to staying alive there is no reason to consider it.
 
There is a difference between fighting for your survival and working together because you need to and people deciding to work together when they have their survival needs meet.

They did work together when they had their needs met, what, do you think they immediately started going for profit when the farms had a surplus? Again, you underestimate humans, refer to my point about how the system influences our "nature"
 
They farmed for some time, and even then, the system wasn't even a system, it was groups of people caring for each other, no concept of private property.

Farming was the beginning of the end of the system.
 
Farming was the beginning of the end of the system.

It happened for many, many years, until, what, feudalism? People thought feudalism was the only viable system, much like people think capitalism is the only viable system.
 
It happened for many, many years, until, what, feudalism? People thought feudalism was the only viable system, much like people think capitalism is the only viable system.

I'm more than open to other ideas besides capitalism, but communism is a joke that reflects on failures of the past and tries to model itself around it.
 
I'm more than open to other ideas besides capitalism, but communism is a joke that reflects on failures of the past and tries to model itself around it.

Which failures?
 
Ah, you mean to tell me paying sweat shop workers/other workers less then a dollar a day is what they're worth? A $1.25 a day? $2.50?
:doh
You judge that by the local prevailing rate, just as you judge the conditions by the local requirements.

If it is only worth 0.50¢ a week, that is all it is worth.


I'm sorry if I'm concerned that a tiny group of people control massive amounts of money they aren't even using,
It is none of your business.


while millions suffer from malnutrition in exploited capitalist countries.
Irrelevant and emotional argument.
And a poor ****ing argument to make anyways. The end result of providing such ends up with more resources needed to continue providing for them and their offspring.
Which just begets more in the same circumstances.


You honestly think they're more hard working then the construction worker? The miner in africa?
An illogical argument on many fronts.
Manual labor is a dime a dozen and as such is worth that.
Scarce and more skilled labor is worth more.
And again, locality determines what the labor is worth. And no, said miners are not entitled to million dollar bonuses. That is not what there labor is worth.


Emotional appeal?
Did I stutter? Those are the arguments you are making and as such fail.


So you do think people on welfare are parasites? Interesting.
Are they providing something of value for receiving it?


Ah, good news for applauding me for being a failure,
You are the one who made this personal.
I was just agreeing with you in regards to that specific. :shrug:
If you don't like that I would suggest not making such lame statements or questions.


as if you somehow define that for the billions of people who are also "failures" under your ****ing definition.
Lame argument.
Reality shows us that there are multiple reasons some folks are unable and incapable of achieving. That all resides with their own self.


Unbelievable, so, billions of people are greedy when they're happy to just have food and shelter.
Again; The greedy jealous and envious that cannot (or choose not to) compete want such nonsense. You are just exemplifying such.
Other people's money is not your business. Period.


Obvious envious and jealous idiots, am I right?
You brought them up in another emotional argument, so prove they are not.
But I am sure you can not as wanting others to provide is based in greed envy and jealously. You can't change that.
Even altruistically those base emotions are present.


The wealthy contribute more then their fair share? Are you delusional?
If you think that is delusional then the delusion lays all in your own convoluted thoughts.
 
Last edited:
You don't appreciate history, but if you truly want my interpretation, it shows that the "human nature" argument relating to everyone being greedy bastards who would backstab you if they got the chance is ridiculous, as we would never have survived and evolved if we were like that. I believe human nature goes both ways, and is greatly influenced by the systems within the world, capitalism encourages the worst parts of human nature.

I don't appreciate history?.... link please.

no one has said anything about human nature being "everyone being greedy bastards who would stab you in the back"... that's a big ass strawman you are building there.

of course a commie would think capitalism encourages only the worst part of human nature.... denial of observable and demonstrable reality is a requirement to be a Communist.
 
Which failures?

How about the failure to create a better life for the people under it? How about the failure to do really anything besides keep people alive?

If all you have to support a system is that people worked together to stay alive then what good is your argument? It's basically saying that your system is so bad that survival is a constant concern of the people.
 
I don't appreciate history?.... link please.

no one has said anything about human nature being "everyone being greedy bastards who would stab you in the back"... that's a big ass strawman you are building there.

of course a commie would think capitalism encourages only the worst part of human nature.... denial of observable and demonstrable reality is a requirement to be a Communist.

It does encourage greed and exploitation..
Hunter-gatherer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
 
How about the failure to create a better life for the people under it? How about the failure to do really anything besides keep people alive?

What system are you referring to now? Hunters and gatherers had a socio-economic system?
 
What system are you referring to now? Hunters and gatherers had a socio-economic system?

Are you really going to play ignorant? I'm talking about how they lived and how their society functioned.
 
No one has yet to show that the wealthy have too much power.
 
:doh
You judge that by the local prevailing rate, just as you judge the conditions by the local requirements.

If it is only worth 0.50¢ a week, that is all it is worth.


It is none of your business.


Irrelevant and emotional argument.
And a poor ****ing argument to make anyways. The end result of providing such ends up with more resources needed to continue providing for them and their offspring.
Which just begets more in the same circumstances.


An illogical argument on many fronts.
Manual labor is a dime a dozen and as such is worth that.
Scarce and more skilled labor is worth more.
And again, locality determines what the labor is worth. And no, said miners are not entitled to million dollar bonuses. That is not what there labor is worth.


Did I stutter? Those are the arguments you are making and as such fail.


Are they providing something of value for receiving it?


You are the one who made this personal.
I was just agreeing with you in regards to that specific. :shrug:
If you don't like that I would suggest not making such lame statements or questions.


Lame argument.
Reality shows us that there are multiple reasons some folks are unable and incapable of achieving. That all resides with their own self.


Again; The greedy jealous and envious that cannot (or choose not to) compete want such nonsense. You are just exemplifying such.
Other people's money is not your business. Period.


You brought them up in another emotional argument, so prove they are not.
But I am sure you can not as wanting others to provide is based in greed envy and jealously. You can't change that.
Even altruistically those base emotions are present.


If you think that is delusional then the delusion lays all in your own convoluted thoughts.

50 cents a week is what they're worth when they produce **** loads of more value.. any reason you have for them being worth that much? No wonder capitalists love to move production to third world countries without labor laws/minimum wage laws.
I'm sorry, it is my business, millions are starving to death.
You actually think capitalism is benefiting those countries, and they do suffer from malnutrition when capitalists are in there working them for barely anything, and i do look at their food prices/what it's worth over there, you should to.
Manual labor is worth a dime.. the disrespect for most of the world is hilarious, billions will have to do manual labor, they deserve respect and a decent wage.
Wait, skilled labor involves looking at excel spreadsheets?
They are not emotional appeal, ask me what I need to support and I will.
Are children receiving healthcare providing any value when they receive it? Talk about illogical arguments. Many on welfare work, so I'd say they give back to capitalists.
Lame statements? You're the one purposefully making yourself look like a dick.
Really? Ok, let me go down this line, let's assume all countries have access to education, the road to be successful, then we have costs, failure rates, and let alone the fact that manual labor will always exist, and people will always be doing the "worthless" jobs, such as mining, sweatshopping, apple factories, logging, service jobs.. What do you define as success? Do you think everyone just needs to WORK HARDER HARR BECAUSE A MAJORITY CAN OBVIOUSLY ALL BECOME BUSINESSMEN IN SUITS WHO DON'T DO MANUAL LABOR. That makes no sense, I'd rather acknowledge that manual labor requires skill, dedication, and manual laborers work harder then any capitalist.
It is my business, sorry, I'll underline something to, just kidding.
Find me anything on MLK/albert einstein wanting to acquire profit.
The Institute on Taxation and Economic Policy (ITEP) - Let alone corporate welfare, etc....
 
Are you really going to play ignorant? I'm talking about how they lived and how their society functioned.

They survived and provided for each other, and if they weren't able to advance at all, how did tools come about? Farms? Fire?
 
No one has yet to show that the wealthy have too much power.

Show that they don't, lobbying, in regards to politics is really the main issue.
 
They survived and provided for each other, and if they weren't able to advance at all, how did tools come about? Farms? Fire?

So what, they accidentally set something on fire and they figured out that rocks are hard and can be used for stuff. Cool beans.
 
Trade: Chapter 105-7: The Lobbying Problem in a Democracy

I didn't say I don't agree with lobbying, I said lobbying for special interest in terms of governmental fiscal policy to support specific firms, like bailouts, or trade protection.

How does big pharmaceutical asking for subsidies ignore the constitution? Because it's asking for an econOmic tax break from a institution that doesn't have that constitutional power.

Key word you used "asking" sorry they can ask all they want but that does not mean what they are asking for will be granted. I don't think it takes constitutional power to ask anything.
 
So what, they accidentally set something on fire and they figured out that rocks are hard and can be used for stuff. Cool beans.

he oughta try hunting for an Iphone or gathering nuclear technology sometimes.:lamo
 
ok, keep believing capitalism only encourages the worst of human nature.... you believing falsehoods doe no harm to me, so you're free to do so. :)

Keep believing it doesn't.
 
So what, they accidentally set something on fire and they figured out that rocks are hard and can be used for stuff. Cool beans.

I'm talking about agricultural methods, way more to it, and even then, we're at a point in society where people voluntarily do things without wanting capital, it's happened all the time. You underestimate people.
 
Back
Top Bottom