View Poll Results: Is there a moral obligation to repay money you borrow?

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  • If you borrow money, you are morally obligated to repay it.

    110 34.48%
  • I feel no moral obligation to repay loans I've taken out

    209 65.52%
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Thread: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?[W:461]

  1. #511
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Yes... unless the borrower makes it too difficult to repay... then screw them.
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    A mortgage only gives you one option: REPAY. The fact that the bank has options if you default is THEIR option. Yours is: REPAY, not repay or give them the house. Your only option in a mortgage contract is repayment.
    Depending on your state, losing the house may not get you technically out of the woods. In theory, they can foreclose on the hose and come after you for a deficiency if any on the auction, though that usually does not happen. Some states allow lenders to let you keep the house and come after you directly full the full balance. It just varies.

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by Papa bull View Post
    A mortgage only gives you one option: REPAY. The fact that the bank has options if you default is THEIR option. Yours is: REPAY, not repay or give them the house. Your only option in a mortgage contract is repayment.
    Anyways, live your life however you want. But just be aware, business people treat contractual relationships more like a game with rules, like basketball, than they view it like an emotional human sort of relationship. They play the game however advantages them the most within those legal rules. What you're saying is sort of like saying that a basketball player faking like they're going to go left when they're actually going to go right is "lying" and you refuse to do it on moral grounds. That kind of thing doesn't actually make the world a better place. It just means you'll lose more games than they will. That isn't "moral" so much as handicapping yourself because you're bringing in etiquette rules from interpersonal relationships that aren't appropriate in the business/basketball context.

    Like, here, let me put it like this. If you actually were to figure out a way that you could end up better off by breaching contracts with banks, you should do it, then you should do it over and over and over again as fast as you can for as long as you can until they fix whatever flaw in their contract you've caught on to. Nobody would hate you or think you're unethical, people would see you as a really clever businessperson- the kind of guy you want on your side when you're in a complex negotiation. The banks you were beating wouldn't be offended by your actions, they'd be wining and dining you to try to get you to work for them. Just like the opposing basketball team's coach would respond if you were really good at faking his players into thinking that you were going one way when you went the other way.

    Now, one can certainly make an argument, and I would agree, that we should bring real morality to business. We should only buy from companies that are socially responsible, avoid companies that pollute, give portions of our profits to charities, extend opportunities to disadvantaged people, and so forth. Those things all do make the world a better place, and there isn't nearly enough of that in business.
    Last edited by tuhaybey; 01-24-15 at 09:58 PM.

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by tuhaybey View Post
    Anyways, live your life however you want. But just be aware, business people treat contractual relationships more like a game with rules, like basketball, than they view it like an emotional human sort of relationship. They play the game however advantages them the most within those legal rules. What you're saying is sort of like saying that a basketball player faking like they're going to go left when they're actually going to go right is "lying" and you refuse to do it on moral grounds. That kind of thing doesn't actually make the world a better place. It just means you'll lose more games than they will. That isn't "moral" so much as misplaced etiquette.

    Now, one can certainly make an argument, and I would agree, that we should bring real morality to business. We should only buy from companies that are socially responsible, avoid companies that pollute, give portions of our profits to charities, extend opportunities to disadvantaged people, and so forth. Those things all do make the world a better place, and there isn't nearly enough of that in business.
    Figuring out which those companies actually are requires too much effort for consumers.
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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by KevinKohler View Post
    Figuring out which those companies actually are requires too much effort for consumers.
    Yeah, I agree. That's probably the main hurdle to it. That said, with the Internet it actually is getting quite a bit easier. There are mobile apps, for example, where you can just type in any company name- or scan any barcode in a store- and they'll tell you what the company's record is on those kinds of things. But even so, yeah, I agree that even that much hassle is probably more than very many people will do. Still though, I think that is a good thing when people do do it. Trying to be "nice" to banks, not so much.

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by tuhaybey View Post
    Yeah, I agree. That's probably the main hurdle to it. That said, with the Internet it actually is getting quite a bit easier. There are mobile apps, for example, where you can just type in any company name- or scan any barcode in a store- and they'll tell you what the company's record is on those kinds of things. But even so, yeah, I agree that even that much hassle is probably more than very many people will do. Still though, I think that is a good thing when people do do it. Trying to be "nice" to banks, not so much.

    I have a hard time trusting a lot of that info. Everyone has a profit motive. Even ratings agencies. Remember, those bad loans that crashed our market in 08'? They were given top ratings...
    Quote Originally Posted by calamity View Post
    Reports indicate that everyone knew he was hauling a bunch of guns up there. But, since you brought it up, there's something which should be illegal: guns that breakdown.

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by TeleKat View Post
    Morality isn't that black & white.
    Here we go, let the games begin. Just say you will lie when it suits you and be done with it.

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by iguanaman View Post
    Actually it is a matter of intelligence I'm afraid. Anyone too stupid to see that they were duped into buying a bad loan by a bank and feel sorry for them and pay the whole thing off for "moral reasons" deserves to be a right winger. I guess lefties don't like being patsies as much as the Right.
    Nice way to rationalize stealing.. " I was duped" riiight

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by Gringo allstar View Post
    Here we go, let the games begin. Just say you will lie when it suits you and be done with it.
    So if you were in posession of extensive US military secrets and a Russian official asked you for them, you would tell them? If a child rapist broke into your house and asked you where your children were, you would tell them? How about if the mob is after your best friend, would you tell them where he is? Do you tell your wife that her new dress makes her butt look ****ing massive?

    I'm tired of the "more holy than thou" types. Morality is not a one size fits all kind of thing. Context matters. Lying can be bad, but it can also be necessary and even good. Even killing is not wrong in all situations. So get off your damn high horse and stop seeing the world in 2d.

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    Re: Are you morally obligated to repay a loan that you take?

    Quote Originally Posted by TeleKat View Post
    So if you were in posession of extensive US military secrets and a Russian official asked you for them, you would tell them? If a child rapist broke into your house and asked you where your children were, you would tell them? How about if the mob is after your best friend, would you tell them where he is? Do you tell your wife that her new dress makes her butt look ****ing massive?

    I'm tired of the "more holy than thou" types. Morality is not a one size fits all kind of thing. Context matters. Lying can be bad, but it can also be necessary and even good. Even killing is not wrong in all situations. So get off your damn high horse and stop seeing the world in 2d.
    What in the hell does that have to do with repaying a loan???
    Who's being holier then thou?? Great Strawman though!..meow

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