View Poll Results: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

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  • Yes

    108 49.77%
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    70 32.26%
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    26 11.98%
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    13 5.99%
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Thread: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?[W:296, 650]

  1. #711
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    Boo Radley's Avatar
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Empirica View Post
    Unfortunately for you "nothing new" is more than enough; because it is what it is!
    The point is that as this has been rejected, it doesn't help to repeat it.

    What an incredible crock of absolute poo-poo; Boo!

    Most Americans have always preferred their leaders make wartime military lives a priority over enemy civilian casualties_

    Especially when said war was initiated with a massive sneak attack by a ruthless enemy before it issued a Declaration of War!
    I don't know if that is really true. I'd love to see a poll. But such a popularity things doesn't matter in whether something is right or wrong. So while I get the strong emotion over Pearl Harbor, such emotion doesn't justify all evil. How would you feel if Iraq dropped the bomb here in response to invading Iraq?


    Preventing an estimated one million American casualties absolutely "justify the means" and anyone who has ever served or had a friend or loved one in the military knows this!
    That is the claim, but not something we can factually prove. There are other opinions on that, you know.

    And the fact that you can actually compare the United States to a bunch of radical psycho Islamic terrorists only demonstrates your warped sense of priority!
    Not exactly what I'm doing. I'm comparing your argument with theirs. That's different. Evil is evil no matter who does it. And quite frankly, it can be found in every group of people ever.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  2. #712
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    No they really don't. Winning doesn't make that so either. And I say it because it's true.
    There is no episode in history in which the losing government in a war consoled its people by reminding them of their fair play. Victory trumps everything else.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

  3. #713
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    There is no episode in history in which the losing government in a war consoled its people by reminding them of their fair play. Victory trumps everything else.
    That's not the point. The point is such doesn't make evil honorable. Evil is still evil. That we may lack a moral center, as you argue, is besides the point.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  4. #714
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    That's not the point. The point is such doesn't make evil honorable. Evil is still evil. That we may lack a moral center, as you argue, is besides the point.
    It is the only point. What you call a moral center today would have been incomprehensible 1,000 years ago (even 500) and will be incomprehensible 1,000 years in the future (probably 500). We are all formed by the things we protect, the enemies we face and the times in which we live.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

  5. #715
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    It is the only point. What you call a moral center today would have been incomprehensible 1,000 years ago (even 500) and will be incomprehensible 1,000 years in the future (probably 500). We are all formed by the things we protect, the enemies we face and the times in which we live.
    Yes...and no. Depends not just upon the society and the culture, but also upon certain aspects of each society and culture, for there are moral centers of the past that are not too different from our own today. For instance, Xenophon shows how homosexuality was accepted as normal in ancient Greece, yet women did not AFAIK have a right to vote in the Greek democracy.
    “To do evil, a human being must first of all believe that what he’s doing is good" - Solzhenitsyn

    "...with the terrorists, you have to take out their families." - Donald Trump

  6. #716
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Glen Contrarian View Post
    Yes...and no. Depends not just upon the society and the culture, but also upon certain aspects of each society and culture, for there are moral centers of the past that are not too different from our own today. For instance, Xenophon shows how homosexuality was accepted as normal in ancient Greece, yet women did not AFAIK have a right to vote in the Greek democracy.
    I would never argue there are not points of coincidence down through the ages. Human nature is a constant even if "moral centers" are not. I hope you are having a good spring.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

  7. #717
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    It is the only point. What you call a moral center today would have been incomprehensible 1,000 years ago (even 500) and will be incomprehensible 1,000 years in the future (probably 500). We are all formed by the things we protect, the enemies we face and the times in which we live.
    I doubt it. 1,000 years ago we couldn't kill 100's of thousands of people in an instant. Death of that magnitude may well have horrified them, as it should us. if you have no moral center, you are at best amoral. As such, people can claim no moral ground or belief if they have no morals to start with.

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  8. #718
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    I doubt it. 1,000 years ago we couldn't kill 100's of thousands of people in an instant. Death of that magnitude may well have horrified them, as it should us. if you have no moral center, you are at best amoral. As such, people can claim no moral ground or belief if they have no morals to start with.
    True. In the pre-industrial era the work of many hands was required to do what our technology does today.

    Arnaud Amalric - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arnaud_Amalric

    ("Kill them. For the Lord knows those that are His own.") ... them that are His.). This is the origin of the modern phrase, "Kill them all and let God sort them out.".

    In 1204, he was named a papal legate and inquisitor and was sent by Innocent III with Peter of Castelnau and Arnoul to attempt the conversion of the Albigensians. Failing in this, he distinguished himself by the zeal with which he incited men by his preaching to the crusade against them. He was in charge of the crusader army that sacked Béziers in 1209.[2] There, according to the Cistercian writer Caesar of Heisterbach (real name Caesarius), Arnaul Amalric supposedly responded when asked by a Crusader how to distinguish the Cathars from the Catholics,
    Caedite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius (Kill them all. For the Lord knoweth them that are His.).[3]
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

  9. #719
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hays View Post
    True. In the pre-industrial era the work of many hands was required to do what our technology does today.

    Arnaud Amalric - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arnaud_Amalric

    ("Kill them. For the Lord knows those that are His own.") ... them that are His.). This is the origin of the modern phrase, "Kill them all and let God sort them out.".

    In 1204, he was named a papal legate and inquisitor and was sent by Innocent III with Peter of Castelnau and Arnoul to attempt the conversion of the Albigensians. Failing in this, he distinguished himself by the zeal with which he incited men by his preaching to the crusade against them. He was in charge of the crusader army that sacked Béziers in 1209.[2] There, according to the Cistercian writer Caesar of Heisterbach (real name Caesarius), Arnaul Amalric supposedly responded when asked by a Crusader how to distinguish the Cathars from the Catholics,
    Caedite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius (Kill them all. For the Lord knoweth them that are His.).[3]
    You think this addresses my point?

    AUSTAN GOOLSBEE: I think the world vests too much power, certainly in the president, probably in Washington in general for its influence on the economy, because most all of the economy has nothing to do with the government.

  10. #720
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    Re: Does Iran have a "Right" to Nuclear Weapons?

    Quote Originally Posted by Boo Radley View Post
    You think this addresses my point?
    Indeed it does.
    "It's always reassuring to find you've made the right enemies." -- William J. Donovan

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