View Poll Results: Is there a moral obligation to repay money you borrow?

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  • If you borrow money, you are morally obligated to repay it.

    110 34.48%
  • I feel no moral obligation to repay loans I've taken out

    209 65.52%
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Thread: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

  1. #801
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    so, that bank, the one that made a loan so you could be upside down in a home by $30,000, is the more moral party
    doesn't matter that your moral bank sold that potentially upside down loan to an investor to avoid risking the loss it anticipated because it had statisticians and economists on staff to better anticipate the economic downturn than you
    and when you ponied up the additional $30,000 in the belief it was the moral thing to do, you aided an investor with whom you had no dealings and who held your Note without your approval or consideration
    now, share with us what you got for that $30,000 you needlessly gave over to that secondary market investor
    in short, you made a terrible business decision
    could it be that you are trying to find some justification in order to salve that expensively bad business decision
    It's not the bank's fault that the property values where you live dropped to the point that your home is underwater. It's not the bank's fault that you paid more for the home a few years ago than it is worth today. How do you rationalize that sticking it to the bank is OK when you chose the home and you agreed to the terms of the loan? They didn't do anything wrong, but you're arguing that you should stick them with your bad decision anyway because... what exactly was that rationalization again?
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

  2. #802
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by whysoserious View Post
    Did the bank live up to its obligation? Is it moral to swindle people?
    Two very unrelated questions. If the bank wrote you the check and lived up to the terms of your agreement, the bank didn't swindle you. If the bank swindled you, then you might have an argument that you don't have a moral obligation to do what you agreed to do, but you can't prove that the bank swindled you just because you say that "banks swindle people". You actually have to prove they did something dirty, dishonest and designed to cheat you out of your money.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

  3. #803
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    Two very unrelated questions. If the bank wrote you the check and lived up to the terms of your agreement, the bank didn't swindle you. If the bank swindled you, then you might have an argument that you don't have a moral obligation to do what you agreed to do, but you can't prove that the bank swindled you just because you say that "banks swindle people". You actually have to prove they did something dirty, dishonest and designed to cheat you out of your money.
    yes, that bank that made the loan to you so that it could immediately sell it off to the secondary market to make a quick profit, despite having professional insight to anticipate the economic downturn
    that moral bank which threatened ratings agencies with withholding additional business if they did not place a favorable rating on that unfavorable paper
    that moral bank which threatened appraisers with withholding additional business if they did not place a favorable market value on that real property everyone knew was without the true value to support the mortgage being processed
    that moral bank, the one holding secondary paper, and being without the instruments of hypothecation to legally initiate the foreclosure process instead fabricated the legal signatures it needed
    sell that **** somewhere else; no reasonable people are buying the presentation that the banking industry was morally superior during the great recession
    we are negotiating about dividing a pizza and in the meantime israel is eating it
    once you're over the hill you begin to pick up speed

  4. #804
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by radcen View Post
    If you have ever borrowed money from a bank, you probably did... and I bet you know that.
    Chances are. But there would have been no way for me to verify or disprove it.
    I fight against the ignorant, irresponsible, and/or closed-minded.
    This group is the worst enemy of America and its freedoms. It includes, but is not limited to, all Trump supporters.

  5. #805
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    It's actually nothing like that.
    The argument is that contracts include both and outline and a penalty for a breach of contract. In either case, both parties will act in their best interest.
    It is exactly like that. There is no contract for "penalty for breach of contract". The contract is for a promise from the borrower to pay the lender.

    By the way, cell phone agreements are not loan agreements, so the moron at law school who tried to draw a parallel there too really doesn't understand what he was talking about.
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. ~W.C. Fields

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    I know you would stick someone else with the consequences of your bad decisions. You've said that all along. That was never in dispute.

    You are one of the people that will do what is profitable for you instead of what is right. That is unethical and I wouldn't knowingly associate or do business with people who would do that. I will only willingly associate with people who do ethical business.
    I said "I as a business entity," not "I as a person." Business entities have responsibilities to their stakeholders, and that means minimizing the effects of bad decisions that cost the business money. Get over it.
    I fight against the ignorant, irresponsible, and/or closed-minded.
    This group is the worst enemy of America and its freedoms. It includes, but is not limited to, all Trump supporters.

  7. #807
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    It is exactly like that. There is no contract for "penalty for breach of contract". The contract is for a promise from the borrower to pay the lender.

    By the way, cell phone agreements are not loan agreements, so the moron at law school who tried to draw a parallel there too really doesn't understand what he was talking about.
    He was talking about contracts. A loan agreement is a contract.
    “Capitalism is the astounding belief that the most wickedest of men will do the most wickedest of things for the greatest good of everyone.” John Maynard Keynes

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    for purposes of discussing the topic of this thread, the morality of financial repayment, the link should be obvious
    The topic of this thread is this:

    Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take

    You don't understand the difference between a loan and a service contract?
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. ~W.C. Fields

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    What banks are lending money that they don't have?
    Most or all, I would estimate. Here, go educate yourself:

    I fight against the ignorant, irresponsible, and/or closed-minded.
    This group is the worst enemy of America and its freedoms. It includes, but is not limited to, all Trump supporters.

  10. #810
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by iliveonramen View Post
    He was talking about contracts. A loan agreement is a contract.
    The loan agreement is the promise to repay. Period. Whatever remedies are written into a loan agreement - none, I'll take all your business assets, I'll foreclose on your home, etc. - don't change that the sole purpose of a loan agreement is to outline the repayment terms a borrower agrees to. That's it.
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. ~W.C. Fields

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