View Poll Results: Do the majority of U.S. Jews support Netanyahu?

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Thread: Do the majority of U.S. Jews support Netanyahu? [W:144]

  1. #31
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    Re: Do the majority of U.S. Jews support Netanyahu?

    Quote Originally Posted by shrubnose View Post
    Lots of people know lots of things that are totally wrong.
    Why? Do you think we should trust Iran? Or maybe I should ask, in what way we should trust them.
    As to Obama, we won't know for some time. But I do not see anything so far that convinces me that it was worth giving them the time to develop their near weapons technology for the ballistic missiles they have tested.

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    Re: Do the majority of U.S. Jews support Netanyahu?

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    So you agree that the nature of warfare by everyone over 2000 years ago fully justifies ongoingly killing Jews all over the world ever since. Despicable.

    The level of rabid hatred of Jews messages is stunning, but hatred for Jews is THE most popular bigotry in the history of the world. It is no question your messages are hatred of Jews. Do you mention the attrocities against Jews by Muslims? No. You have to reach back over 2000 years to find anything to compare what has been done non-stop to Jews ever since.
    No, I'm not justifying anything, just pointing out how ****ed up people can be, especially when they're projecting their fundamental beliefs.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Do the majority of U.S. Jews support Netanyahu?

    Western countries and Muslim countries calling Jews "warmongers" is absolutely OUTRAGEOUS and the most grotesque of lies.

    For over 2000 years, Western countries ("Christian countries") had armies rolling all over the world for conquest and subjugation. They still use the military to control other countries and other people.

    For nearly 1500 years, Muslim leaders have engages in massive scale wars of invasion and empire building. They still use their militaries to control other countries and people.

    The last time Jews engages in military invasion of other countries was over 2900 years ago, and that only the conquest of the small area of Israel. On no occasion did Jews every try to extend their conquest from Israel and all wars thereafter were singularly defense - such as nearly 1,000,000 Jews being killed trying to defend Jerusalem against the Romans.

    For nearly 2000 years, what Jews have done is tried to find ANY place in the world to try to live in peace. For nearly 2000 years, Jews have had to flee to nearly every place in the world other than Asia (where totally unwelcomed even temporarily). And everywhere they went it was not long before they were being oppressed, blamed for all problems and killed - taking all the have - with most the remaining Jews still alive still fleeing to another place.

    Since antiquity in the ancient conquests as all peoples did in antiquity, Jews have been the least warmongering of all peoples in the world. The raging messages calling them warmongers is outrageously offensive and the most grotesque lie in relation to actual world history - and is not a charge ANY white or black American can make - as ALL of you are on land and in a country taken by invasion and millions of acts of murder, rape, oppression, bigotry and theft against Indigenous Americans.

    The level of hypocrisy of ANY American calling Israeli Jews "warmongers" is so extreme as to defy any logic and can only be explained by the great nature of humans to find ANY ethnicity or people who are different to HATE and BLAME for their own problems and failures. Historically that has been Jews more than any other people.

    People wonder how Hitler could have sold such hatred of Jews as he did. Only only has to read this forum to see how easy a pitch it is to sell to many people.

    Jews are the least warmongering people in the world and have been for nearly 3000 years.
    Last edited by joko104; 04-02-15 at 12:39 PM.

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    Re: Do the majority of U.S. Jews support Netanyahu?

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    I have no doubt you want Iran to have nuclear weapons and by your messages to then use them against Israel for payback against OT Biblical offenses by Jews as you presented. The historic hatred of Jews isn't just rhetorical, but murderous and genocidal. You gave one of the Muslim reasons why all Jews should be killed as your own objection to Jews - that the Jews conquered the area of Israel in the 9th century BC.

    Clearly, you hate America and even yourself for the attrocities and land theft against Native Americans less than 1/10th as far in the past. Clearly, Native Americans have a right to nuclear weapons to protect their reservations - that should be separate countries. You agree, don't you?
    Wrong. Look here dude, do you ever read beyond the first sentence of any of my posts. Jesus Christ. Besides having been a long time advocate of global nuclear eradication. I have pointed out Israel's violation of international law, due process, and lack of respect for sovereign borders assassinating scientists and conducting pre-emptive military strikes because that paranoid freak thinks somebody might use nuclear weapons on Israel someday. That's all recent stuff, I added the historic just to demonstrate how long the nation of Israel has been ****ed up.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

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    Re: Do the majority of U.S. Jews support Netanyahu?

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    No, it was not just the "holocaust." If you explore Jewish history in the world there has been THOUSANDS of recorded incidents of the organized killing Jews all over the world merely because they were Jews. It was not just the Nazi holocaust. "The wandering Jew" (a famous poem) is about how Jews were perpetually seeking a safe permanent place to live - and never finding one.

    The only countries that were safe for Jews in modern history was the United States (which closed its doors to Jews in 1924) and In Israel/Palestine while under British rule, though the UK also was increasingly blocking Jews coming to Israel and began imprisoning elsewhere young Jews of potential fighting age merely for being young Jewish men.

    As for blaming Jews for the problems of the ME, Jews, ie "Christ-killers" in the West, have always been blamed for any country's problems. For hundreds and hundreds of years.

    The end of WW2 did not make Jews welcomes in Europe. Jews have been virtually purged from the whole world except the USA and Israel. As for ME Muslim countries, the genocide of Jews is nearly absolute and more complete than Hitler's holocaust.
    I understand all of that. As does any literate person with any historical knowledge at all. However it doesn't change the fact that primarily the reasons why there are not that many Jews in the world is the fact that: 1. They were decimated during the holocaust. And. 2. They don't proselytize. No religion, persecuted or not, will grow very much if it doesn't proselytize and try to convert others.

    All that is neither here nor there though because it doesn't change the fact your original premise is predicated on the notion that somehow one of the most educated demographics in America are ignorant of Jewish history.
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    Re: Do the majority of U.S. Jews support Netanyahu?

    American Jews are a curiousity that the phrase "the self hating Jew" was applied to American Jews beginning decades ago.

    Other than a past ethnic/racial connection, American Jews have virtually no linkage to Jews in Israel or anywhere else in the world. The history of American Jews for nearly all pre-date 1924 nor did they come from the ME or Palestine. Nearly all came from Europe.

    So their understanding of the oppression and dangers Jews elsewhere is something they can only read in history books the same as anyone else - and there is on familiar consciousness even history to Israel whatsoever.

    Unlike American blacks, most of whom can trace their ancestry to slavery and then extreme oppression into recent USA history, American Jews have no such history in the USA nor such stories of oppression from their grandparents who also were Americans - and without the oppression blacks faced.



    Simply put, American Jews are fully Americanized, just like Americans whose ancestors came from Ireland, Eastern Europe, and so forth.

    Israel was not founded by American Jews. It was founded foremost by European, Middle Eastern and Russian Jews, with a few from elsewhere. American Jews had no need to flee for their lives to Israel. The ancestors of and many still living Jews in Israel did. Israel was their lifeboat - and a boat they can never leave. A tiny boat and intensely hated - as always - by people all over the world - and some people on this forum of course.

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    Re: Do the majority of U.S. Jews support Netanyahu?

    Quote Originally Posted by SouthernDemocrat View Post
    I understand all of that. As does any literate person with any historical knowledge at all. However it doesn't change the fact that primarily the reasons why there are not that many Jews in the world is the fact that: 1. They were decimated during the holocaust. And. 2. They don't proselytize. No religion, persecuted or not, will grow very much if it doesn't proselytize and try to convert others.

    All that is neither here nor there though because it doesn't change the fact your original premise is predicated on the notion that somehow one of the most educated demographics in America are ignorant of Jewish history.
    Once again, no. Yes, those are TWO reasons. But you leave off the millions and millions of Jews otherwise killed for being Jewish. Across the ages far more Jews have been murdered for being Jewish than in the holocaust. THAT MEANT NO MORE GENERATIONS OF JEWISH CHILDREN.

    The most recent and mass organized Nazi holocaust does not define primary reason for the current number of ethnic Jews.

    "Knowledge" in a book learning sense versus "knowledge" in an emotional experience sense are entirely different matters. It is possible that you know more about the history of events between white people and Native Americans than I do. Yet I am the latter. So, then do you have stronger and more emotional senses about the topic than I do? That seems your claim - that fact knowledge equates to emotional dedication and motivation. It doesn't.

    Muslim clerics who call for killing Jews likely know more of Jewish history in relation to Israel than do American Jews. That does not equate to those clerics having greater support of Israeli Jews, does it?

    It is NOT fact-knowledge that matters. It is experience and emointional knowledge that matters - and American Jews have virtually none of the latter.

    There is NO call being made to kill American Jews, so there is no direct emotional reason for American Jews to care one iota what happens to Israel, anymore than Irish immigrants to the USA generations ago have any emotional reason to care what happens to Ireland. If every Jew in Israel was killed it would have no direct effect on at least 90+% of American Jews. What life or even family experience do American Jews have with the Jews who fled to Israel?

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    Re: Do the majority of U.S. Jews support Netanyahu?

    Quote Originally Posted by MildSteel View Post
    I don't think that Netanyahu has the support of the majority of Jews in the U.S., especially among the younger generation. They are fed up with the lies and warmongering and want a new, fresh approach to solving the problems of the Middle East.
    Give any reason why American Jews should give a damn what happens to Jews in Israel any more than anyone else should care?

    The question itself is relevant to anyone but bigots who put people together by race and ethnicity.

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    Re: Do the majority of U.S. Jews support Netanyahu?

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Once again, no. Yes, those are TWO reasons. But you leave off the millions and millions of Jews otherwise killed for being Jewish. Across the ages far more Jews have been murdered for being Jewish than in the holocaust. THAT MEANT NO MORE GENERATIONS OF JEWISH CHILDREN.

    The most recent and mass organized Nazi holocaust does not define primary reason for the current number of ethnic Jews.

    "Knowledge" in a book learning sense versus "knowledge" in an emotional experience sense are entirely different matters. It is possible that you know more about the history of events between white people and Native Americans than I do. Yet I am the latter. So, then do you have stronger and more emotional senses about the topic than I do? That seems your claim - that fact knowledge equates to emotional dedication and motivation. It doesn't.

    Muslim clerics who call for killing Jews likely know more of Jewish history in relation to Israel than do American Jews. That does not equate to those clerics having greater support of Israeli Jews, does it?

    It is NOT fact-knowledge that matters. It is experience and emointional knowledge that matters - and American Jews have virtually none of the latter.

    There is NO call being made to kill American Jews, so there is no direct emotional reason for American Jews to care one iota what happens to Israel, anymore than Irish immigrants to the USA generations ago have any emotional reason to care what happens to Ireland. If every Jew in Israel was killed it would have no direct effect on at least 90+% of American Jews. What life or even family experience do American Jews have with the Jews who fled to Israel?
    So then non-Jewish American Conservative Evangelicals supposedly have a connection with Israeli Jews, while American Jews don't???

    Bibi doesn't even have the support of the majority of Israeli Jews. He simply has a plurality of support. As to connections that American Jews have with Israeli Jews. My Jewish neighbor back in Arkansas parents had been in concentration camps. I had another Jewish friend that had served in the IDF. I think you will find that Jews in America do have ties to Jews in Israel.
    "You're the only person that decides how far you'll go and what you're capable of." - Ben Saunders (Explorer and Endurance Athlete)

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    Re: Do the majority of U.S. Jews support Netanyahu?

    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    Virtually all Jews fled to the USA prior to the Immigration Act of 1924, which among other goals was to block Jews coming to the USA. As murder and increasing slaughter of Jews became worldwide, Jews were trying to flee to Israel, despite Britain trying to block the number of Jews coming to Israel.
    By 1938, Jews were desperate to get out of Europe and Britain proposed a small Jewish zone, smaller than present day Israel, and for all the rest being exclusively for Arabs. The Jewish Council agreed, but Palestinian Muslims riots, demanding that Jews do not have 1 inch of land and instead that Jews be evicted. Britain withdrew it's proposal.

    This left nowhere for European Jews to go, resulting in the murder of 1/3rd of all Jews in the World, 6 million, in the holocaust. However, the murder and oppression against Jews was worldwide, other than Britain attempted to maintain law and order in what is now Israel, so those few who could make it there were relatively safe.

    Few American Jews have any ancestry or direct linkage to the holocaust and have been safely within the USA so long they have no memory of the reason their ancestor's fled to the USA, just like many others of different ethnicity who came to the USA to escape do not.
    Quote Originally Posted by joko104 View Post
    American Jews are a curiousity that the phrase "the self hating Jew" was applied to American Jews beginning decades ago.

    Other than a past ethnic/racial connection, American Jews have virtually no linkage to Jews in Israel or anywhere else in the world. The history of American Jews for nearly all pre-date 1924 nor did they come from the ME or Palestine. Nearly all came from Europe.

    So their understanding of the oppression and dangers Jews elsewhere is something they can only read in history books the same as anyone else - and there is on familiar consciousness even history to Israel whatsoever.

    Unlike American blacks, most of whom can trace their ancestry to slavery and then extreme oppression into recent USA history, American Jews have no such history in the USA nor such stories of oppression from their grandparents who also were Americans - and without the oppression blacks faced.



    Simply put, American Jews are fully Americanized, just like Americans whose ancestors came from Ireland, Eastern Europe, and so forth.

    Israel was not founded by American Jews. It was founded foremost by European, Middle Eastern and Russian Jews, with a few from elsewhere. American Jews had no need to flee for their lives to Israel. The ancestors of and many still living Jews in Israel did. Israel was their lifeboat - and a boat they can never leave. A tiny boat and intensely hated - as always - by people all over the world - and some people on this forum of course.
    I disagree. Although it may be true that most American Jews arrived before the Nazis took power, many experienced plenty of mistreatment and pogroms, others foresaw what was coming with the Nazis, and many left behind relatives that didn't survive the holocaust. In addition there has always been plenty of anti-Jewish bigotry in the USA, especially before the mid-1960s. Many (perhaps most) Jews have been in situations where Christians don't know they are Jewish and start talking freely about their hatred and/or jealousy. There are always a couple of incidents of anti-Jewish violence in the USA every year. That is why nearly all Jews, secular or not, are aware that they are always at risk for being targets of scapegoating. It is an essential part of Jewish culture. For some, those experiences made them strong supporters of a militant Israel. For others, those experiences made them strong opponents of all kinds of hatred, bigotry and discrimination, including against Palestinians. It also should be remembered that the Zionist movement was never popular with all Jews.

    People who pay attention and read between the lines know that much of the purported support for Israel among fundamentalist Christians and other militaristic conservatives is really about fulfilling Biblical prophecy for an armageddon, increasing the USA's power over the middle east and general hatred of Muslims.
    Last edited by Hard Truth; 04-02-15 at 01:30 PM.

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