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Thread: At Munich Conference, US Hawks Press for Military Escalation Towards Russia

  1. #21
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    Re: At Munich Conference, US Hawks Press for Military Escalation Towards Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by Simpleχity View Post
    The same kind of "civil war" that Putin engineered in Georgia (Abkhazia/Ossetia) and Moldova (Transdniester). The only thing that changes are the names.
    A civil war that occurred after the coup. Putin did not engineer that.


    Wake up.
    Ukraine is none of our business.
    "A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murder is less to fear"

    Cicero Marcus Tullius

  2. #22
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    Re: At Munich Conference, US Hawks Press for Military Escalation Towards Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    A civil war that occurred after the coup. Putin did not engineer that.
    Rubbish. The former Russian commander of rebel forces in eastern Ukraine says otherwise...

    Russia's Igor Strelkov: I Am Responsible for War in Eastern Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    Ukraine is none of our business.
    Anytime a nation wishes to align with the West it is our business.


    Be polite, be professional, but have a plan to kill everybody you meet. -- Marine Corps General James 'Chaos' Mattis

    Repeal and Replace Trump.

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    Re: At Munich Conference, US Hawks Press for Military Escalation Towards Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by jamesrage View Post
    A civil war that occurred after the coup. Putin did not engineer that.


    Ukraine is none of our business.
    Where you are right is that Putin was rather angry that Yanukovych fled before the rebelling demonstrators. One hears he would have preferred the military to quash the unrest. That was his preference in Syria also. So it would sound true to MO.

    But grabbing land is also quite natural to his reflex repertoire. The Russians have been an an aggressively expansive imperial power for centuries and he trained in the old school.

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    Re: At Munich Conference, US Hawks Press for Military Escalation Towards Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveFagan View Post
    News for 2015-02-07 | Common Dreams | Breaking News & Views for the Progressive Community a security conference in Munich on Saturday, U.S. Senator Lindsey Graham (R-SC) vigorously pressed for more western military backing of Ukraine and escalation towards Russia, openly clashing with German Chancellor Angela Merkel and pointing towards a deepening transatlantic rift over strategy.Addressing the conference on Saturday, Merkel declared, "I cannot imagine any situation in which improved equipment for the Ukrainian army leads to President Putin being so impressed that he believes he will lose militarily. I have to put it that bluntly.""I understand the debate but I believe that more weapons will not lead to the progress Ukraine needs," added Merkel, who has pressed for a diplomatic resolution to the crisis.Graham lashed back at the chancellor, accusing her of turning her back on struggling ally Ukraine, as paraphrased by Reuters."At the end of the day, to our European friends, this is not working," said Graham. "You can go to Moscow until you turn blue in the face. Stand up to what is clearly a lie and a danger."Nato's top military commander, US Air Force general Philip Breedlove, also urged the conference to consider military escalation. "I don’t think we should preclude out of hand the possibility of the military option," he said.Merkel's statements, furthermore, were immediately slammed by Senators John McCain (R-Ariz.) and Bob Corker (R-Tenn.).The verbal sparring takes place as the administration of U.S. President Barack Obama falls under increased pressure from U.S. hawks, including those within the GOP-controlled Congress, to step up its military response to the crisis.Pressure is mounting despite evidence of war crimes committed by the Ukrainian military, including use of cluster munitions against civilian populations in Donetsk, as documented by Human Rights Watch."At a security conference in Munich on Saturday, U.S. Senator Lindsey Graham (R-SC) vigorously pressed for more western military backing of Ukraine and escalation towards Russia, openly clashing with German Chancellor Angela Merkel and pointing towards a deepening transatlantic rift over strategy.Addressing the conference on Saturday, Merkel declared, "I cannot imagine any situation in which improved equipment for the Ukrainian army leads to President Putin being so impressed that he believes he will lose militarily. I have to put it that bluntly.""I understand the debate but I believe that more weapons will not lead to the progress Ukraine needs," added Merkel, who has pressed for a diplomatic resolution to the crisis.Graham lashed back at the chancellor, accusing her of turning her back on struggling ally Ukraine, as paraphrased by Reuters."At the end of the day, to our European friends, this is not working," said Graham. "You can go to Moscow until you turn blue in the face. Stand up to what is clearly a lie and a danger."Nato's top military commander, US Air Force general Philip Breedlove, also urged the conference to consider military escalation. "I don’t think we should preclude out of hand the possibility of the military option," he said.Merkel's statements, furthermore, were immediately slammed by Senators John McCain (R-Ariz.) and Bob Corker (R-Tenn.).The verbal sparring takes place as the administration of U.S. President Barack Obama falls under increased pressure from U.S. hawks, including those within the GOP-controlled Congress, to step up its military response to the crisis.Pressure is mounting despite evidence of war crimes committed by the Ukrainian military, including use of cluster munitions against civilian populations in Donetsk, as documented by Human Rights Watch."http://www.commondreams.org/news/2015/02/07/munich-conference-us-hawks-press-military-escalation-towards-russia

    Graham, Corker, Breedlove, and McCain are war HAWKS.
    Why do we tell Europe what to do?Is war good for Europe?
    What is war good for?Why do the War Hawks want war?
    Who profits from war?
    Does the USA need war for business and employment? Poll Question
    That is a rather silly assumption and creed in certain circles. Here in Germany you here it all the time. It has no predictive value, I have found.


    PS: Merkel is following her own career goals. But it is true that the German people are very badly educated in international security studies and that this could be a real world problem.

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    Re: At Munich Conference, US Hawks Press for Military Escalation Towards Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by German guy View Post
    Well, tonight, French President Hollande and German Chancellor Merkel take one last effort to find a peaceful solution together with Ukrainian President Poroshenko and Russian President Putin in Minsk.

    Observers say that if this attempt fails, even Merkel and Hollande wouldn't oppose weapon deliveries to Ukraine anymore.

    This, of course, may just be the excuse Russia needs to openly start a war against Ukraine (instead of just supporting the seperatists). The entire conflict might escalate and it's hard to predict where this would lead to.

    On the other side, just watching Russia win cannot be an option.
    http://rt.com/news/232391-military-t...ussia-ukraine/

    Well if these pics are indeed russian military in ukraine as we speak, it looks like they aren't waiting for an 'excuse'. I don't know what to make of its authenticity, but everything russia has done to this point is completely insane to me.

    It's like these warmongering assholes learned nothing from the cuban missile crisis. A serious invasion would compel the rest of europe to get involved directly, unless those leaders want to just cross their fingers that putin isn't such an egomaniac as to invade their countries as well

    All i have to say re: the OP is it's a damn good thing cheyney and bush II aren't in charge here now

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    Re: At Munich Conference, US Hawks Press for Military Escalation Towards Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    <snip></unsnip>All i have to say re: the OP is it's a damn good thing cheyney and bush II aren't in charge here now
    `
    The neocon, Bush III, is in charge now and as the war monger-in-chief, he has never seen a potential for US military involvement he doesn't like.

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    Re: At Munich Conference, US Hawks Press for Military Escalation Towards Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by Paxaeon View Post
    `
    The neocon, Bush III, is in charge now and as the war monger-in-chief, he has never seen a potential for US military involvement he doesn't like.
    Bush II wouldn't have waited for prodding by right wing warhawks, before fully committing to a trillion dollar ten year invasion of a *non aggressor* and declaring victory after only a few days.

    Russia is being barbaric now, and some kind of response is warranted, like it or not, else you wouldn't see this last ditch effort by the french/germans to avoid getting involved themselves. Even sweden is talking of reviving their "selective service" after recent russian aggression in the baltic

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    Re: At Munich Conference, US Hawks Press for Military Escalation Towards Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    Bush II wouldn't have waited for prodding by right wing warhawks, before fully committing to a trillion dollar ten year invasion of a *non aggressor* and declaring victory after only a few days. Russia is being barbaric now, and some kind of response is warranted, like it or not, else you wouldn't see this last ditch effort by the french/germans to avoid getting involved themselves. Even sweden is talking of reviving their "selective service" after recent russian aggression in the baltic
    `
    Whenever the corporately owned news sources start banging on the war drum with images of a supposedly "barbaric" enemy trying to subvert democracy and capitalism, it sounds a loud warning bell with me that someone here is lying through their teeth.

    This conflict was caused by NATO, the US and the EU attempting to expand into the Ukraine. While I may not agree with Putin on many things, as a head of state, he has every right to feel threatened by this expansion so close to his border. Analysis: NATO expansion at heart of Ukraine crisis.

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    Re: At Munich Conference, US Hawks Press for Military Escalation Towards Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by Paxaeon View Post
    `
    Whenever the corporately owned news sources start banging on the war drum with images of a supposedly "barbaric" enemy trying to subvert democracy and capitalism, it sounds a loud warning bell with me that someone here is lying through their teeth.

    This conflict was caused by NATO, the US and the EU attempting to expand into the Ukraine. While I may not agree with Putin on many things, as a head of state, he has every right to feel threatened by this expansion so close to his border. Analysis: NATO expansion at heart of Ukraine crisis.
    from your own link: "when a new pro-western government took power in ukraine"

    that hardly necessitates or excuses war leading to 5000 deaths, which a russian general took credit for instigating. It is certainly not an act of self defense, not even close.

    btw, i couldn't give a rat's ass about democracy or capitalism. It's the needless aggression that stands out

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    Re: At Munich Conference, US Hawks Press for Military Escalation Towards Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by chromium View Post
    from your own link: "when a new pro-western government took power in ukraine" that hardly necessitates or excuses war leading to 5000 deaths, which a russian general took credit for instigating. It is certainly not an act of self defense, not even close. btw, i couldn't give a rat's ass about democracy or capitalism. It's the needless aggression that stands out
    `
    If needless aggression is your call to arms, why aren't you outraged and ready to send in a military response to the Boko Haram's massacres in Nigeria? I detect Class A hypocrisy here.

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