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National Legalization of Marijuana [W:237]

Legal Weed: For or Against


  • Total voters
    75
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

Are you a prison industry lobbyist?


what we are doing now hasnt worked

so, we can go harsher, or easier

harsher hopefully will deter some of those looking to make a fast buck

yes,,,i am a hardliner on drugs.....and i will never change that opinion
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

Regulation comes in many forms. How does imprisoning people improve the situation?

If we want a nation of responsible adults, we need to start treating them like adults.

You can't strongarm adults into behaving the way you want. You have to convince them.

We managed it with tobacco without putting smokers in prison. We can do it with marijuana.


really?

we cant strongarm people into doing what we want them to do?

do you WANT to pay taxes? why do you?

do you WANT to drive the speed limit? why do you?

of course you can strongarm people in behaving as you like....all you have to do is make the penalties harsh enough that they voluntarily stop the behavior

you ever raised kids? parents strongarm them ALL the time.....
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

what we are doing now hasnt worked

so, we can go harsher, or easier

harsher hopefully will deter some of those looking to make a fast buck

yes,,,i am a hardliner on drugs.....and i will never change that opinion

So I assume you'd put McCain in jail for 15 year minimum as well, since he's a drug kingpin? We'd need to add the CEOs of our pharmaceutical companies too!

In case the point isn't clear, our society doesn't actually care about people taking 'drugs' or getting high. You're suggesting we carve out some drugs used by some people for incredibly harsh treatment while drugs just as harmful and just as deadly are freely sold everywhere. It just doesn't make any sense unless you're a prison lobbyist and want to guarantee that our jails and prisons remain full forever, hopefully shatter our own world record on numbers and numbers per capita incarcerated.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

So I assume you'd put McCain in jail for 15 year minimum as well, since he's a drug kingpin? We'd need to add the CEOs of our pharmaceutical companies too!

In case the point isn't clear, our society doesn't actually care about people taking 'drugs' or getting high. You're suggesting we carve out some drugs used by some people for incredibly harsh treatment while drugs just as harmful and just as deadly are freely sold everywhere. It just doesn't make any sense unless you're a prison lobbyist and want to guarantee that our jails and prisons remain full forever, hopefully shatter our own world record on numbers and numbers per capita incarcerated.


you dont like alcohol....get the laws changed

see if i give a damn

illegal drugs....pot, cocaine, heroin, pills, crack and many many more are harmful to our society, and to the individuals that consume them

i have seen it firsthand.....

i will fight the legalization of all drugs, period

you will fight for the other side.....we both seem to have our minds completely made up

and maybe you dont care if people take drugs or "get high".......i do
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

i will fight the legalization of all drugs, period

Do whatever the **** you want man. All I will say to you is that people will do what they want, and no matter what you do pot will live on past your efforts to stop it. If you feel like being aggressive with people that are just having a good time and enjoying life is worth your efforts, then that is your choice and I hope you have fun with it.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

And marijuana harms people. Young people.

I'm sure it does. I'm sure everything in this world harms us in some way or another. I hope that one day you learn what peace means and not just feel the peace sign looks cool as an avatar. Peace.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

Awesome. At least you're consistent. And I'm glad you have no political power, because that would be quite a scary world to live in. A world in which countless people are addicted to heroin and all other sorts of drugs.

You know that drug addicts are many times more likely to commit serious crimes than non drug addicts?

That said, I don't even think cigarettes should be legal.

A world where you have to get people to agree with you instead of bending them to your will is a terrible thing for some.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

you dont like alcohol....get the laws changed

see if i give a damn

You're intentionally avoiding the point. If you cared about harmful "drugs" you WOULD give a big damn about a drug that kills 88,000 Americans per year. That you don't indicates it's not drugs you care about, but some drugs used by some people.

illegal drugs....pot, cocaine, heroin, pills, crack and many many more are harmful to our society, and to the individuals that consume them

i have seen it firsthand.....

I have too - lots of it. A charity I work with takes in the homeless, most are addicted to meth or opiates these days. It's devastating. But the War on Drugs didn't stop them from getting high or getting drugs. And the jail where I sometimes volunteer probably 80% according to our host are there as a direct result of drugs. So we put them in jail, they get a felony record, we spend $100,000 to house them for a few years, and what have we accomplished? Not a damn thing - if they were dealers, someone took their place the day they were arrested. If they were users and didn't get treated in jail, most will use again when they get out, if they aren't using while in prison, which is rampant.

I've also seen the ravages of alcohol and alcoholism, and in my part of the world alcohol is the main killer, drunk driving, diseases directly related to alcohol use, etc.

i will fight the legalization of all drugs, period

Except alcohol apparently.

you will fight for the other side.....we both seem to have our minds completely made up

and maybe you dont care if people take drugs or "get high".......i do

I don't care if they get high, same as the roughly 70% of Americans who drank in the past 12 months, and the 56% of Americans who drink and get high each month. I care a great deal about the $225 billion that alcohol abuse cost us last year, AND the $190 billion attributed to illicit drug abuse including prescription drugs.

I'm not convinced the War on Drugs does a thing to help the situation, and especially don't believe pot is any more dangerous than the drug alcohol. The charity takes in a lot of people with addictions, but pot isn't the main addiction of any of them. Alcohol plays a major or contributing role in almost all of them.
 
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Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

I don't care if they get high, same as the roughly 70% of Americans who drank in the past 12 months, and the 56% of Americans who drink and get high each month. I care a great deal about the $225 billion that alcohol abuse cost us last year, AND the $190 billion attributed to illicit drug abuse including prescription drugs.

I'm not convinced the War on Drugs does a thing to help the situation, and especially don't believe pot is any more dangerous than the drug alcohol.

That's because we do not now, nor have we ever had a War on Drugs. We have a Media Campaign on Drugs. We talk about it a lot. We throw some people in jail. We are not now, nor have we ever been serious about winning it. We're just wasting money on a nonsense "war", the solution isn't to just stop fighting, it's to actually be serious.

That's something modern-day America doesn't do for anything.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

That's because we do not now, nor have we ever had a War on Drugs. We have a Media Campaign on Drugs. We talk about it a lot. We throw some people in jail. We are not now, nor have we ever been serious about winning it. We're just wasting money on a nonsense "war", the solution isn't to just stop fighting, it's to actually be serious.

That's something modern-day America doesn't do for anything.

So what's your plan?
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

So what's your plan?

Death penalty for all dealers, regardless of who they are for one. Keep drug offenders out of prison, put them into mandatory treatment programs. Unfortunately, the libertarian plan is "throw up our hands and admit defeat".
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

i didnt say it did, or was

what i would like to see is even harsher penalties for sellers/distributors.......minimum 15/20 year sentences for first offences

Some places already have twenty year sentences. Guess what? People still sell pot.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

Death penalty for all dealers, regardless of who they are for one. Keep drug offenders out of prison, put them into mandatory treatment programs. Unfortunately, the libertarian plan is "throw up our hands and admit defeat".

Ok, so a guy is selling pot and you want to kill them for it. Ok, that's reasonable if you're the queen of hearts.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

That's because we do not now, nor have we ever had a War on Drugs. We have a Media Campaign on Drugs. We talk about it a lot. We throw some people in jail. We are not now, nor have we ever been serious about winning it. We're just wasting money on a nonsense "war", the solution isn't to just stop fighting, it's to actually be serious.

That's something modern-day America doesn't do for anything.

I guess we disagree. I don't think preventing people from getting high is worth fighting a "serious" War on Drugs. I choose now to avoid drugs, but who am I to say to others who drink or smoke pot or even use heroin that they shouldn't be allowed to do that? If it helps them get through the day, or gives them a breather, or provides a way to enjoy life a bit better than they would without drugs, good for them. It's their life, and their choice, and it's a choice humans have made throughout recorded history.

Our only obligation is to mitigate the harm from a small percentage of drug abusers of all kinds. We have decided that for some drugs we will allow them to be promoted and sold at every street corner, and use the criminal justice system to punish harmful acts, not the drug use itself. Why is that not an appropriate approach for other drugs?
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

yes....for growers, sellers, and distributors

i could care less if the penalties/fines etc for users are reduced

i want the people who market the drugs...who sell the drugs....who transport them across the country to know that if and when they are caught, it wont be a slap on the wrist

mine may not be the majority opinion, but i wouldnt call it a fringe opinion either

Just making sure. Clearly we disagree.


really?

we cant strongarm people into doing what we want them to do?

do you WANT to pay taxes? why do you?

do you WANT to drive the speed limit? why do you?

I think you're looking at it backwards. The government isn't controlling either of those behaviors. People agree with the law and abide by it, or they ignore it.

In my area, speeding on the freeway is the norm. People in my neighborhood park in an amazing variety of illegal ways, and aren't ticketed. I drive and park relatively sanely, because I've seen people injured by car incidents, and I don't want to cause one.

Likewise tax evasion is apparently very common, yet largely goes by the wayside. The Feds may punish thousands, but hundreds of thousands skate. I pay my taxes because I'm too lazy to cheat, and because I don't begrudge paying my share of the cost of government.

The law can't stop murder either (I've read we make arrests in about 50-70% of murders) but most people refrain because they understand it's wrong.

And I was talking about the government strongarming adults, not parents strongarming kids.

Do you have any other examples? I'm hard-pressed to think of anything the government actually successfully enforces outside a prison, courtroom, or military operation.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

Death penalty for all dealers, regardless of who they are for one. Keep drug offenders out of prison, put them into mandatory treatment programs. Unfortunately, the libertarian plan is "throw up our hands and admit defeat".

Great, that will put us in good company with a whole slew of oppressive dictatorships!

And I think the libertarian approach is to allow adults to be free to make their own choices instead of having them dictated by the state.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

Death penalty for all dealers, regardless of who they are for one. Keep drug offenders out of prison, put them into mandatory treatment programs. Unfortunately, the libertarian plan is "throw up our hands and admit defeat".

That holds for marijuana? You're not just lumping that in with every other recreational drug?

Would you be executing cancer patients that grow and sells to other cancer patients? That's dealing, no? What if they were non-profit?

No exceptions at all?

And you think this is what we should do, not just what is possible?
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

Just making sure. Clearly we disagree.




I think you're looking at it backwards. The government isn't controlling either of those behaviors. People agree with the law and abide by it, or they ignore it.

In my area, speeding on the freeway is the norm. People in my neighborhood park in an amazing variety of illegal ways, and aren't ticketed. I drive and park relatively sanely, because I've seen people injured by car incidents, and I don't want to cause one.

Likewise tax evasion is apparently very common, yet largely goes by the wayside. The Feds may punish thousands, but hundreds of thousands skate. I pay my taxes because I'm too lazy to cheat, and because I don't begrudge paying my share of the cost of government.

The law can't stop murder either (I've read we make arrests in about 50-70% of murders) but most people refrain because they understand it's wrong.

And I was talking about the government strongarming adults, not parents strongarming kids.

Do you have any other examples? I'm hard-pressed to think of anything the government actually successfully enforces outside a prison, courtroom, or military operation.

Force never convinces a soul, but just hopes that people will bend to it. People are so scared of authority, but the truth of authority is that it must be respected or it is of no consequence and no standing. It is merely a group of annoying people that won't shut up.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

Ok, so a guy is selling pot and you want to kill them for it. Ok, that's reasonable if you're the queen of hearts.

Yup. That ought to be the law. I'm not saying it is, just IMO it should be. Knowingly distributing any number of illicit substances is a crime against society.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

Yup. That ought to be the law. I'm not saying it is, just IMO it should be. Knowingly distributing any number of illicit substances is a crime against society.

Off with their heads!
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

I guess we disagree. I don't think preventing people from getting high is worth fighting a "serious" War on Drugs. I choose now to avoid drugs, but who am I to say to others who drink or smoke pot or even use heroin that they shouldn't be allowed to do that? If it helps them get through the day, or gives them a breather, or provides a way to enjoy life a bit better than they would without drugs, good for them. It's their life, and their choice, and it's a choice humans have made throughout recorded history.

Our only obligation is to mitigate the harm from a small percentage of drug abusers of all kinds. We have decided that for some drugs we will allow them to be promoted and sold at every street corner, and use the criminal justice system to punish harmful acts, not the drug use itself. Why is that not an appropriate approach for other drugs?

As far as I'm concerned, anyone who has to inject or ingest, snort or smoke anything to make them feel better about themselves has some serious psychological issues. The point is not to medicate the pathetic, it's to actually push them to grow and get the hell over it. The same goes for religion, people use it as a drug so they don't have to deal with reality on it's own terms, but reality never goes away, no matter how far down the rabbit hole you fall. Drugs don't solve problems, they just ignore them for a while and when you come down, the problems are still there. Weakness of character isn't an excuse, it's a call to action to actually address the weakness and grow a pair. Unfortunately, our increasingly liberal society has stopped caring about holding people responsible for their own lives and issues, now people just want a pill or a patch to make the pain go away with the minimal amount of actual effort required. Sticking a needle in your arm or snorting some powder up your nose should not be seen as an acceptable crutch to help people deal with their issues.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

Great, that will put us in good company with a whole slew of oppressive dictatorships!

And I think the libertarian approach is to allow adults to be free to make their own choices instead of having them dictated by the state.

Libertarians are, by and large, idiots, sorry.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

That holds for marijuana? You're not just lumping that in with every other recreational drug?

Would you be executing cancer patients that grow and sells to other cancer patients? That's dealing, no? What if they were non-profit?

No exceptions at all?

And you think this is what we should do, not just what is possible?

I already said that medicinal marijuana is fine, so long as it has a prescription and comes from a legal pharmacy. I don't buy for a second that people should be able to grow their own, any more than I think people should be able to cook up their own prescription drugs. So long as it is controlled and monitored, I'm fine with it, only because we know that it works better than any other medicine we currently have. Anyone who wants to be licensed to dispense legally grown medical marijuana, I'm cool with that. Those that do not... that's their problem.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

I already said that medicinal marijuana is fine, so long as it has a prescription and comes from a legal pharmacy.

Thankfully some doctors are pretty loose with prescriptions.
 
Re: National Legalization of Marijuana

Thankfully some doctors are pretty loose with prescriptions.

And they should be held accountable for it. There are restrictions in the medical field.
 
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