View Poll Results: Is there a moral obligation to repay money you borrow?

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  • If you borrow money, you are morally obligated to repay it.

    110 34.48%
  • I feel no moral obligation to repay loans I've taken out

    209 65.52%
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Thread: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

  1. #691
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by justabubba View Post
    c'mon damn it
    the name of the game we are playing is 'blame the victim'
    now, get with it
    Bingo. When you default. The bank is the victim. And that's who you want to blame. The victim.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    What if you default on your loan because the banks made a "bad business decision" by writing you a mortgage with payments you could never make? This was the case with most of the loans that defaulted during the bubble. Most States have laws prohibiting these loans that are called "predatory". The idea that the borrower is always at fault is preposterous. The banks were not honest in writing the loan and when a borrower questioned the ridiculously high payments that would "balloon" in 2 years, the brokers simply told them that you would refinance before that happened and get a even better rate because you would have equity. The truth is that in many cases the banks expected you to default and even made bets that paid off when you did.
    I already addressed how the borrowers who took loans they couldn't repay and bought houses that they didn't belong in. Just because someone enables you to be stupid doesn't mean you should do it. Most people in this country did not do what those people did. Most of us knew not to use our houses as piggybanks. Predatory sounds great and it makes people feel better. And sorry, but anyone who signs a contract without reading and understanding is has made a very unwise decision.

    By the way, mortgage brokers and bankers are not the same thing. Most brokers didn't sell their loans to banks. Countrywide wasn't a bank.
    Horse sense is the thing a horse has which keeps it from betting on people. ~W.C. Fields

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    I would say yes.

    Although I think in some cases it is immoral how high interest rates can be, and how money can be collected.

    Personally I have avoided those extremes, but I have heard stories.


    Perhaps I should say more accurately that "you are morally obligated to repay a loan you take if you took said loan fully or even mostly aware of how much you would have to pay back, including interest/fees."
    Education.

    Sometimes I think we're alone. Sometimes I think we're not. In either case, the thought is staggering. ~ R. Buckminster Fuller

  4. #694
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    Bingo. When you default. The bank is the victim. And that's who you want to blame. The victim.
    Any bank that lends money it doesn't have is sure as hell not the victim.
    I fight against the ignorant, irresponsible, and/or closed-minded.
    This group is the worst enemy of America and its freedoms. It includes, but is not limited to, all Trump supporters.

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by DifferentDrummr View Post
    Any bank that lends money it doesn't have is sure as hell not the victim.
    Your ignorance about the banking system might make it appear that a bank isn't on the hook for the money it lends...... But if that's how it appears to you, you should educate yourself.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by tres borrachos View Post
    What's immoral about bad business decisions? You'd have to know what the decision is to answer that. Yes, I know people whose businesses failed because of stupid, irresponsible business decisions they made. They were under obligation to their creditors.
    Well, sure, business failure generally involves decisions in hindsight that are stupid and/or irresponsible, and my guess is almost every successful business owner has made many stupid and/or irresponsible decisions. It's part of the deal. I still don't see a moral element to that - they presumably didn't intend to make decisions that caused the business to fail.

    Banks by law have to rotate appraisers so that they can't "rig" the appraisal amounts. Banks can't help it if the market value of a home declines. Banks always have provisions for loan losses and there is an expectation that some loans they make will default. That's always been part of lending. Risk management is a gigantic role in banking these days. Banks aren't stewards of collateral that's being pledged for loans though, no matter how you slice it. They are stewards of the deposit assets which are used for lending purposes.
    They're not stewards of collateral, but their role as lender makes them responsible for evaluating whether collateral is sufficient.

    Self interest doesn't just motivates businesses. I do things for self interest (or familial interest) too. You don't?
    Of course - I was just drawing a distinction between a decision made for self interest, versus a moral choice.

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by Declan View Post
    Good luck getting them to accept your $1 a month payment and not do anything about it.
    It doesn't have to be a dollar but, I guarantee you the effort will be appreciated.
    32 “Whoever acknowledges me before others, I will also acknowledge before my Father in heaven. 33 But whoever disowns me before others, I will disown before my Father in heaven.
    Matt. 10:32-33

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    Your ignorance about the banking system might make it appear that a bank isn't on the hook for the money it lends...... But if that's how it appears to you, you should educate yourself.
    Your attempt to deflect the point I made is pathetic. Banks need to be treated like any other private, for-profit business.
    I fight against the ignorant, irresponsible, and/or closed-minded.
    This group is the worst enemy of America and its freedoms. It includes, but is not limited to, all Trump supporters.

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by DifferentDrummr View Post
    Your attempt to deflect the point I made is pathetic. Banks need to be treated like any other private, for-profit business.
    There's no deflection. Banks are on the hook for any loan they give you. If you don't repay the money, it comes out of their ass, so idiotic arguments that "it's not the bank's money" are the real pathetic diversions. It's simply not true and you sound like you're smart enough to know that, which makes it more likely an issue of honesty than ignorance.
    You can't reason anyone out of a position they didn't reason themselves into in the first place.

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    And the bitching about that has already started with Obama having already calling for relaxing lending standards. It's like he didn't learn a damned thing. Judging from this thread, about half the country didn't learn a damned thing.
    It's no different than the idiotic health care system we have. There is little more irresponsible, dangerous, and bad for the economy than not carrying health insurance, yet the most conservative state in the country - Texas (I don't know if it's actually the most conservative state) - has the highest rate uninsured.
    Ted Cruz is the dumbest person alive.

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