View Poll Results: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

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  • Yes

    108 49.77%
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    70 32.26%
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    26 11.98%
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    13 5.99%
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Thread: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?[W:296, 650]

  1. #811
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    Another wacko link, and again, attacking Hezbollah is not the same as supporting the Sunnis.

    21st Century Wire | Bio
    ----------------
    RE: "....attacking Hezbollah is not the same as supporting the Sunnis."

    .....but supporting Iran is supporting terrorism......Which is it?


    Anyway, the evasive tactic of dismissing ANY and EVERY Independent source as "whacko" or "conspiracy" is a tiresome, & dishonest old ploy straight out of the "Hasbara Handbook"

    What is most important is if a source is telling the truth

    “...Israel’s crumbling media war”
    2014 - Salon.com

    EXCERPT "The U.S. political elite, the elite in Israel and the owners of the corporate media share a set of common economic and political interests that ensures that pro-Israeli propaganda dominates in the establishment media.
    Should journalists and media organizations break from the script, various pro-Israeli groups, such as CAMERA, generate flack and bring enough pressure to bear on editors and reporters that they are brought back in line.

    The dynamic at work is as follows: First, independent media have played a crucial role in countering Israeli propaganda and offering alternative accounts.

    Second, social media have provided a forum from which independent journalism, as well as first-hand reports from Palestinian people in Gaza, are circulated.

    Third, in these spaces Israel is losing the propaganda war, despite its vast resources of misinformation experts.

    Fourth, grassroots activists using social media have been able to bring pressure to bear on the establishment media.

    Fifth, this climate has enabled establishment journalists on the ground to be more forthcoming about the horrors of what is happening in Gaza.

    Despite the serious intimidation faced by journalists,... such pressure seems to be working less and less. While ... a vigilant social media sphere combined with mass protests around the world has created a climate where if media institutions are to retain their credibility they have to at least appear to be balanced.”CONTINUED



    The truth is that Israel is supporting the same "Terrorists" that are beheading individuals & Balkanizing the Mid East

  2. #812
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    Another wacko link, and again, attacking Hezbollah is not the same as supporting the Sunnis.

    21st Century Wire | Bio
    Very true. A rotten apple is still very different from a rotten orange.
    To do evil, a human being must first of all believe that what hes doing is good" - Solzhenitsyn

    "...with the terrorists, you have to take out their families." - Donald Trump

  3. #813
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    I don't see how the US has justifiable say in the matter and will just be ignored anyway
    If, under another president, the United States were to decide to destroy Iran's nuclear weapons facilities, what anyone chose to ignore would not matter. Several technical studies of the force required show that a fraction of this country's air and naval power could destroy every one of them, as well as Iran's air defenses, and its ballistic missile sites and production facilities, in one fell swoop. A single aircraft with a few 2,000-lb. bombs could destroy the heavy water/plutonium facility at Arak, for example.

    Your remark makes about as much sense as claiming that the U.S. had no justifiable say in whether atom bombs were dropped Japanese cities, and that Japan would just ignore it anyway.

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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by matchlight View Post
    If, under another president, the United States were to decide to destroy Iran's nuclear weapons facilities, what anyone chose to ignore would not matter. Several technical studies of the force required show that a fraction of this country's air and naval power could destroy every one of them, as well as Iran's air defenses, and its ballistic missile sites and production facilities, in one fell swoop. A single aircraft with a few 2,000-lb. bombs could destroy the heavy water/plutonium facility at Arak, for example.

    Your remark makes about as much sense as claiming that the U.S. had no justifiable say in whether atom bombs were dropped Japanese cities, and that Japan would just ignore it anyway.
    - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    Would you mind posting the publications/sources that claimed:

    "Several technical studies of the force required show that a fraction of this country's air and naval power could destroy every one of them, as well as Iran's air defenses, and its ballistic missile sites and production facilities, in one fell swoop."


    Thanks

  5. #815
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by B'smith View Post
    ----------------
    RE: "....attacking Hezbollah is not the same as supporting the Sunnis."

    .....but supporting Iran is supporting terrorism......Which is it?


    Anyway, the evasive tactic of dismissing ANY and EVERY Independent source as "whacko" or "conspiracy" is a tiresome, & dishonest old ploy straight out of the "Hasbara Handbook"

    What is most important is if a source is telling the truth

    “...Israel’s crumbling media war”
    2014 - Salon.com

    EXCERPT "The U.S. political elite, the elite in Israel and the owners of the corporate media share a set of common economic and political interests that ensures that pro-Israeli propaganda dominates in the establishment media.
    Should journalists and media organizations break from the script, various pro-Israeli groups, such as CAMERA, generate flack and bring enough pressure to bear on editors and reporters that they are brought back in line.

    The dynamic at work is as follows: First, independent media have played a crucial role in countering Israeli propaganda and offering alternative accounts.

    Second, social media have provided a forum from which independent journalism, as well as first-hand reports from Palestinian people in Gaza, are circulated.

    Third, in these spaces Israel is losing the propaganda war, despite its vast resources of misinformation experts.

    Fourth, grassroots activists using social media have been able to bring pressure to bear on the establishment media.

    Fifth, this climate has enabled establishment journalists on the ground to be more forthcoming about the horrors of what is happening in Gaza.

    Despite the serious intimidation faced by journalists,... such pressure seems to be working less and less. While ... a vigilant social media sphere combined with mass protests around the world has created a climate where if media institutions are to retain their credibility they have to at least appear to be balanced.”CONTINUED



    The truth is that Israel is supporting the same "Terrorists" that are beheading individuals & Balkanizing the Mid East
    Iran supports terrorism. They don't need our help.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

  6. #816
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by B'smith View Post
    - - - - - - - - - - - - -

    Would you mind posting the publications/sources that claimed:

    "Several technical studies of the force required show that a fraction of this country's air and naval power could destroy every one of them, as well as Iran's air defenses, and its ballistic missile sites and production facilities, in one fell swoop."


    Thanks
    http://csis.org/files/publication/12...ve_Strikes.pdf

    Here is one of them from 2012, from a well-regarded military analyst. I don't think the analysis has changed significantly since then. Cordesman had done similar studies before this, and both those and others I have seen over the years assumed somewhat different tactics. In particular, I question whether two B-2's would need to be assigned to each of the five main nuclear weapons facilities. That would be well over half the total number of B-2's the U.S. has available at a given time, and at least three times as many as the U.S. has ever used at once.

    I also question whether strike planners would rely so heavily on manned aircraft to do what would probably be the very first task in any strike--incapacitating Iran's air defense network. Cruise missiles have been proven to be effective against aircraft in the open, runways, control towers, barracks, fuel tanks, and electric generating stations, as well as anti-aircraft missiles and the radars, control centers, communication cables, etc. they rely on. They do not put air crews in harm's way, can be launched from ships or subs 1,000 miles away, and are very hard to detect or defend against. There are probably some air defense targets it's better to attack with fighter-bombers--either because a cruise missile's 1,000 lb. warhead is not strong enough to destroy them, or for some other reason--but I would think the missiles could play a big part in the very first stages of an attack.

    The most striking things about this analysis, to me, is that it considers that a strike by Israel might need to use nuclear weapons. The reason is that while the U.S. has a 30,000 lb. bomb capable of destroying the deeply buried centrifuge galleries at Fordow and the B-2's to deliver it, the heaviest ones Israel has are 5,000 lb. That is the largest single bomb its most capable aircraft, its 25 F-15-I's, can carry--but it probably would not be powerful enough to do the job on Fordow. But I am sure Israel will use whatever force is necessary to keep Tehran from getting the bomb, if the U.S. does not act. If there were absolutely no other way to destroy those centrifuges but to use a nuclear-armed missile, I think it would. It would put its survival first, and let other nations condemn as long and loud as they liked. Because the weapon would need to detonate at ground level, it would throw up huge amounts of irradiated soil. That would then drift back down as "fallout" that would be very harmful to anyone living downwind.
    Last edited by matchlight; 05-08-15 at 06:11 PM.

  7. #817
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    Very true. A rotten apple is still very different from a rotten orange.
    Anyone that holds an opposing view is a wacko link. Think Faux News.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  8. #818
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Montecresto View Post
    Anyone that holds an opposing view is a wacko link. Think Faux News.

    Only those offering fantasy narratives.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

  9. #819
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    Only those offering fantasy narratives.
    As I referenced.
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  10. #820
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Do America and Israel have a right to nuclear weapons?

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