View Poll Results: Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?

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    45 77.59%
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Thread: Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?

  1. #541
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    Re: Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dovkan View Post
    Then explain why the majority of the world only makes enough for clothing, shelter, and food/water, while working for sweatshops making fancy clothing they can never afford, etc... Producers don't want to charge low, it's why millions starve to death every year, it's not practicial to distribute/sell food to them where we're in the first world gobbling that **** down and wasting 50% of it. New technology is good for taking away jobs, at least in terms of what is happening today, eventually, it will get to a point where technology will take a majority of jobs. China was only planned until 1978, genius. It's the core idea of capitalism, don't sugarcoat it, capitalism relies on exploiting cheap labor/resources in under-developed countries to resell it at a profit to other countries, capitalism thrives on poverty. Many other countries other then China, you've only stated one example of a capitalist country without a minimum wage doing good, and even then: List of countries by income equality - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Paying domestic in America for production in regards to factory isn't as profitable as exploiting labor in another country.
    1. Because certain trade regulations do not allow countries to diversify production, major factor in stagnation of developing nations

    2. Producers charge low in competition, the reason we are based on consumption so heavily is due to Keynesian theory of economics, basically progressive economic theory. The idea that a central banking authority needs the power to implement policy to increase consumption. This is only possible through central banking a socialist idea. Yet free marketism glorifies savings and even hayak creating a privatized banking system to induce savings rather then spending

    3. When that happens humanity will reallocate itself to a more purposeful use

    4. Chinese government directly controls their central bank, making it completely planned, as well as uses economic policy to impose massive merchantilist trade policies, which literally means it's centrally planned... Smart guy

    5. Capitalism thrives on privatized exchange of capital, not poverty. Capitalism creates the most stable efficient system, communism can not work, simply because a communist society has no way to calculate when to expand production or reduce production. In fact the fact that communism is incapable of this proves that everyone will succumb to poor impoverished conditions and would completely fail unless there was a state or authority dictating production, which is why Stalinism was effective in production, because it was through force.

    6. We are not discussing min. Wage or even income inequality idk why you brought this issue up, however you need to study inter generational income mobility if you wish to discuss classes movement along lines of personal wealth in terms of inequality. You'll find it quite amusing when you see statistics of similar countries with factors like GDP size, population, level of immigration. You'll find income mobility tends to happen more efficiently in a freer market

    7. This is because the other countries use central planning authority to do things like devalue currency and use trade protectionism to try to outcompete other nations. You Blame the free market for government policy...

  2. #542
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    Re: Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dovkan View Post
    Dollar a day revisited
    Not sure about the current rates, feel free to find them for me.
    Looks like I have to pay in order to get a copy of that study. Here is one written by BBC: it calculates a $1.25 a day based on 2005 PPP.

    Dollar benchmark: The rise of the $1-a-day statistic - BBC News



    As you can see, so called absolute poverty is actually on decline and has been for decades now in developing countries. So the point really is that you got it backwards, capitalism is creating more wealth for ordinary people and is setting a record for bringing these people out of poverty and into the middle class. No other economic system has done that and thats why the vast majority of the world's countries has embraced capitalism. Its not a perfect system but its far and away the better alternative to others that have been dreamed up, especially socialism/communism.

  3. #543
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    Re: Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?

    Quote Originally Posted by EdwinWillers View Post
    Actually, no it's not. As I said, any definition of it is necessarily relative, or comparative.
    What you just said is meaningless because we live in a relative world. Everything that we give meaning to is relative to something else.

    Quote Originally Posted by EdwinWillers View Post
    You're kidding, right?
    No I am not. You are just putting up an old, stale line of defense that simply does not apply. I don't bear the rich any malice for being rich. It's just not there.

  4. #544
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    Re: Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Henrin View Post
    If your workforce is struggling in their personal affairs than your business suffers. Anything that you buy on the market you should keep good care of, be that your house, your car, your computer, your desk, or whatever you are concerned with, and the same is true for labor. A business that concern themselves with the well being of their workers enjoys a productive and happy workforce that will make the business more money and better products. There is of course a cut off to all things, and much like it is with cleaning a house there comes a point where the returns level out and any further action is an overall loss, so business should maintain balance and try to keep their workforce productive and happy, while not overpaying them.
    Certainly that's the ideal, though it it flies in the face of the way Capitalism is often applied. Some nations have legal protections limiting this, but in much of the third world, governments feel compelled to be extremely lax, to attract outside investment. It's tempting to think of this as small scale, but this is major industrial players. Look at the Bhopal disaster and it's aftermath.

    There's not a lot of abuse in the U.S., but the products we buy are often made overseas by exploited labor. It's rationalized away as good enough for them, but we would never put up with treatment like that here, and it's wrong to reward those who do it anywhere. The challenge, as you touched on, is defining the line between shrewd business and exploitation.

  5. #545
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    Re: Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Libertie76 View Post
    Big Pharma Pockets $711 Billion in Profits by Robbing Seniors, Taxpayers*|*Ethan Rome

    If they pay politicians enough Money they receive negative taxes.

    There's even cases where special interest will spend more money on k street then output of their product
    In that article you posted is a problem with congress, there was no mention of follow the money. Who was paid how much or not etc. No mention of bribes or the DOJ taking action etc. Hell to get Obamacare passed the Dems lobbied the votes they needed to get it passed. The Dems gave special deals to get their vote.

    There are lobbyist for and against on about every issue that comes before congress. Congress represents their districts and in every state their elected officials are lobbying congress for their state. States try to sway businesses to move to their state and to get them to move they will give tax breaks, free land etc. In these cases the states are lobbying for businesses to move. Football stadiums are financed by the teams and the city or state, making a mutual deal that both benefit from having a team in their city.
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  6. #546
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    Re: Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Born Free View Post
    In that article you posted is a problem with congress, there was no mention of follow the money. Who was paid how much or not etc. No mention of bribes or the DOJ taking action etc. Hell to get Obamacare passed the Dems lobbied the votes they needed to get it passed. The Dems gave special deals to get their vote.

    There are lobbyist for and against on about every issue that comes before congress. Congress represents their districts and in every state their elected officials are lobbying congress for their state. States try to sway businesses to move to their state and to get them to move they will give tax breaks, free land etc. In these cases the states are lobbying for businesses to move. Football stadiums are financed by the teams and the city or state, making a mutual deal that both benefit from having a team in their city.
    I said big pharmaceutical asks for subsidies, hence the word big meaning a lot of money, and you said they ask but don't receive... so I posted you an article.

    If you want me to find articles of corruption through lobbyists I will, however this article seriously proved you were wrong.


    http://www.cnn.com/2014/10/29/politi...lobbyists-pay/

  7. #547
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    Re: Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Born Free View Post
    Citizens do participate in all forms of lobbying, protests is a form of lobbying, million man marches are a form of lobbying. Activist groups are a form of lobbying. Green Peace is a lobbyist. There are lobbyist for and against government on about all issues. And there is big money on each side of any one issue. Take the Sacramento smelt where the lobbyist won the argument that the smelt trumped all the farmers need for water. Billions of gallons of water have been diverted away from the farmers for the smelt. Unions are lobbyist and they have deep pockets (lots of money) representing citizen participation.

    this is correct ...however it is democratic forms of government, that are most susceptible to factions/ special interest who lobby government in there own interest, which is why the very rich and powerful people and large corporations, have the ear of politicians rather then the average Citizen.

    republican forms of government make it more difficult for faction/ special interest to lobby, because all power is not concentrated in one centralized location power is divided , as opposed to democratic forms.

    by repealing the 17th amendment we cut the legs out from under lobbyist,who lobby the senate, and return power to the states to place a check on the power of the federal government again.
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  8. #548
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    Re: Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?

    Quote Originally Posted by Libertie76 View Post
    I said big pharmaceutical asks for subsidies, hence the word big meaning a lot of money, and you said they ask but don't receive... so I posted you an article.

    If you want me to find articles of corruption through lobbyists I will, however this article seriously proved you were wrong.


    Politicians live it up and have the lobbyists pay - CNN.com
    Subsidies are a part of government and business that both benefit, no different than a state giving free land or tax credits to a business to move to their state. This is a daily event. I have no idea what you are driving at, or better yet what is the point you are trying to make?
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  9. #549
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    Re: Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?

    Quote Originally Posted by ernst barkmann View Post
    this is correct ...however it is democratic forms of government, that are most susceptible to factions/ special interest who lobby government in there own interest, which is why the very rich and powerful people and large corporations, have the ear of politicians rather then the average Citizen.

    republican forms of government make it more difficult for faction/ special interest to lobby, because all power is not concentrated in one centralized location power is divided , as opposed to democratic forms.

    by repealing the 17th amendment we cut the legs out from under lobbyist,who lobby the senate, and return power to the states to place a check on the power of the federal government again.
    Who do the unions represent?
    Liberals - Punish the Successful, Reward the Unsuccessful
    Liberals - Tax, Borrow, Spend, and Give Free Stuff
    Obama's legacy - Total Failure

  10. #550
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    Re: Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?

    Quote Originally Posted by MildSteel View Post
    Although ordinary citizens can vote in national elections, the candidates must have funding that is backed by organizations that are controlled by those with wealth. As such the choices are limited.

    Do the wealthy have too much power in the United States?
    Yes!!!!!!!!!!
    To do evil, a human being must first of all believe that what hes doing is good" - Solzhenitsyn

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