View Poll Results: Should the US military be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

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  • Yes

    7 1.55%
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Thread: Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

  1. #121
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    Re: Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

    Quote Originally Posted by face, your View Post
    This does nothing to change the fact that the majority of the world has a favorable opinion of the United States.
    Lol. What a crock. A DP poll does though!!
    Killing one person is murder, killing 100,000 is foreign policy

  2. #122
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    Re: Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Knowing that the national guard is the militia is basic information you should posses before saying something truly ignorant like the militia have no training. A term in the militia begins with attending Basic Combat Training and Advanced Individual Training.
    If we're nitpicking, the National Guard is part of the militia. Here in Virginia we also have the Virginia Defense Force, which does not go through the same training as federal forces.


    Since the militia has real jobs while not training, we're usually better than the full-timers.
    Only, and not complelely, true for those who do the same civilian job as their MOS...which is not the standard. Additionally, equipment maintenance is not the same.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Full-timers do not train every single day. I know the media tells you soldiers wake up at zero-freedom-thirty, run 200 miles in 30 seconds, have a bowl of liberty and go kill terrorists all day, but that's not the real world. Having a full-time military job is 90% like having a regular civilian job with a uniform. Full timers get little to no more training than part-timers.
    Maybe you were in a ridiculous unit on active duty (if you ever were), but that's not true for most.

    Yes, militia receive professional training. 6 months worth at the beginning, 2 weeks per year, and a weekend per month.
    And how much of the drill time is spent on actual MOS training as opposed to PT tests, filling out NCOERs, the annual firing range, and all the ridiculous briefings and trainings etc? About half the year you get actual MOS training and practice.


    It's literally a greater number of actual hours performing the job, and to a higher standard.
    Only if you do the same job as a civilian.

    If you're a full-timer, you work Tuesday through Friday, 08:00-16:30, and unless you're a pencil pusher you'll spend about half that time actually doing your job.
    What unit did you serve in that only did a 4 hour week???? And my time active duty we went our time doing vehicle and equipment maintenance, crew drills, basic soldier skills, physical training, etc. All part of the job.

    Remember to include the civilian job as that's what we were talking about. A part-time guardsman who's a civilian EMT will need to execute his trade far more than a full-time guardsman medic.
    Unless that civilian EMT is a 13B in the military. I have no idea where you get the idea that even a majority of National Gurard members do the same job as a civilian. How many civilian 11C or 19K do you know????? But even if he is a medic, you're sadly mistaken if you think the two jobs are equivalent....Hell, a soldier in any MOS who has combat medic training (a 2 week class) can do more than EMTs can in many states.
    Last edited by pinqy; 02-27-15 at 10:24 AM.
    Therefore, since the world has still/Much good, but much less good than ill,
    And while the sun and moon endure/Luck's a chance, but trouble's sure,
    I'd face it as a wise man would,/And train for ill and not for good.

  3. #123
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    Re: Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

    Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body?
    It's enemies.

  4. #124
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    Re: Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    If we're nitpicking, the National Guard is part of the militia. Here in Virginia we also have the Virginia Defense Force, which does not go through the same training as federal forces.


    Only, and not complelely, true for those who do the same civilian job as their MOS...which is not the standard. Additionally, equipment maintenance is not the same.

    Maybe you were in a ridiculous unit on active duty (if you ever were), but that's not true for most.

    And how much of the drill time is spent on actual MOS training as opposed to PT tests, filling out NCOERs, the annual firing range, and all the ridiculous briefings and trainings etc? About half the year you get actual MOS training and practice.



    Only if you do the same job as a civilian.


    What unit did you serve in that only did a 4 hour week???? And my time active duty we went our time doing vehicle and equipment maintenance, crew drills, basic soldier skills, physical training, etc. All part of the job.


    Unless that civilian EMT is a 13B in the military. I have no idea where you get the idea that even a majority of National Gurard members do the same job as a civilian. How many civilian 11C or 19K do you know????? But even if he is a medic, you're sadly mistaken if you think the two jobs are equivalent....Hell, a soldier in any MOS who has combat medic training (a 2 week class) can do more than EMTs can in many states.
    Excuse me but the combat medic, 68W, is a tad longer than 2 weeks. Please get your own facts straight befor questioning others.

  5. #125
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    Re: Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

    Quote Originally Posted by Thrilla View Post
    even when this nation was quasi-isolationist, our military still fought a lot of lil' wars and battles overseas.
    Correct. Even when the U.S. was a relative pipskweak and wanted to be friends with the world it found it difficult to stay on everyone's good side. The U.S. was only a few years old when the French, who'd just helped us win the American Revolution, got upset with us for signing the Jay Treaty with Britain and reneging on our debt to France, which the U.S. argued was owed to the French Crown and not the Republic (Quasi-War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia). Next we decided to get a real Navy after pirates kept sacking our shipping in the Mediterranean (Barbary pirates - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia). Since Switzerland is landlocked and doesn't engage in large-scale trade by sea, it doesn't particularly need a navy. We do, and I can't envisage any entity other than the federal government funding and operating it.
    Нава́льный 2018

  6. #126
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    Re: Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    If we're nitpicking, the National Guard is part of the militia. Here in Virginia we also have the Virginia Defense Force, which does not go through the same training as federal forces.
    We're talking about a hypothetical federal law, and so the militia in question would be on the federal level. To my knowledge the National Guard Of The United States is the only federal militia.

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    Maybe you were in a ridiculous unit on active duty (if you ever were), but that's not true for most.
    It's how my entire battalion works. You can take any complaints you have about that to Obama and his budget cuts.

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    And how much of the drill time is spent on actual MOS training as opposed to PT tests, filling out NCOERs, the annual firing range, and all the ridiculous briefings and trainings etc? About half the year you get actual MOS training and practice.
    NCOs show up early to take care of most of the paperwork. All of Saturday is MOS training. The first half of Sunday is PT/nutrition-class. The second half of Sunday are all any death-by-power-point.

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    Only if you do the same job as a civilian.
    Most of us do. We're an engineer battalion, we have tons of soldiers with related construction/CDL/firfighter civilian jobs. The few who don't, like cops, still have their place as we're going to absorb MPs into our company over the next 4 years. Remember the L.A. riots? The soldiers who responded to that? They were a headquarters platoon, not infantry. I know because one of them became my reediness NCO.

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    What unit did you serve in that only did a 4 hour week?
    I never said '4 hour week'. It's a 4 day week. It's been the standard for the last 5 years.

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    And my time active duty we went our time doing vehicle and equipment maintenance, crew drills, basic soldier skills, physical training, etc. All part of the job.
    Then you were in one of the better National Guard units.

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    How many civilian 11C or 19K do you know?
    Exactly zero, my state does not maintain infantry at all, unless you count MPs, which are about to be absorbed into engineer companies as their companies are retired.
    Last edited by Jerry; 02-27-15 at 12:10 PM.

  7. #127
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    Re: Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Excuse me but the combat medic, 68W, is a tad longer than 2 weeks. Please get your own facts straight befor questioning others.

    Dammnit...I'm getting old...it was a typo...I never said 68W, I meant "combat lifesaver training" which any MOS can take (and I did say any MOS). "Medic" came out instead. I just blanked on the name for some reason.

    My point was that in CLS training we were taught how to put in a saline lock and perform a needle decompression to treat pneumothorax; neither of which can be performed by EMTs in some states.
    Therefore, since the world has still/Much good, but much less good than ill,
    And while the sun and moon endure/Luck's a chance, but trouble's sure,
    I'd face it as a wise man would,/And train for ill and not for good.

  8. #128
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    Re: Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    Dammnit...I'm getting old...it was a typo...I never said 68W, I meant "combat lifesaver training" which any MOS can take (and I did say any MOS). "Medic" came out instead. I just blanked on the name for some reason.
    I'm qualified in that, and it's 3 days whereas combat medic is ~16 weeks. CLS not even comparable with a Red Cross First Aid certification a child can take, certainly not the Combat Medic MOS.

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    My point was that in CLS training we were taught how to put in a saline lock and perform a needle decompression to treat pneumothorax; neither of which can be performed by EMTs in some states.
    They stopped teaching IVs a few years ago because CLS soldiers were giving people heart attacks. CLS is nothing more than tension pneumothorax, finding and plugging holes, immobilizing limbs, and clearing the airway.

  9. #129
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    Re: Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

    Quote Originally Posted by Jerry View Post
    Most of us do. We're an engineer battalion, we have tons of soldiers with related construction/CDL/firfighter civilian jobs.
    And in my Reserve Unit, it's also true that most do a similar job as civilian...but you are talking as if that is universally true...which it's not.


    I never said '4 hour week'. It's a 4 day week. It's been the standard for the last 5 years.
    I meant 4 day. And no, it has not been standard in the active duty to have a 4 day week.


    Then you were in one of the better National Guard units.
    I was talking about active duty.


    Exactly zero, my state does not maintain infantry at all, unless you count MPs, which are about to be absorbed into engineer companies as their companies are retired.
    But you expect that in states that do have combat units that they don't need more than one weekend a month, 2 weeks a year because they'll get their training in their civilian jobs???? Really?

    I'll remind you that during the 1980's the concept was that a Division would have 2 line brigades with a third "round-out" brigade from the National Guard to mobilize and deploy with the rest of the Division. At least 3 round-out Brigades failed to deploy in 1990/1991 due to lack of readiness. The round-out concept was dropped.
    Last edited by pinqy; 02-27-15 at 12:29 PM.
    Therefore, since the world has still/Much good, but much less good than ill,
    And while the sun and moon endure/Luck's a chance, but trouble's sure,
    I'd face it as a wise man would,/And train for ill and not for good.

  10. #130
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    Re: Who thinks the US military should be replaced with a citizen defensive body?

    Quote Originally Posted by pinqy View Post
    I was talking about active duty.
    Right, active duty National Guard: Active Guard Reserve (AGR) Reserve Jobs | goarmy.com

    This thread is about militia. The regular Army is not militia. The National Guard is militia. The Air Force is not militia. The Air Guard is militia. The Marine Corps is not militia. The Navy is not militia. The reguler military is always going to have and do more than the militia. That's the way it's always been, that's the way it always will be.

    The claim was made that militia receive no training, non at all, and that militia members are not professionals. That is the claim I'm arguing against, and so if you're arguing against me then you are also claiming that militia receive no training and are not professionals.
    Last edited by Jerry; 02-27-15 at 12:34 PM.

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