View Poll Results: Where would black Americans be if their ancestors had never been enslaved?

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  • They would be in the same position they are now.

    3 2.80%
  • They would be in a better position.

    67 62.62%
  • They would be in a worse position.

    18 16.82%
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    19 17.76%
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Thread: Where would black Americans be if their ancestors had never been enslaved?

  1. #171
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    Re: Where would black Americans be if their ancestors had never been enslaved?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    What?? That is pure speculation. Plenty of research has been done to support what I wrote and you've admitted to reading some of it in the past. Did you not understand it or just dismiss the parts you didnt like? Do you realize that you just wrote that with Anglo-saxon influence, the world would be culturally and technologically primitive today?? That is some hubris and arrogance.
    First off, it's not "Anglo-Saxon" influence, but Early Modern European influence in general.

    Secondly, again, I'm sorry, but it's true.

    The Aztecs didn't have either the wheel, or metal working that was even on the level the Ancient Egyptians could boast 4000 years ago. How on Earth were they supposed to have an "Industrial Revolution," or harness electricity with those handicaps?

    Were they just going to warp through millennia worth of technological and socioeconomic development overnight? The very idea is ridiculous.

    SubSaharan Africa couldn't even hold a respectable empire together for more than a few decades. That problem also wasn't going to correct itself any time soon.

    I'm sorry, but you're preaching fantasy here.
    Last edited by Gathomas88; 03-09-15 at 06:39 PM.

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    Re: Where would black Americans be if their ancestors had never been enslaved?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    There were no 'colonies' in Africa.
    You made a specific allegation that there were American colonies in Africa, which colonies belong to the United States of America and Africa?

    Don't lump us and with the Europeans, the Europeans had many colonies in Africa the United States never sponsored one, except maybe Liberia but that was private business interests,
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    No one cares about your stupid hippy logic
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  3. #173
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    Re: Where would black Americans be if their ancestors had never been enslaved?

    Quote Originally Posted by EMNofSeattle View Post
    Ok what did the government of the United States do to impose our will on their society?
    You need to pick up a history book. At least everyone else here recognizes that it occurred. Try looking up Sierra Leone and Liberia for starters.

    But more than the US, it was Europe and Asia.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

  4. #174
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    Re: Where would black Americans be if their ancestors had never been enslaved?

    Quote Originally Posted by EMNofSeattle View Post
    You made a specific allegation that there were American colonies in Africa, which colonies belong to the United States of America and Africa?

    Don't lump us and with the Europeans, the Europeans had many colonies in Africa the United States never sponsored one, except maybe Liberia but that was private business interests,
    I never said colonies, I said colonialism. Those different words each have different meanings.

    Check Sierra Leone and btw, much colonialism was sponsored by private business interests. Check out "Dutch East India Company"
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

  5. #175
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    Re: Where would black Americans be if their ancestors had never been enslaved?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    I have done alot of reading on it. You appear not to.
    History of Africa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Military history of Africa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Economic history of Africa - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    Then you know it was been near constant violence and struggle. Its easier to study where there were western or eastern interaction, because of written language. Much of the rest of the continent is studied via archeology and to an extent oral tradition.

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    Re: Where would black Americans be if their ancestors had never been enslaved?

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite Chaos View Post
    You're missing out the interconnectedness of scientific developments that link advances in Africa (writing and numbers) to the Middle East (mathematics and medicine) right up to the expulsion of scholars from Constantinople into Italy that fostered the Renaissance. European Colonialism (and science) was simply the latest stage in scientific development and progress.
    Granted, the Arab World, India, and the Far East probably could have advanced on their own, if they'd had the right factors to work with.

    Unfortunately, however, they didn't. Their cultures were also too mired in anti-progressive world views to even think to try.

    The West changed their thinking in this regard by tearing down the existing status quo.

    SubSaharan Africa and South America, however, were a bit farther behind than even that. They were basically stuck at Bronze and Iron Age levels of technology and development, with little hope of moving beyond those limitations at any point in the foreseeable future.

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    Re: Where would black Americans be if their ancestors had never been enslaved?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    First off, it's not "Anglo-Saxon" influence, but Early Modern European influence in general.

    Secondly, again, I'm sorry, but it's true.

    The Aztecs didn't have either the wheel, or metal working that was even on the level the Ancient Egyptians could boast 4000 years ago. How on Earth were they supposed to have an "Industrial Revolution," or harness electricity with those handicaps?

    Were they just going to warp through millennia worth of technological and socioeconomic development overnight? The very idea is ridiculous.

    Africa couldn't even hold a respectable empire together for more than a few decades. That problem also wasn't going to correct itself any time soon.

    I'm sorry, but you're preaching fantasy here.
    I wonder if other lefties hold her same distorted view?

  8. #178
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    Re: Where would black Americans be if their ancestors had never been enslaved?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gathomas88 View Post
    Granted, the Arab World, India, and the Far East probably could have advanced on their own, if they'd had the right factors to work with.

    Unfortunately, however, they didn't. Their cultures were also too mired in anti-progressive world views to even think to try.

    The West changed their thinking in this regard by tearing down the existing status quo.

    SubSaharan Africa and South America, however, were a bit farther behind than even that. They were basically stuck at Bronze and Iron Age levels of technology and development, with little hope of moving beyond those limitations at any point in the foreseeable future.
    Oh. My. God.

    And it all comes back to your Christian beliefs.

    If you didnt believe in my God, you were inferior. Period.

    That's good enough for me! Such thinking is always obscured by dogma.
    Quote Originally Posted by Bucky View Post
    I have felt pain when I was in the womb. So when you say they are incapable of feeling pain, that is based on junk science.
    Quote Originally Posted by applejuicefool View Post
    A murderer putting a bullet through someone's brain is a medical procedure too.

  9. #179
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    Re: Where would black Americans be if their ancestors had never been enslaved?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    You need to pick up a history book. At least everyone else here recognizes that it occurred. Try looking up Sierra Leone and Liberia for starters.

    But more than the US, it was Europe and Asia.
    So your premise is that societies that were primitive for tens of thousands of years would somehow now be prosperous and advanced saved for the colonialism of the last 1000?

    Hint-what success has come out of africa has been BECAUSE of foreign influence. If it hadn't been for that-much of africa would look like the more isolated cultures look today.


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    Re: Where would black Americans be if their ancestors had never been enslaved?

    Quote Originally Posted by Lursa View Post
    I never said colonies, I said colonialism. Those different words each have different meanings.

    Check Sierra Leone and btw, much colonialism was sponsored by private business interests. Check out "Dutch East India Company"
    You can't have colonialism without colonization

    The Dutch east India company was chartered by England not the US

    Which is the specific point I'm making, Europe got Africa pregnant so why are we making the child support payments ( foreign aid) we never colonized Africa so I hate hearing people talk as if we share the blame. The constitution banned the slave trade internationally a decade after founding. As of 1800 not a sigma slave was brought legally to the US for sale. We had little involvement in African affairs from that point on

    Edit sorry Holland not England, and it predates our founding as a country
    Quote Originally Posted by Dr. Chuckles View Post
    No one cares about your stupid hippy logic
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